Men isolated

[white knight]

I'd like to hear from men. I want to know your inner feelings about anything that you feel isolated about. I'd like to know if you feel that the revolution towards equality of the sexes has gone too far to a point whereby you are feeling inferior to women or you feel women are being treated better in any way - just because you are a man.

Emotionally, are you feeling that you get enough support from females? Do you feel women are afraid to hug you to comfort you for any reason? like you'll take advantage of them? Do you have many female friends? Do you feel that women socialize better? What do YOU want socially?

Feel free, talk, let go of your restraints, take advantage of the anonymous environment to let yourself be heard. We can do this and be in error, that our presumptions are ill directed and unfair. It could be our own inapproachability for example that can sway women away from us when we need them most.

Are we misread? I know when I'm in conflict with someone I come across as a little aggressive or arguing in a normal male manner and that can portray someone that is not in need of support but is someone to avoid. NOTHING could be further from the truth.

So that's one gripe. I feel women don't pursue the friendship care far enough. Such limited care results in my feelings of isolation. I think I'm a "giver" apart from my supportive wife no woman supports me anywhere near the level I give to them. Is this an illusion? What do you think?

Two people. One a woman that enters a group, say a hobby group. She sits down and isn't feeling emotionally well. She is asked a question like "how is your day"? She burst into tears. The whole group of 10 ladies stand and hold her hand, hand on her shoulder, comforting and reassurance. She is not alone. They even ring her later and talk at length. The other person a middle aged male enters a motoring clubroom in his local town, his male friends restore cars and share drinks. He sits and realizes he was in no shape to attend. A guy asks him how his restoration is going. He is upset thinking about his car as due to his depression he hasn't been to his shed for weeks. He suddenly starts crying. The men, all of whom start to feel uncomfortable, mention a few things like" you'll get there don't worry". He is worried because he knows that half of the men there actually think he is a softy by crying, to stand clear of him because he has problems, to avoid him as it might upset their own happy day in the sun....

Tony WK

[Elizabeth CP]

I wish every separated parent could read & really listen to your last post. Children deserve to feel loved by both parents. They are innocent & don't deserve to be treated as pawns to punish the other partner. I have seen too many children damaged as one parent or the other manipulates the situation to stop the other parent seeing their children or tells negative things about the ex to turn the children away from seeing him or her. This applies to both mothers & fathers.

I was going to highlight the most important parts of Randoms post but decided that the whole post is too valuable to summarise.

[white knight]

Agreed

Well said Random.

Tony WK

[white knight]

MY TIME, HER TIME AND OUR TIME

As the title says, there should be, for mental health reasons, time divided up between couples free time.

Often, especially when in retirement, pensioners, unemployment, that this ideal division of time goes pear shaped. We tend to get bogged down in spending most of our time together. This is not a good way to spend your life. Financial restrictions can cause this to occur.

Reconsider your time together. I know for me shed time is important and soon I'm going to return to my hobby of model airplanes which not only gave me quiet hours gluing and building but also gave me valuable time mixing with men my own age group in a social gathering. A bit like the men's shed in our world.

My wife spends every Wednesday at a sewing group. When she returns mid afternoon she tells me of all the things that went on and the updates of our small town. While she is gone I spend one hour cleaning the house then the rest in my shed. Some might call it "bliss" but I don't want to get into trouble. lol

Quality time is important together. It costs little to ask your partner to go on a picnic and pack up some sandwiches and visit a lake. Fuelling a relationship take a little planning and interest.

For a man, if he is introverted and prefers his own company, it can be a smokescreen to depressive episodes. I know when my depressive episodes hit hard I don't want contact with other people, even my family members. That period can take days before it all overflows and I can talk to my wife to let it all out, that there is something wrong. This solitary period is internal as well as external. So I'll spend time alone in my shed but also distance myself from day to day home activities mentally. I'm like robotic in another world. Where this being alone feeling is dangerous is that as I'm totally dissatisfied with life at the time, all sorts of negative feelings run through my mind....including suicidal thoughts. I'm not suicidal though, just thoughts that are reflective of desperately unhappy.

Do you know this feeling of solitary sadness? Do you crave to be alone? Do you find it hard to join groups and mingle among other men? So you have suicidal thoughts and do you know why?

I'd be very interested to know.

Tony WK

[Elizabeth CP]

Tony,

You are correct we need time on our own, with friends/ acquaintances & time alone. I'm struggling to get that balance right since giving up work to care for my husband.

I think we find it difficult understanding the needs of people who are different to us. Since men & women in general think & act differently this creates a challenge. As you pointed out early in the thread men can feel isolated & unsupported. This may not be intentional but misunderstanding how the other person feels & what support would be beneficial. This also happens with people of the same gender if the two people are different. Perhaps the solution is to be aware of this & be proactive in letting others know what support you need or want rather than assuming others should know & being upset when they don't. Similarly if we are in a position to support others we need to be doing what we can to understand what they want rather than treating them how we would want to be treated. Couples should take time to discuss these things while they are well & able to communicate effectively rather than waiting till things are not good.

