'I am Sorry' Overkill

[blondguy]

Hey everyone and new posters too!....I need your help...understanding...and advice..

I have a close friend who is suffering with depression and increasing anxiety. She is in her late 40's and has been a company director for years until her marriage fell apart a few years ago. To avoid paragraphs which can be hard work to read for anyone I will use bullet points..

• Every time I help her she apologises...over and over...
• She has chronic post operative pain after a gall bladder removal...(5 years ago)
• depression and anxiety have exacerbated since her operation...(on AD's...for 4 years)
• she is caring for her mum who is only in her 60's who is frail after a botched brain operation...
• I think she is a 'people pleaser'...strict catholic upbringing...nuns with big sticks..etc..

I have gently mentioned many times to my friend to stop apologising to me when I help her with anything...I just need some advice....Is the continual apologizing a sense of low self worth?....Or very low self esteem? I am stuck.

I am a great care giver who can work wonders but I am lost on this one. I am currently looking after six people on a face to face basis...(not on the forums)...but the continual apologizing during any conversations is taking its toll on me.

What do I do when someone I care about keeps apologizing to me all the time? Any understanding/advice would be greatly appreciated 🙂

Thankyou for reading my post 🙂 Any new posters are very welcome to help too!

Kind Thoughts

Paul

[pipsy]

Hey Paul. I did answer a while ago, but for some reason it never 'went through'. My ex was a bit like your friend, constantly apologising. With him, he would offer to take someone for coffee, a drive somewhere. If it rained, he would apologise, if it was costly, he would apologise. If he bought me something and it worked out dearer than he anticipated, I would be blamed. I think with him, he wanted things to be perfect, unless it was something for me, then it didn't matter. If it didn't work out as he wanted, for other's, he accepted responsibility. As far as looking after anyone, I don't know, it never happened. I never asked him to take care of me if I felt unwell. If he was sick, he was impossible, terrible patient. His parents always made him believe he was perfect, they actually used to say he was such a wonderful, thoughtful son. I think he felt he had to make everything just right for everyone, if it wasn't somehow this was his fault, hence the apologies.

Lynda.

[Lost_Girl]

Hi Moon,

Tough situation you have there. Even without the possible aspergers if a routine has been in place for as long as 7 years the other person is going to question why.

If the person is insecure at all, I imagine the first instinct for that person would be why, what did I do?

I read a little about aspergers and changing routines but couldn't find a lot pertaining to adults online. What I did note was that people with high functioning autism or aspergers like logical explanations for things. Perhaps bring gentle and easing things off is creating mixed messages or confusion? . Perhaps a direct approach may be better but I imagine either way there will be a negative reaction.

I would focus on "I" statements, eg. I need to change what I am doing at the moment because I am going through a lot of change and I am finding things stressful. In fact, things are so stressful that I am seeing a psych and I need to have a break from my routines and just spend some time focusing on my health. I will call you now and then to let you know how I am going.

This makes it all about you, not him. It says you will continue contact but breaks the routine by being a call that you can control the timing on. Maybe the calls could even be more frequent to start with to help him adjust?

I had to break a very negative emotionally draining relationship when I got sick (no aspergers but a very clingy, very needy person who liked to run all my other friends down I think to make herself more important to me). I just made sure my answers to questions were closed ones that ended conversations more quickly. I didn't ask questions back. I caught up but changed things from long visits at home to quick catch ups out somewhere where I had something to get to afterwards e.g got to get home to start dinner. Over time we grew further apart. I know she is upset about it. We still talk but she knows we are not close anymore. I feel guilty but I know my health comes first.

I hope something in that may help.

Kind thoughts,

Carol

[Lost_Girl]

Hey Paul,

I am wondering if you have explained to Pixi how it makes you feel when she apologises all the time?

I actually asked hubby if it bothered him because I do it all the time and I wondered if it was annoying. He didn't care, he (lovingly and jokingly) said he just added it to all the other blah blah blah wife comments he just ignores haha! So saying, it is very different when it is a friend you are relying on rather than someone you have a contract with (which is what I lovingly reminded him back.... in sickness)....

Anyway, maybe talk about how you feel. What response would you prefer? A thankyou? You might need to give her something to say instead as it has been a while and she will probably have to replace the habitual sorry with eg thankyou.

Cheers

Carol

[geoff]

hi Moon, aspergers can be linked to having OCD, because he has repetitive actions, plus it's a very difficult to illness to overcome and to talk through that issue with him.
To tell someone to cut down on drinking alcohol is virtually impossible, although at the beginning their may do so, but that won't last and go back to their usual routine, which can be known as a habit.
Once again if he does have OCD then it will make it too hard for you to try and change him, especially if you yourself are suffering from anxiety.
Google aspergers and OCD, and would like to know your thoughts. Geoff.

[Moonstruck]

Thank you Carol,Geoff.

I must remember the "I" starting sentences. I know the difference that makes with difficult discussions. Good to know you understand. Carol, I see you had to withdraw from a situation yourself with your friend, you may have more guts than I do.

Geoff, Googled Aspergers in adults and OCD.can't say he displays the obsessive washing hands, checking keys,etc - but who knows what he does when at his home? he is into "Rituals" tho. (will expand on that later)

He displays certain Aspergers traits that I noticed years ago - can't empathise with others' feelings, anti-social, can't make small talk or has trouble being politely responsive to others, loathes people joining him when drinking alone - same table, chair, same location, same day, time, takes exact amount of cash for exact numbers of beers he has, refuses to have a mobile phone or home phone. He said he has no friends except me and if I need him "I can drive over to his place"(although he lives not that very far, he cannot see a problem with this) or why it would inconvenience me.

