Chronic suicidality

[Idontevenknow]

Hi everyone,

I have had chronically suicidal for over two years. It has led to a few attempts and hospitalisations. I'm currently receiving treatment/therapy but it's a long process. Its kind of getting tough because unfortunately you can't just pause life. I'm under a lot of stress from school (zillions of grade 12 assessments), my anxiety has skyrocketed and I'm trying to continue functioning as a normal human being despite being very depressed. Does anyone have any tips on how to keep going in those times between treatment and living a relatively normal life or just with dealing with chronic suicidality in general?

Thanks heaps

[Croix]

Dear Hannah

That is an awfully sensible post. It also seems almost like a 10 week or so cycle. You did not mention how long it takes you to climb back out. Two weeks? Longer?

If you do mind my asking did you tell anyone you had started to go down again, or maybe they just noticed?

Your dad sounds a pretty good sort of guy. Maybe always being good at things keeps it hard to understand when circumstances start to overwhelm you. Mind you he can still use that confidence of success to help, even without understanding. Do you think that is what he tries to do?

What does he think of Winnie?

I'm a bit scattered around this evening, never mind, do you find those inspirational notes and music a help when right down?

Croix

[Idontevenknow]

Hi Croix,

I think for climbing back out of it, it depends, I'm not 100% sure but I think its usually pretty sudden, a number of days. At least for the past few times it has been quick.

I can't remember but I think I mentioned that I'm going downhill to my DBT therapist yesterday but we didn't chat about it much. At the moment because I'm having fewer appointments with my case manager, so I'm getting used to not having her to talk to every week as well. My stay at the subacute hasn't been confirmed for next week yet, but if it is, I'll talk to the doctors/nurses there about it. No one really notices that I'm going downhill unless I say something or do something to hurt myself.

I'm not really sure. I think the situation I'm in at the moment is really hard for him to deal with because he's so used to being able to fix everything really easily but with this, he's trying everything but nothing seems to be working that well. So mum and dad blame it on themselves.

For the first 17 years of my life my mum and dad never wanted to get any pets because we were always going away on holiday overseas and didn't want the responsibility of a pet. Dad'd mum was also a breeder so he grew up with loads of dogs around him when he was younger so I think he'd had enough. But, it only took me 17 years of convincing for them to agree to get Winnie. And now they love her, I knew they would. Sometimes Winnie will get on their nerves but they usually get along.

Inspirational music sometimes helps but also sometimes makes me angry when I'm sad. But I'm going to try and listen to it as I'm going down to see if that makes a difference. And I'm not sure about inspirational notes but I'll give them a go.

Thank you,

Hannah

[Aaronsis]

Hey Hannah

I too really want to read Jazz's book, it will be so very interesting and I am looking forward to how she recounts her journey to where she is now. It is a very interesting concept, fighting V's surviving and also how, how do you fight when it is so hard to get through the next moment, I want to find out how she turned her surviving into fighting.

What you said about what that interpretation means for you and I think that is awesome, that you can choose to have the life that you want and to try to be happy and get on with a life, knowing that true, suicide is there, while it "should not" be a choice if it helps you to navigate your way to better days with the knowing that you can make peace with it, in time you might actually be having the life you want and feeling better, happier and like the Hannah that you want to be. I think it is like when you focus on something it all of a sudden becomes your everything, maybe we take that concept and not focus on suicide, as you said leave it over there on the side and start embracing your Tafe and your friends and Winnie and that dumb app that we both are addicted too..lol

I felt so positive and happy when you said you had a breakthrough, not for any other reason than you had one, that there are things out there that we still have not found to make you feel good, so that gives me hope that we can still find something that connects with you, that you say "YES..that is me and that is why I am staying"...I am most definitely going to look up the Radical Acceptance theory, it seems like we could all use a bit of this in our life, to wholly accept some of the good things and feel them and believe them with all our soul. I will read about that and let you know what I think.

I would like to say congratulations on coming as far as you have over the past 12 months since your first visit to sub acute. It has been a huge journey for you Hannah but you are here and you are choosing life and it is damn hard but I think on reflection you are a very different person than the scared and lost girl of 12 months ago. Would you agree? That is a very hard thing to have to think about though, when you do plan to die how do you live when you realize you have not accounted for life. I must say that I have thought alot about that since you posted it and I cannot even begin to fathom how one manages. But you are here Hannah and so you are stronger than that disease and you are living a life.

