Survivor...

[Jaster]

Firstly, I am not having any of these thoughts and am safe. Sat in my small office, smiling at those passing me by and deep down I feel absolutely awful. Not sure how I made it to work, I'm here and guess a small win I suppose.

I am trying to be very careful here as I know this is such a delicate topic. I will do my best.

I have titled this post 'Survivor' and have mixed feelings and a little imposter syndrome. I have written not one but two goodbye letters. If any of you reading this have been there and survived, its a place and moment in time that you cant erase.

For years now I have thought about a special group of people or a club for those who have survived. I don't know why but I just have. Unless you have been there you wouldn't understand.

Now again, I am safe and for those of you who may be struggling, hang in there. You will learn that these thoughts come and go. I might end it there. Stay safe and you will get through this.

[indigo22]

Hi Jaster,

I think this is a very good idea to have a thread for those who have been to the edge and are still here to talk about it. You are right, not everyone understands that mindset. There will be many in the community in that boat who may benefit from open discussion about how they survived the mindset.

I hope many see your post and many reply.

My best thoughts your way,

indigo

[therising]

Hi Jaster

I agree with indigo, starting a thread is a good idea, a great idea. From my own experience, there can be so many questions and challenges when you've survived. I think the number one question would have to be 'Where do I go from here?'. There can be so many mixed emotions to make sense of too. And it's true, no one fully understands unless they've been there. Rock bottom in depression is the darkest and loneliest place, where the depressing inner dialogue is at its loudest. Making it toward the light at the top of the tunnel can be easier when we've got people in our life who are going to raise us, including those who know (through first hand experience) how tough the rise can be.

I've found something that can take the edge off at times is when someone comes down into the depression  and chats for a while. The most we can ask is that someone takes us out of our depression. The least we can ask is that people don't leave us alone to suffer while we're in there. I hope you sense my presence through this post. ❤️

[Eagle Ray]

Dear Jaster,

Thank you for your bravery in sharing your experience. It is indeed a wobbly and strange place when you have come close but survived. I’ve been there a few times and I am glad I never followed through and I’m still here. No one really wants to end things, they just don’t know at the time how to go on with the pain and struggle.

Be really tender and kind with yourself right now. There is a beautiful strength and compassion in you that is evident in the fact that you have not only reached out here, but you have done so with the intention to support others.

Take good care,

ER

[Jaster]

Hi indigo22,

Thank you for your understanding.

I wasn't sure of the response or indeed if it may have been censored. The reality is there are many people here who like me made a decision one day that the pain of living was so great they wanted it to stop. I still feel it.

That's the reality. How do you come back from that. Its always there.

When you look at your wife who has been by your side for 30 years and has extraordinary courage and supported you through this and your kids who I honestly don't know if they know or not. They know I am not well and struggle, you can see it in their faces.

I honestly hate it. You just want it to stop. You don't embrace or look for it. The pain, disappointments and memories are there and come flooding at you when you least expect it.

Your comment about others within the community who are in the same boat, having an open discussion about how they survived the mindset is EXACTLY what I was referring to.

This is the first forum I have ever openly talked about my own situation. We are all here to help ourselves and each other get well. I genuinely would love to hug each and every one of you here.

I dream of day when I get back to the man I used to be 19 years ago. I had an extraordinary life filled with lovely people and experiences that had me waking up with so much energy, joy and purpose.

That door slammed shut and I have genuinely been searching ever since. Glimpses appear, he rarely wins as he made a decision in the past that the pain of living was so great, he wanted it to stop. It hasn't.

[Jaster]

Hi Therising,

Nice to connect and yes I do feel your presence. Your comments are connecting and triggering thoughts and feelings that resonate. Your comment: "I think the number one question would have to be 'Where do I go from here?'.

THANK YOU...Exactly... 

"Where do I go from here"?

The first time I went to a doctor the next day in a shirt and tie and a smile. He was astounded that someone could bounce back as I did. What he didn't know was that I was physically and mentally numb from the ordeal.

Another referral to a specialist, paper to sign, questionnaire to complete, pill to try and off I went.