Do you know this feeling of solitary sadness? Do you crave to be alone? Do you find it hard to join groups and mingle among other men? I am not a man but I am feeling this way now. One part of me craves some human company just to feel like someone cares. At the same time I can't cope with trying to explain to people what is happening. I am expected to be strong & able to deal with what is happening on my own.

[Guest_1584]

Thanks for that you two , it's really appreciated that it wasn't just brushed aside , which has happened quite a bit would you believe , but how anyone could brush such serious stuff aside is beyond me.

Tony l'm a funny mix , l could easily be a loner in that way and have been plenty of times in life . l love time with my partner , but really , l have to push myself to be bothered with other people, especially parts of my family , who l hardly ever see and avoid anyway. l often felt pressured to get an outside life as well when l was married because she was often going out with friends and had the family up every 5 damn minutes or she was going down to there's. But tbh , l just couldn't have cared less. It wasn't in a depression way like for you but it's just the way l am.

Well these days l'm on my own 90% of the time , especially since l split with gf since. But l have to watch myself a bit because l'm actually quite happy alone if not with my partner . And gf was totally different to my ex w and basically had no close friends and couldn't care less either. She wasn't into time with the girls or pubbing or anything she was exactly like me and was into either just us or just quite happily doing her own thing.

Since my marriage break up though l have rediscovered my brothers and had a bit of time with them and that l've really enjoyed. Few weeks back 2 of them came over and we drank out on my new porch for a few hours and talked crapola , it was really damn nice.

[singing_the_blues]

Hi this topic is so important as there is no manual in this p.c.society on how to cope with these changes and its a real thing as a single middle aged man now ,brought up in a different time when what seemed to be normal wasn't regarding male- female roles ,personally because I was brought up in dysfunction and mix'd ideas about which roles are right or wrong ,I value these women in positions that were once the domain of only men ,especially the psycologists I have had over the last several years it can give you an insight ,and you can run stuff by them if they are profesional they will correct you gently and the only critisisim I care for is either pay'd for or ask'e for the rest is white noise ,men need to learn how to navigate this new world and how to teach it to others ,I think about this alot ,and part of my wondering's are what would any woman want with me now at this age so I am not resigned but sort of am ,that its quite possible ill do the rest of my life single and thats sad ,for all of us because this thread would not be if we were not on some level lonely which in my opinion is a huge contributer to depression ,there are nasty guys and girls out there just as there are good and bad people in all races ,Im pretty sure a new love would brighten my life up maybe ,im not holding my breath I hold my self literally for a few minites each morning ,have you ever caught your self just literally crunched up ,its holding the self a classic sign of abandonment and lack of support

[white knight]

Hi Elizabeth

You said "This also happens with people of the same gender if the two people are different. Perhaps the solution is to be aware of this & be proactive in letting others know what support you need or want rather than assuming others should know & being upset when they don't. "

I think you have implied an issue with men not clearly telling people what support they need (when they are well enough).

That is indeed an issue and I for one squirm thinking about it- why? Because it is for a man, the ultimate attention seeking act. It is an act that runs against our manhood, as silly and illogical as that sounds.

I dont understand this and I dont have an answer. I invite anyone who does.

So the key question is-

"If a man needs support why cant he ask for it when in a well state of mind and spell out his needs"?

[white knight]

Hi Random

Its great you reconnected with your bros. Just hanging out talking stuff. Doesnt need to be deep .

hi singing the blues

Being single middle aged is a bigger issue than when young imo. Most friends have a partner or teenage kids so it seems less often one can spend time with such friends...they also drift away, doing family stuff. Understandable but sad also.

I hope you use this forum if you are in need. Last week I needed it.

Tony WK

[Guest_1584]

l don't really know about that angle although you do hear similar stuff all the time about men.

l mean l don't have that problem in that way , never have really. Maybe it's a different time thing or what , l dunno , l'm a pretty modern guy although 50s now but never had any problem expression myself or showing the love to my women and much much more , or anything like that, tell my daughter l love her all the time too. l won't tell her if l'm feeling down or sad though because she's been through enough , no problem with gf or anything though.

With friends or family , for me any hold back is more about that person , because they'll probably throw it in my face some time later on. lf l trust them though and they're an open caring person , sure l'll talk about things and often do mine or there's with some of my brothers or different mates over the years. One brother though and although he's 10 yrs younger yet he won't talk about anything in depth or show much emotion , funny thing with him though he does come up and hug me if we haven't seen each other awhile , he's a funny bloke.

l'm attracted to open people that aren't afraid to talk about their stuff, l love a bit of emotion and passion in anyone really, so anyone l ever do get close to is often along the same vein.

Maybe guys that do have the problem need to choose people around them that are more open if they'd really rather be more open themselves.

[white knight]

Hi random

Yes, I acknowledge most men clam up when deep conversation gets too deep.

Do women get this wall when they want to have a conversation about their emotional needs and if so how do you get by?

Tony WK