I pointed out how this inconveniences others, if I have to cancel plans, running late, Drs,Dentists cannot contact him re changes of appt times etc.businesses, govt depts have to write him letters. Refuses to learn computer, no email.

He cannot understand why this is a problem for others....as he manages fine without phone contact - he uses public phones to make calls , and never cancels a appt or is running late anyway, cannot see what the difficulty is.

I have no desire and know it is useless to change him, or his drinking habits. However I need to extricate myself as he wants me to join in his "rituals" with him. He cannot see any harm in this, it gives him immense satisfaction. It's giving me the creeps,he says "It's just a game" and hurting no one.

he has said life would not be worth living if I deserted him..cannot imagine a life without me in it. Is there any chance he'd harm himself? his world is becoming narrower and narrower all the time.

thank you again for your thoughts......I wonder if anyone else has had similar experiences and how they coped. I will be seeing him tomorrow and know I cannot let this go on much longer. I had a long walk by the ocean yesterday and realised I had already made up my mind, emotionally and mentally to end the association - I felt 100 times lighter but haven't done the hard part yet. I hope I don't back down...I feel so mean! Moon

[blondguy]

Hello Geoff Thankyou for helping me out with your experience. I needed it

Geoff said: "She is trying to restore trust in someone so that her confidence can be
rebuilt, but also feels as though that everything that is going on she
is actually beating herself up for what's happened.

She has to understand that everybody does make mistakes, I do, you do
and no one is flawless, it's impossible to be perfect and let her know
that she is no different to everyone else. Geoff."

What you wrote has parted the clouds...thankyou.......Paul

Elizabeth CP said: "Knowing she enjoyed helping me meant I didn't feel the need to over apologise. " Dear Elizabeth, thankyou for responding....the super kind lady from church is a legend. Especially the way she expressed why she was helping...Bless your kind heart Elizabeth.....Paulx

Moon: Hi Moon...you can post where ever you wish 🙂 I see that Geoff has the knowledge on OCD...I am sorry that your anxiety is spiking again.....I am glad your are on the forums...we are family...Paulx

Lynda: Dear Lynda...Always a delight to read your advice...You said " His parents always made him believe he was perfect if it wasn't somehow this was his fault" You just described my friend 'Pixi'...to a 'T'....I now have a better understanding of the situation. You are a gem Lynda....and your smile too!........Paulxx

Blue's Clues: I sure did 😉 xx

Mary: Hi Mary...What a wonderful reply (and kind compliment) and thankyou so much 🙂

Mary Said: "The bottom line I find is to grit your teeth and bear it. I say, quite
firmly, "I know my dear, but you don't need to keep saying this. I am
happy to help you at any time." Mixed results. In the end I believe you
must live with it. Maybe try ignoring the thanks although that may make
her more anxious. You know when you are a bit down a helping hand is
great but it brings some shame at not helping ourselves. It's the tired
brain giving itself messages and making us feel guilty."

You have a gift for providing learned & wise advice to so many people in need. I am much obliged for you taking your time in the wee hours Tuesday morning to help me.....Paulxx

Carol: I have only mentioned (gently) "There is no need to apologise" After reading all these great posts I will be changing it to Mary's & Elizabeth's approach "I am more than happy to help...etc.." Paulxx

I wasnt expecting such a flood of support in a 24 hour window....I am touched by the kindness of you all..Paulxx

[Elizabeth CP]

Paul The reason you got so many supportive responses is that you have shown yourself to be a lovely caring person who has provided so much support for all of us & inspiration with you descriptions of how you have dealt with your challenges. Thank you

[Elizabeth CP]

Hi Moon, I have a nephew with Aspergers & have also worked with people with Aspergers so I have some knowledge of the condition. It can manifest in different ways & impact on the person's life to different degrees. The rigid thinking & poor social skills including inability to understand other's point of view are classic symptoms. Unfortunately if you crash you will be unable to help anyone including yourself & the other person. He may not understand this but that doesn't change the reality. It is therefore imperative that you look after yourself by distancing yourself from this person. He won't like it. He won't understand why you are no longer spending time with him but you are responsible for your own health so you can function. If you start to feel guilty about no longer seeing him & worry about the consequences remind yourself why you are doing it '"Í don't like the situation but I don't want to risk becoming a burden on everyone else' Come up with your own mantra to remind yourself. Good luck. It will be hard because you are a good caring person.

[blondguy]

Hi Elizabeth.....I knew where you were coming from the other day...I am super grateful for your support xx

[white knight]

Hi Paul.

I thought I'd give a contrasting view if this based on my 6 year long relationship with a lady some 35 years ago now.

She was ultra obliging. In fact when the bugs bunny cartoon came on where there were two chipmunks and each would say "after you" the other would say "no, no ,no , after you" and on it went..I would point it out to her how over the top it was to consider others feelings that it appeared abnormal.

I was only in my 20's and eventually was advised by my father that this obliging thing was very much part if her character and not to "fight" it.

I did that and things were better.

I call then "ideocyncracies" . a strong reaction the person expresses from excessive impulses of kindness or consideration or even respect for others.

I think also these people can be very vulnerable to people that prey on others.

My view. But I might well not be accurate.

Tony WK