Its a revolving door that I am sure many of us are stuck in. 

I would have loved someone to sit me down and help me fully unpack. Recognise the enormity of what just happened. 

"There can be so many mixed emotions to make sense of too". 

Again...BANG ON.

Your inner dialogue is off the charts. What just happened?, Why did it happen? How did it happen?

FOR ME...There was allot of shame!

How did I get here and fail at the thing called life? 

I was given this beautiful gift of life and I was rejecting it.

I take no pleasure in admitting that I have rejected it many times. 

@therising - Talking through things with kindred spirits and those who we trust and care for us is definitely helpful and I thank you for your own wisdom.

My inner voice continues to remind me that I am 'Too Broken'. Its a voice that began when I was very young living in conditions that no child should have to endure.

The universe as it does for all of us has tested me. I had 6 years as a young man where I was literally living the dream. One decision to relocate and build my dream home with a young family put my life back on an old course of despair.

That was 19 years ago and unbelievably as a man in his 50's that voice remains with me today. Some days and weeks it is silent. I enjoy those days and hope that one day they will be more often.

Thanks for listening. I am in a good place. Its nice to reflect and put these thoughts out there. Allot cheaper too.

All the best.

Send me your invoice :).

Jaster x

[Jaster]

Hi Eagle Ray,

It is so refreshing to have so many wonderful people responding and showing their support, wisdom and kindness. Please take this the right way as I feel I need to respond to a comment you made. There is a misconception I believe that some people may have about some of us dealing with depression.

(No one really wants to end things, they just don’t know at the time how to go on with the pain and struggle).

That was the whole point of me starting this discussion. I am sure there are many people here who like me made a decision and took actions to in your words (end things). 

I agree that those of us who find ourselves in this situation... again using your words (they just don’t know at the time how to go on with the pain and struggle). This is very true. It is a perfect response. 

The fact for me is that I wanted to end things. I have been there more than once, having written two letters to my family. I was done. Not for me. No thanks. Nothing left. Sayonara. See you on the other side. 

There is a level of comfort in the moment because there is hope that the pain is about to leave your body for good.

The aftermath is a bit like those movies when people wake up after a wonderful dream and wake up and go "OH NO"!

I do see your point, maybe I am just selfishly shining a light on me because I can lol.

Its valentines day and I look forward to spending a wonderful evening with my wife of 30 years. I know I am blessed and do have lots to live for. 

@Eagle Ray - Thank you again for connecting. Clearly your a special person and I wish you all the best.

[indigo22]

Hi Jaster,

I think you will find that the only things that will cause a problem with the moderators is if anyone is:

1. Talking about the method tried - this would be a major trigger not only for the moderators but also for the community members.

2. Talking about specific medications which is against forum rules.

Talking about the events that led to the mindset will not be a problem, if you think there is a possibility that what you say could be triggering for someone in the community, please put a "trigger warning" at the beginning or your post.

Likewise, talking about how the mindset was overcome (or is being worked on) will not be a problem.

I may not have made it obvious, but that door slammed shut for me when I was 14, I have felt no real joy since then and have been in that mindset a few times throughout my life, the worst time being about 14 years ago where the ideation lasted for at least 2 years. Back then I was asked to make a promise to someone I love (a nephew) that I would not take action and because I keep my promises, I have not taken action. That does not mean I don't occasionally have that mindset try to creep back into my thoughts. The difference is that I am aware of it and am able to stop it in it's tracks.

For that reason, I think this is a very good idea. There is no one person I know (outside of the forums) who has ever been down that road and who can understand the mindset. I do believe that this thread will give some members an outlet to talk about things in a safe environment, all that is needed is to follow the guidelines.

My various experiences are the reason I joined the forums. What would be the point in going through all that pain and heartache if you don't use it to help someone else. I find it very uplifting if I am able to help someone else going through similar experiences, I hope you will find it likewise Jaster.