Hugs to you as always

Sarah

[Croix]

Dear Hannah~

Um, maybe there is some sort of cycle there. I think if that was the case for your medical team, what there is of it at the moment, should be aware so they are not always just reacting as things come up. You said they don't realize unless you tell them or hurt yourself. Do you think there is any was to bring this up as a possibility (if you run out of time in a session write it down).

Your dad sounds lovely. I can understand his frustration, however one of the things everyone has to learn in life is you cant fix everything, some things you live with and just do the best you can. I'm not talking about you here, but in general. I could not 'fix' my offspring's grief when their partner died suddenly . Years later I was told my constant support, which seemed to me at the time pretty frustrating and useless, made all the difference in the world.

Trouble is if you in the back of your mind you think you ought to be able to fix something but don't manage to do so then you blame yourself.

I guess he need serious reassurance he does not have to fix you, you will get better in time, he just has to support you along the way. Any ideas how to do that?

Just speaking for myself I've found comedy, humor and fun has helped me climb back up, inspirational music or words were annoying, in fact more black music was in tune with me and helped me feel less alone, but that's just me, you are a different person.

At the moment it all seems like an inevitable and ongoing situation with no happy ending. It will change for the better. I can say that becuse of what is inside you.

Croix

[Idontevenknow]

Hi Sarah,

I'm going to try and get a copy of Jazz's book as soon as possible because it will really help.

I think that's true for me with suicide, when I started focusing on it, it became my everything. I couldn't and still can't really see a life without it.

It was weird to have a breakthrough because it never really happens, and the last few times its happened, it has been negative eg. thinking of a new way to end my life or something like that. It's been the first positive breakthrough for a while.

When you first read about radical acceptance it might not make sense but if you think about it for a while it might. For a lot of people in my DBT group including me, the first time we learnt it most of us either didn't get it or didn't agree with it but after thinking about it for a few months and talking about it again in group, it makes a lot of sense.

I agree, I think I have changed quite a lot the past 12 months. It's probably been the hardest 12 months of my life, so much has happened but I'm grateful for my experiences, even though most of them were unpleasant, they've made me who I am today. Fun fact, I think I mentioned that I'm going back to the sub-acute for a few days next week, and while I'm there they're having their one year celebration party! It's weird to think that I was their first patient a year ago, and since then they've been able to help so many young people through some tough times.

How have you and your kids been? Back to school and work?

Thanks,

Hannah

[Idontevenknow]

Hi Croix,

Yeah I'm pretty sure there's a cycle, but when I tried to tell people a few months ago they just put me on the contraceptive pill even though I've tracked it before and it doesn't correlate to my menstrual cycle, but they didn't listen so since then I've still gone through another two or three cycles with two suicide attempts. It'd be nice if they actually listened to me, maybe we'd be in a different position now, oh well. My stay at the subacute has been confirmed for next week so I'll try and bring it up again with the doctors and nurses there and hopefully they'll listen to me.

'Trouble is if you in the back of your mind you think you ought to be able to fix something but don't manage to do so then you blame yourself.'

What you said is exactly my parents. Both my parents are just constantly trying to "fix" me and its frustrating. I try and explain to them that they can't just "fix" it but they too will not listen to me. My parents have had many chats with the mental health professionals I work with and I'm pretty sure they have tried to tell them that but my parents don't seem to care. They consequently, like you said, blame themselves which makes me feel even more guilty about putting them through this. I don't know how to convince them they can't fix me and its not their fault.

I'm so sorry that your child lost their partner, I'm glad that you were able to support them and it really helped them.

It depends for me what kind of things help me. Some days inspirational music saves me, other times I need intense/emotional music to help get my emotions out and some days comedy puts a smile on my face.

My life at the moment does seem like a constant cycle of depression and anxiety with no hope of a life without them or a happy ending. I don't know what will change.

Sorry I sound so mad in parts of this but I'm just in a bit of a cranky mood today and some of these things I mentioned make me mad.

Thank you,

Hannah

[Croix]

Dear Hannah~

In order for cycles to be seen by a set of professionals then a record needs to be kept every day. Over time this will show sometimes in graph form the swings. Admissions dates are a sort of journal and a starting point for them . For you a journal perhaps, paper or electronic.

