Marriage breakup + kids

[dl23]

Hi

So my wife and I met in high school and have been together for 24 years, married for 14 years. Over the past 8 years or so (after second child, now 😎 was born, we have had some ups and downs. I would just sometimes have a go at her about random stuff; money, clothes or food. Then she would try and talk to me and I was too pigheaded and wouldn't really listen.

Now the time has come where she has had enough and wants to sell our new and amazing house, separate into smaller houses/units and rent. We share the custody of our two kids. I am really scared about telling the kids and don't think I can be there for that process. They will be devastated.

I have been trying to say sorry to my wife via emails, text, chatting, video montages and poems but she tells me to stop and that she doesn't love me anymore. She said as I keep hassling her about getting back together, she doesn't even like me and the thought of talking to me or seeing me makes her physically ill. She also said that because I am making her angry, the shared custody will be so much harder.

I have been trying to show her over the past few weeks the new me. I have been calm, positive (as best I can in this situation) and more composed. I would sometimes shout at the kids for being silly but now I use a calm voice always (even when they test my patience).

I haven't been sleeping much and not eating hardly at all for 5 days (lost 4.5kg), due to being nauseous and anxious.

We have just communicated over email and she doesn't even want me to talk to her anymore or make dinner or hot drinks. I responded with I would like to keep doing it. I told her I still love her and apologise a lot for making her angry, when that is not my intention.

I am really scared of not being with her anymore and not living her. I love her so much, even when she verbally attacks me and says she doesn't love me anymore.

I can't rely on my parents as they are away and my wife and my parents never really got along. They kind of caused a lot of the tension and some of the reasons we fought.

How am I going to get through this?

[dl23]

Hi EM and Mr Paul

So I received another email (she has been doing multiple emails again after I informed her months ago to limit it to one per day).

This time she said she has frozen her mortgage payments after the previous hardship was applied without my knowledge and I have paid about 3k extra during this period. She said she got her half of payments frozen for a period of time due to domestic violence (huh?) and my refusal to sell the house. She said "thankfully I have evidence showing my refusal". Well the evidence is me saying for months we need to wait for mediation etc etc. And recently telling her the same thing that the house won't be sold until parenting is sorted.

She also told the bank that she needs money for a lawyer to force the sale of the house so she can get out. I think I need to go make another appointment with my lawyer for tomorrow or Thursday.

I am still considering a restraining order for constant abuse and harassment. And also considering blocking my email so she can no longer harass or abuse me any longer. It's constant put down after put down.

Oh and she's saying she's on forced leave at the end of Dec and knows I am away for a few nights. She told me to stay away longer so she doesn't have to see me. Well it's my holiday period. But I won't bite back. Using all of my will not too.

Can she force the sale of the house due to false claims of domestic violence? Can I block this through my lawyer?

Thanks

dl23

[Guest909]

Hi dl

Nothing has changed, she is just coming at you from a different direction.

She said she got her half of payments frozen for a period of time due to domestic violence

More than likely it was frozen due to COVID-19 hardship. You might be able to do the same.

She said "thankfully I have evidence showing my refusal"

She has evidence of you doing the right, responsible thing. Nothing to see here.

She also told the bank that she needs money for a lawyer to force the sale of the house so she can get out.

This is OK. She is allowed to borrow money to pay for legal fees; as are you. The point to note here is, legal fees are not considered joint or marital debt. Legal fees are regarded as personal debt. Each spouse is supposed to pay for there own legal fees. Just be sure she does not draw down on the home loan; you will have to keep an I on that. Nothing to see here.

I am still considering a restraining order for constant abuse and harassment

Don't; it's not worth the aggravation.

Can she force the sale of the house due to false claims of domestic violence?

No. This is the same old story; just a different tack. Another hollow threat; just like the court order.

As I've said previously, do not communicate unless it is about the boys or mediation. Anything you put on paper could end up in front of a judge if things turn really nasty. More than likely your wife is looking for an excuse to file for a DV order.

At this point, I would hold off on the lawyer until something more concrete pops up. Stand back and see how things play out for now.

Nothing new here!

