Ostracised? whos fault is it?

[white knight]

I love clarity. Clarity leads to understanding leading to peace and progress.

I've long wanted clarity in my world of being ostracised. Three auto clubs in 25 years and all three end up ostracising me from their cliques that resemble predator vultures on a beach of insanity. Who's fault is this?

Based on the obvious that many of us have extreme behaviour in that some of our actions and words are outside the normal range of commoners we are seen as different, weird and many actions/words, as they originate from our own decisions there is someone that is obvious to blame- us. Clubs rely on character. "Joe is a top bloke because he's funny", "Mary is wonderful because she always cooks a slice and is the quiet type". "Tony is a trouble maker, always finding conflict". They often bandy around the word "family" to describe their group only to find at the cemetery gates who their real friends are.

And that leads me to a point. We the extreme ones have good points. We are usually extreme where it matters, kindness, compassion, loyalty. Whereas our toxicity is seen as- no fun to be with,weird,trouble maker,confused,quiet type or rowdy not in between,always talking about illness, meds and treatment.Clearly the negatives in many eyes outweigh the positives.

Who's fault is it? Well based on the phrase "forgive them for they dont know what they do" the masses can be forgiven IMO. Yes, most dont want to make effort to understand, accept and support us. It's too much work when all they want to do is have fun. A physical injury/disability of a member is in their face, they can easily and wantingly assist. But mental issues are too hard. Forgive them, yes we can, it isnt easy but it is the only way to move along in our word filled with enough troubles for us to balance in our daily lives.

What about us? If they are not to blame then we are to blame? We are to blame for inheriting an illness?Also for odd behaviour? And for our illness that engulfs us so much that we cannot stop mentioning it? We are to blame for our childhood? It's all our fault surely?

No it isnt. We are not at fault. We  are not one of "them" that fit in.And the harder you try to get in that inner core of popularity the worse the problem gets.You can sneek in though,if you are the very quiet type, speak little and smile a lot. I have a good friend that does that and he has deep depression.Members of two clubs.

So clarity of this is now clear. No one at fault. And forgive them for "they dont know what they do."

[NicoleP]

Hi WK

You bring up some very interesting points. It is so true that people usually make exceptions for a physical disabilities. I have recently had both feet operated on and am walking with some difficulty. People ask me about what has happened, have been to visit me, have given me presents and are willing to help me out. Very different to how I was treated when I was off work with MH issues. However, I was not necessarily willing to discuss what was happening for fear of judgement and associated stigma. So I guess in my own way, I contributed to the problem.

Are other people at fault? I think others do contribute to the problem. As you know, I was also in a club. I was the treasurer. Another member (a friend) became very jealous of my friendship with another member and started harassing me. I ignored the facebook posts, text messages, visits, phone calls etc but the behaviour escalated. After being verbally abused at a club meeting (and all members of the club tolerating this behaviour) I wrote to the member and asked him to stop. His behaviour continued to escalate with phone calls to work etc. I wrote to the club president (who also happened to be his wife) and she chose not to act. The behaviour escalated and I left the club. The unwanted behaviour continued and to cut a long story short, I  put in a formal complaint (as recommended by the governing body who I was working with) when there was a new president. Finally after 12 months the behaviour stopped. I believe that this person contributed to my issues. As you say, we don't have to like people but we shouldn't treat them disrespectfully. I think that this lack of tolerance and lack of respect for others, where we try and make them conform or do as the want, contributes to mental health issues. Does that make sense?

I agree that there are people who we need to forgive for they don't know what they do and IMO I think that there are manipulators, controllers and bullies who are well aware of what they do.

Kezza

[white knight]

Hi KezzaA,

 "and IMO I think that there are manipulators, controllers and bullies who are well aware of what they do."

Totally agree. Yes, forgive the naive but not those others on that short list.

This "club" discussion is interesting. Manipulators are often undetected. Often there is talk between members you never know that is occuring, defaming behind ones back, messages etc. Before you know it the issues are bigger than what you imagined. 

I'm currently at the end of my latest auto club issues. Finally the leader of the group has lost all tolerance for me. This is due to him bowing under the pressure from the manipulators that have thrown so many accusations that some mud has stuck. Funny that 3 years ago when this leaders brother checked out on life I was one of two members that rocked up at the service- out of 90 members and my travel time there was 3 hours to the city where most lived.

This all doesnt make sense to me. And, in the end, I know I have to walk away. I dont need an auto club, I dont need their fake friendship and I certainly dont need their world of cliques and expectations. So why do I hang on? Pride? I think its because I feel that I'm losing a war to lose my rights, to not allow the manipulators to win.

It hurts. And I know from experience that only time heals it. Then I'll have the view that "birds of a feather flock together".   But the hurt will linger.

Sounds like you've had similar ordeals.

[NicoleP]

I agree that the hurt will linger.

My husband is very grounding and I often find his perspective on life very interesting. I often spend time ruminating about the controllers and beating myself up about what is going on. I often ask my husband about how they get away with it - his response is always the same - they are good at it and invest a lot of time into it, they don't care who they hurt as long as they get what is best for them. I get the impression that you are like me - I care about others, about what is fair, about what is right and think that there can be a solution that suits everyone (as long as everyone will work together).

In my case with the club, I chose to leave because of the harassment. My husband could not understand why I chose to leave. He felt that I had every right to be there, and to just ignore what was going on and to act as though everything was OK. He is quick to point out that I should not react. I watch what he does not let the actions of others affect him at all. I wish I could learn not to take things personally.