Hugs back to you,

indigo

[Eagle Ray]

Dear Jaster,

Thank you for clarifying your experience. I don’t know how to explain mine other than, yes, I wanted to end things, but a tiny voice/life spirit inside of me just hung on. I think I understand what you are saying, that it was a total feeling which may be different from my experiences where I have come close but some little, really squashed marginalised part of myself still had this small voice that was just still faintly audible to me. It was extremely harrowing to say the least.

What I felt I could partly relate to (though I think my experience may still be a bit different) was your description of going to the doctor the next day with a shirt, a tie and a smile. After my third episode in 2007 I was driving of all places to a Buddhist centre to meet with people about starting an education program for kids. I was working as an education assistant at the time and also a regular attendee of meditation sessions at this place. My very near attempt occurred on the way to the meeting. I was profoundly shaken and in a kind of shock. Yet I didn’t tell them and somehow put on my “normal” self, like things were basically fine. I could somehow generate a mask that I was ok, I guess you would call it.

The “Too Broken” voice I feel I can relate to in relation to childhood trauma and also intergenerational trauma passed down. My mother’s mother ended things in 1995. My mum self-destructed through her body giving out from a life of relentless distress in 2020. I have inherited the pattern, but what I have learned is this is not me or mine (nor was it my family member’s). So my small life force energy that has kept me alive is a kind of pure essence that isn’t poisoned by generational trauma and my own particular traumatic experiences.

I am slowly learning now to abide with this part of myself. A friend of mine who is diagnosed with c-ptsd like myself and has dealt a lot with s/h and s/i said he has finally realised with clarity that there is absolutely nothing wrong with him and never was. In his own way of explaining it he says there is nothing to fix because nothing was ever broken. All feelings of brokenness have been put into us by our circumstances. They may feel real to us but we actually never had anything wrong with us. I don’t know if that makes any sense for you or helps in any way, but what I have found is I’m allowing the illusion to dissolve now. I’m still caught out by feeling broken at times. My last discussion with my psychologist was on the topic of self-hatred and self-disgust, something deeply passed down through both my parents. Yet none of us ever had anything wrong and our behaviours and core self-beliefs were based on the illusion of brokenness.

In my experience these are often feelings more than conscious thoughts at least initially and they constitute the amorphous thing called depression. I do somatic work with my psych and she’s gradually helped me begin to connect to my bodily feelings and sensations. The more I have learned to do this the more I have developed conscious awareness of inner processes that I now have language for. In the past these inner processes were unconsciously driving me. Increasingly now I am the driver. The shift is very empowering.

Again, I don’t know if that’s helpful and I apologise if it isn’t. But I think you raise a very important topic for discussion. I hope you have a lovely evening with your wife this evening and all the very best to you too,

ER

[Jaster]

Hi Indigo, many thanks for giving me clarification and suggestions on how to manage ongoing discussions and content. The last thing I am sure any of us want to do is to trigger or make someone uncomfortable.

Thank you for sharing more about your own situation and past. So pleased that you were able to make and continue to keep a promise for your nephew. That's a great strategy. 

My goodness, door slamming shut at 14. It is such an impressionable and confusing time in anyone's life. You are often so helpless. So sorry to hear that. Those are heavy words...not felt real joy. Your deserve them. We all do. Forever an optimist and I know they will reappear for you. Sometimes its right in front of us and we just need to pause and recognise it.

I can relate to those strong feelings. I have come to recognise that I am emotionally numb. I ran out of tears years ago. My own personal struggles and despair is so complex and has so many layers it basically crushed my soul.

When I was seeking therapy on a regular basis I have a recollection of them saying...'Think of your family if you weren't around'.

I just shrugged my shoulders. I had nothing there. They pressed the point a few times. Nope, I was in such a state I had no thoughts for the impact to loved ones around me. It's a selfish thing to say...I get it.

I love my wife and kids no question. If I am brutally honest, I don't FEEL IT. I do remember having those feelings they are gone!? Could be all the meds?? Don't know.

Your closing statement, what's the point of going through all the pain and heartache if you don't use it to help someone else.

Love it. Should be on a t-shirt! :).

Nice to have you in my life indigo22. 

x