Paul

[dl23]

Thanks Mr Paul.

Always good to read your posts and your excellent advice.

Definitely lifts my spirits.

She got her payments frozen due to claiming domestic violence and having to pay lawyer fees. It came straight from the horse's mouth 🤣.

I applied for hardship as well due to constant abuse and upcoming legal fees. They want me to call back within 5 days after filling in a statement of financial position (used as a reference in my phonecall). I should be able to get 3 months of frozen mortgage payments. It will hurt later with interest and probably extra fees at sale of house.

I am going to cease email communication (blocking her or shutting email account down) due to her abusing the 1 email/day limit and constant abuse.

Once again, thanks.

dl23

[Guest909]

She got her payments frozen due to claiming domestic violence and having to pay lawyer fees. It came straight from the horse's mouth

Lenders will provide mortgage relief if you can demonstrate financial hardship; especially during the COVID-19 pandemic. You will find that your wife's mortgage freeze had little to do with her imaginary DV claim and more to do with her financial position due to legal fees.

The same applies to you. You don't have to go into the abuse, just your financial position. That is why the bank wants a "financial position statement" from you. Due to COVID, the banks are likely to approve most hardship claims without too many questions asked. This is a good move on your part; you are learning.

Can I block this through my lawyer?

There is nothing to block.

Cheers

[dl23]

Hi EM and Mr Paul

How are you both going? What's been happening?

So I have my statement of financial position ready almost and will ring bank today.

I emailed exW and told her this new current email (I blocked her on my main email) will no longer be reachable and therefore I am no longer connectable via email. Just got sick of the constant harassment and the different types of abuse/putdowns over last few days (well it's been 6 months of it really). So all receipts will need to be printed and left in kitchen if she wants me to pay. I also said no more discussion via text or handwritten notes unless it's about the boys or minor financial issues.

Yesterday was good. No emails. Less stress.

Thanks

dl23

[ecomama]

Hey dl23

Been MIA from here due to my best friend's mum passing away. Funeral today.

I agree with EVERY SINGLE word Mr Paul wrote.

She is using threats, intimidation and false claims of DV.
Ignore. (I know this is hard but ignore. IF she had ANY solid evidence the police would have been involved etc etc).

I would not try to get an in home restraining order as Mr Paul said. (It would take you WAY off course and IMO you'd need to pay a Lawyer to have it successfully passed through Courts. It's NOT simple, it's freaking difficult. Plus more days off work, keeping evidence which is triggering.... yuck. PLUS delaying everything which is NOT what you want).

Ignore claims of her saying she'll get more % of care (she means % of house really.... it's ALL about money for her) re: DV and carry on.

Family Law Courts ignore the severest claims of DV in property settlement, ignore.
(Remember ex demon tried this to get more money from settlement AND for me to pay it palimony for the rest of it's life too - the judge actually laughed at him. It was that ridiculous.)

You're not in Court anyhow atm and the more you stay away from them then HOPEFULLY the faster this will be for you all.

And it's slow.
I know this.

But this track IS the fastest and CHEAPEST way. Also you holding strong means you DO put the children first and your relationship with them. IE getting the Parenting Orders in place first.

Otherwise most of us would have left in an instant.

IME saying you're in a DV situation normally needs EVIDENCE of an AVO / DVO etc for anyone to take a smidgeon of notice. No one sits up and acts anyway with one.
I agree with Mr Paul about exWs claims of DV to the bank.
Ignore.

You're doing well dl23.
Stay the Course.

EMxxxx
NB: The Courts close down here for several weeks over Christmas so things are delayed for cases and Proposed Orders for this reason at this time of the year.

[dl23]

Hi EM

Good to hear from you.

So sorry to hear about your best friend's mum passing away. Condolences 😥.

I am and will continue ignoring exW's abuse, threats and harassment. It's all there in writing should I ever need to use it. And all of mine is there in writing too - absolutely no response at all.

I will just wait and see what happens in mediation. I'm sure she will bring up DV or me trying to hurt the boys in the session. I don't know how to respond when the mediator comes back with this information. I will tell them she is lying and making false accusations just to get her way and get out of the house. As you mentioned before about all of the things I do for my boys (sports, weekend outings). Oh and she's okay with leaving them with me for 8 weeks of school holidays while she works. Just so contradictory.