If you have already started one please keep going and work out ways to present the data so it is obvious. As I said graphs over time is a good one.

I'm glad the sub-acute is not set.

The urge to fix is built in, and hard to overcome. I got angry when people tried tp 'fix me' with impractical ideas or other lacks of understanding. Is that what you do?

So being mad can be good, plus if you want to go crook here we'll listen, and most probably understand. Just say how you feel

Croix

[Idontevenknow]

Hi Croix,

I don't know if my admissions show a cycle. It's hard to see because it isn't an even number of weeks every time, but I have been to hospital or the sub-acute ward most months since March last year. I have my diary card that I keep for DBT where I rank certain emotions and urges everyday but I'm not sure that shows a cycle either. If I was shown a calendar I could try and explain my mood over the past six months and explain that I think that there is a cycle but that's not very solid evidence. I'll chat to the mental health workers tomorrow when I go to the sub-acute ward.

Yeah, I also get mad or frustrated when people try and fix my problems with stupid sounding ideas. Sometimes it can be belittling like all your problems will be fixed if you eat a banana every morning, or quit social media forever or look at how great your life is. I know they have the right intentions but its annoying.

I'm nervous about going into the sub-acute ward tomorrow. There's the usual reasons like going back again, feeling like a failure, having to meet new people etc. But then I'm also scared because this time I'm not at rock bottom, they won't take me seriously and won't help me in the future because I'm "better" even though I can feel myself getting worse.

Thanks,

Hannah

[Aaronsis]

Hey Hannah

Sorry for the tardy reply, I have just taken a few days to recharge too, and you know I was thinking about what you said about your life being so focused on suicide that you actually live in that space and it becomes your everything, that life goes on along side it and you do function but suicide is your space, I think I have been doing that too and it wasn't until you pointed this out about yourself that I feel like I have been doing this too. Not in the same capacity as you though in that I am not having suicidal thoughts or feeling like that at all, but, I spend alot of time here talking about it, I follow and take interest in alot of community groups that research and raise awareness for families that have lost someone to suicide, I talk about it to groups behind the scenes at BB, so when I stop to think about it, it is almost my life too. I worry alot about looking for warning signs when people confide in me that they are struggling, even with my kids I worry about their mental health, I guess all of this is not really ideal either. Maybe I too need to do what you say, live my life and get back into doing what I love and know that suicide education and awareness is over there to the side, I do what I can but ultimately I cannot prevent a person from taking their own life. I think I need to think about my focus too. Thank you .

Also, I have read alot about Radical Acceptance and as you said, it is alot to think about when you first read about it and if it is possible, what were some of the things that you spoke about in your group that got you to grasp this concept? I think I need some guidance on that one!

All the best for your time in Sub Acute, I know you have a whole bunch of feelings and emotions about your visit this time, who knows who you might meet, who engages with you, you might be able to lift another, give someone their "Esther" moment, sometimes I think the very reason that we are put in a position is sometimes not the reason we were there in the first place, imagine if you are the reason another human does not go back to sub acute, and goes and lives a happy life from learning about yours...wow......

I will be thinking of you this week, Tik Tok away, we are with you and just a keyboard away.

Hugs Hannah

Sarah xxx

[Croix]

Dear Hannah~

I guess sub-acute means you have not reached the critical stage, so that seems to me to fit perfectly. A safe place particularly if thngs get worse and no harm done if getting better. so I doubt they are going to look twice if you are not as bad as you been sometimes.

I would suppose you need advice on what the professionals look for in a cycle. Maybe that means so many days from to right down to ok, maybe it means the periods between these . It's only an idea. I think the significant thing is that you have a fair idea when it is happening and you are going downhill -would I be right?

People say the stupidest things, from 'get over it' to 'I know how you feel", not to mention "but you have a good life". Can't say I've hear the banana one yet:)

I get cross becuse apart from anything else the have no idea and that puts me all by myself.

There are all sorts of reasons why they say these things from don't really care though to simply stick for words though full of empathy. Ignorance is no help. Then again I've has some cry, and for them I feel sorry and powerless myself.

Can you take your phone and all the rest into sub-acute with you or is it meant to be a rest from the everyday?

Is Winnie allowed to visit? If so there can be a proper 1 year party

Croix