I am in a situation at work in which a very dear colleague has not had his contract renewed for next year. He has to turn up to work each day and interact with the Principal who has 'done the dirty on him'. He is so angry at the Principal, and yet maintains a good relationship (on the surface) with him. At the end of the day, he contacts me and vents his anger. I am amazed at the way people can play these games.

I read about your situation and I think it has similarities to mine. The manipulator wins because they don't give up. In my case, my 'stalker' continued on and on and on until I left. He harassed the President of the Club until she took it out on me. I often think that we are the easy ones to control - the President may not be able to do anything about the manipulator but can resolve the situation by getting rid of you. Not the right thing to do, but the easy option. What do you think?

[white knight]

Hi KezzaA, oh yes, sacrificing one person even though they are right.

In 1987 my anxiety was at its peak. I was employed as a traffic officer/dog ranger. The unsavory job od f fining people for parking thei cars too long in the main street of an outer Melbourne suburb.

I got a complaint. A long white car was parked all day in a one hours zone and often in a disabled spot. I issued 4 fines- total $48.  My boss then told me not to book it anymore- "leave it, he is a mates of the Town Clerk". I refused.Every fine issues was withdrawn in the official book but withdrawn in pencil. I photocopied it. The word got out and plastered on the front page of local papers. Then council responded that they hadnt withdrawn any fines and blamed me. But, I had the evidence.

Regardless I had severe chest pains and an abnormal ECG and 2+2 equals heart attack, at 31yo. So Doctor would send me back to work. 10 months later an internal inquiry I demanded found I was over reactive but in future all fines would only be withdrawn by 6 councillors, not by the town clerk.

That was the beginning of my issues surfacing. Issues I had had from childhood that came to its peak. So another example of a righteous person doing their job and asked to make favouritism when unemployed and pensioners have to pay their way.

So was I wrong. According to my therapist at the time no I wasnt, however, he said its a grey world and while laws are black and white one should straddle a shade of grey to survive. eg he suggested that I told my then boss to patrol that area of town if he wanted to give preferential treatment. Had I done that I wouldnt have cared. Let him run the risk of being caught out.

In my case I only know honesty. I am not clever enough or sneaky enough to be dishonest or scheming. In the real world pure honesty doesnt make you survive, as it should, it causes conflict among the crooked, which are the masses.

In your case KezzaA if someone harasses you long and loud enough , mud will stick.  Pity there arent bosses around that make the correct judgement, based on unfair treatment.

[NicoleP]

This is exactly the kind of situation that I am talking about. I am sorry to hear that this happened to you. You are doing your job and you are punished for it. IMO we have rules, regulations and laws for a reason. I have never had a parking fine (touch wood) and that it because I following the parking rules. I don't know about you, but I have values and principles that I like to live by - and a lot of the self help books tell you to be guided by them, but they don't tell you what to do when you are required to disregard them in order to 'survive'. You were doing the right thing, your job, sticking by your values and yet are 'punished' for it. I don't get it - even your therapist at the time tells you to abandon your values, to give in to the dishonest, the liars and manipulators, in order to survive. A kind of if you can't beat them, join them mentality. This is what does my head in.

As you said in your first post - forgive those who know not what they do. Yes, I have been hurt by people who have unintentionally done things that have hurt me and I move on. But it is this intentional game playing like what happened to you, where I am compromised that gets to me.

I guess my question is: How do you manage this kind of situation where you are doing nothing wrong but end up wearing the consequences? It seems to me that even the therapists don't have an answer for this. The answer that my psychologist came up with for me with my recent work situation was do everything this lady wants no matter how unreasonable and do it with a smile on your face.

So I guess I come back to the post I wrote a little while ago about being bully vs victim, manipulator vs manipulated etc. This is why I avoid situations and have left my local running club - I can't be a manipulator and I don't think I deserve to be manipulated, therefore I leave. Then I resent having to leave which it seems to me (and I might be wrong) how you feel about leaving the car club - you don't want to leave but feel that you have to.

End of rant. Thanks for reading.

Kezza

[NicoleP]

Just want to add:

It seems that because we have values and morals and stand up for ourselves and react, that we are the ones seen as having MH issues. Still don't get it

[AusHam]

I think the issue is more that these sorts of people are afraid to get outside their comfort zones. So instead of making a decent effort to know people like us, they decide its better to label us.

[white knight]

Hi Ausham and KezzaA,

This also does my head in. I dont get it at all.  Without laws we have a rampant disorganised society.

Leaving my car club is the only thing I can do. There is no other option because the leader of the club doesnt agree with righteousness. Middle of the road mindset is where longevity lasts.

I've resigned to the fact that my poor lasting memberships are a reflection of my inability to toe the grey cloudy line of the majority of members. My attitude or illness has me on the fringe, a target for the masses in the core group and when a leader does not support me, my days are numbered. I say to myself, its only a car club it isnt essential. But my pride and rights are violated. That hurts and the bullies and the cruel seem to go unscathed.

Hence my love for being here. Among my own.

[NicoleP]

Hi WK

I just read on another post that you have been in hospital. I noticed your absence from the forums and imagined you away on a holiday. I hope you are feeling better and are getting things sorted out.

I know what you mean by pride and rights being violated. I think that having my rights violated is often what annoys me. I stand up for myself and that is what gets me in trouble, but I feel okie a doormat when I don't stand up for myself. So I guess my question is: how do you stand up for your rights without payback? I guess you can't . As you say, the bullies go unscathed and that is what we more sensitive people need to come to terms with. 

Anyhow, it is great to have you back on the forums - I really appreciate your wisdom, honesty and input. Really hope you are ok

Kezza