Anyways thanks. And look after yourself.

dl23

[Guest909]

Hi guys

EM: Sorry to hear about your friend's mother; I hate funerals.

DL: When you talk to the bank, try and focus on financial matters. The bank does not not really care about anything else. You might want to focus on upcoming "legal fees" to justify your hardship application. I'm sure that is what your wife did.

Just as a reminder, in family law, legal fees are not joint or marital debt. If your wife wants to borrow and spend $100,000 on legal advice, her debt will have nothing to do with you. In family law, each party is expected to cover their own legal costs. There are exceptions, but that is another story.

FYI only:

Just expanding on what EM said above, DV is primarily a criminal matter, not a family law matter. This is why family law tends to ignore DV - wrong forum, wrong court. That being said, if a spouse (victim) can prove that DV impacted on their ability to contribute to the marriage, the court will make an adjustment at property settlement in their favor. In the business, this is known as a "Kennon" adjustment; named after the case of "Kennon Vs Kennon".

Kennon adjustments are very hard to get. The victim has to first prove there was DV, and then prove the DV impacted on their ability to earn an income. This is why false claims of DV are so futile in family law.

As I said, it's not that FL ignores DV, it's just not the right forum. It's like taking your car to your dentist for a tune up. DV is a criminal matter, dealt with in a criminal court, not family court.

My point here is; ignore your wife's false claims of DV. Her threats are meaningless.

Good luck with the bank!

[dl23]

Hi All

So I originally got told by bank that I can have 3 months nil payments (exW lied about applying for this as I was told nothing was applied for) which covers both parties/whole loan.

Then they call back saying in order for us to have the hardship, I have to show intent to sell. So they want a signed agency agreement from a real estate agency, which shows that we have locked someone in to sell the house. Not a contract of sale.

I said I need to wait for parenting mediation next week to see if that's successful. Bank needs a phone call by me by 21/12 otherwise collections get into contact with me due to arrears.

I told them I wasn't comfortable signing anything until parenting is sorted and if successful, there is still a 6 week turnaround for consent orders but they can't wait that long.

Is it okay to sign an agency agreement to show intent to sell? Does this matter if parenting hasn't been sorted?

I don't want to sms lawyer as he never responded to last text and I don't want to pay for an hour of his time. He said previously to see how parenting mediation goes.

I now know exW is a complete liar.

Thanks

dl23

[Guest909]

Hi dl

It would appear that your wife is trying to force the sale of the house by defaulting on the loan payments. If she continues to default, the bank will foreclose and sell the house. Unfortunately this is something you should talk to your lawyer about. I would also bring this up with the mediator.

That being said, the way I see it, your have three options - none of which are ideal.

Option 1 - Not recommended

Stop making payments and let the bank foreclose - this will impact on your credit rating

Option 2 - Best of a bad selection

Make up for your wife's missing payments from your own pocket. In theory, these additional payments are "post separation contributions", that can be recovered at property settlement. You will need to keep a good record of these additional payments so that you can claim them back at mediation. This is something you must discuss with the mediator and you lawyer.

Option 3 - Not recommended

Put the house on the market, and proceed with your financial hardship claim. When you have selected an agent to sell the property, the agent will write up an "Agency Agreement" and recommend a conveyancer that will draw up a "Contract of Sale". You can then provide the bank with a copy of the Agency Agreement.

The problem with "option 3" is your wife will pull out of mediation, and take the boys with her. That will create a bunch of new problems as you won't have any orders in place.

I told them I wasn't comfortable signing anything until parenting is sorted and if successful, there is still a 6 week turnaround for consent orders but they can't wait that long.

Once the consent orders (property and parenting) are draw up and signed, it will take about two weeks for the court to "seal" (approve) the orders. I got my consent orders sealed in under two weeks. Once the orders are signed by all parties (you, wife and two lawyers) the house can go on the market. No need to wait for the court; but that is up to you.

Do you know if your wife is still defaulting on the loan?