How do i deal with it?

[Peachy1]

Hi,
i have been with my boyfriend for 4 years, when we first met things were fantastic.  he was such a lovely man and he still is to this day, however, things have been different for quite some time.

with the loss of a loved one a few years before he met me, he still struggles to move on. he doesnt talk about it but he is depressed i think and no matter how much he says he wants help he is procrastinating. I have given so much to our relationship and have loved doing it, but it is getting really draining for me. i want to have the best life i can and i want him to be in it with me but he doesnt do anything really, he sits at home, doesnt work, plays games all day, i come home from work and do everything. i try to talk to him and get him motivated but he is so defensive and feel like im getting nowhere! what can i do?
the other thing that is affected is our sex life, we used to be really intimate all the time and now its like an effort for him or a 'chore' - he says he loves me and i believe he does but its just not the same. he looks at porn all the time i know it he tries to deny it. he doesnt understand that if we had a healthy sex life i wouldnt care if he did that (i might care but not as much) but he cant do that and then not be intimate. im at my witts end.. i love him but i want him to grow up and get through things and be a man he complains all the time.. well he needs to fix himself?

thanks

[Peachy1]

Hi David, Thank you for that 🙂

[The_Real_David_Charles]

Dear Peachy1,

Was thinking - it's tough for the partner not to say "So when's your next appointment with the counsellor ?" without sounding like "Have you done you homework ?".

Then I realised we get this "checking" attitude with everything.  For ex, my kettle instructions:   "Do not operate the kettle on an inclined surface.   Do not operate the kettle unless the element is fully immersed.  Do not move the kettle while it is switched on".

If you can give your partner less attention that would be good for him.   On the "checking".   Or simply think and react LESS than, say, when he forgets to get the milk.    Of course, the opposite will be when, after 3 sessions, most men think "I am cured.  I don't have to go back.  I am normal now............".

Your support walks the tightrope of emotional balance to meet your partner in the middle.  Luckily, the counsellor will provide the safety net.  And the  psychological security.  But the elephants are waiting to come on the tightrope too !  And various family members shout from the stalls whilst throwing unhelpful comments.

Glad we achieved some understanding.   As you say, thank you for that.

 Adios, David.

[mrx]

I dunno - I think porn is a drug. It's a fetishised version of life and it happens over long time...many years of distortion of one thing leading to another and the amplification in between. It is a drug.

My question would be what is the focus of the porn he may be looking at and reverse engineer the issue from there. What is he looking for? 

[Lucas]

Hey Peachy,

 Seems your getting good advice, one thing... the 'just be a man" part in your first post threw me a bit... Think most men the issue is nowdays the role of a man has changed and there are 2 choices... "be a man" and close up take up drinking and get on with it or be touchy/feely open up your feelings and move forward... Can't do both.. The days of being a tough guy/putting family first are becoming less and less as the role of a man becomes less. Just my 2 cents, hope your appointment went well and all you can do is support him with as much love as your able too. But in the end make sure your own quality of life continues.

[S_A_D_]

Hello David, 

I'm impressed with your depth of knowledge and experience. Your commitment to BB forums is worthy of official recognition and status, and it saddens me to see you having to pull out your credentials for every  thread. 

Antonymously, I also believe every comment deserves equal evaluation regardless of the status of the poster. I also believe that you are deserving of applause for admitting your mistakes. Better late than never. 

However I feel that you come across as arrogant, which I am also guilty of, and wonder if you're interested in sharing some humble pie with me. This is common when an experienced person addresses a layman. They will often retaliate and situations like the above result. Try to remember that two wrongs don't make a right. It's easy to let our emotions take control so, while this is no excuse, I forgive you. 

Reading this thread in its entirety has been very rewarding, and if they bring back the edit button I sincerely hope you DON'T use it. We can all learn a great deal from exchanges like this, but only when kept complete. 

[S_A_D_]

Hello Peachy, 

Firstly, Allison's post commits several logical fallacies including slippery slope, false dichotomy and appeal to fear. However her motives are pure. Far too often people in relationships become complacent to abuse, and it continues indefinitely.  Don't get used to being poorly treated. 

So how do you deal? Get proactive.

The rest of my advice will draw on the work of famous psychologists like Maslow, Erikson and Skinner. I strongly suggest research into the needs heirarchy, the stages of psychosocial development, and operant conditioning. An hour in a library with a psychology 101 textbook could change your life. 

Many people with mental illness, especially depression, have received a significant lack of nurturance from loved ones, especially early in life. We often overcompensate but overvaluing and underappreciating characteristics like autonomy, incentive, encouragement, support and empathy. We need more than average, and don't show enough gratitude when people do what we believe we deserve. However, with persistence, we will eventually begin to reciprocate in kind. This is your cue to further reward him for reciprocating. In time he will learn that reciprocating gets the biggest and best rewards, and you have your loving relationship back. 

Right now he is getting these feelings from gaming, but it's a false sense of accomplishment. If you take it away he will resent you. You need to learn to be a more attractive object for his attention than the game. This means no punishment or tit for tat or complaining or criticism. Give him the power to choose you, and attach no penalty for choosing otherwise. Only use positive and negative reinforcement, and start with a continuous schedule for every time he chooses your company over the game. 

Unless you're rolling in money, make the rewards small primary reinforcers: food and drink. Give him something special every time he leaves the game. You can use similar strategies for intimacy, both the ones you like and what you want him to stop doing.

[The_Real_David_Charles]

Dear Facey,  (cos Facetious doesn't quite ring true with empathy somehow)

A combination of handling my depressed son (again) and maybe getting a bit knackered in the brain from 2 yrs responding has put me on an extended break but I can see where you are coming from.

This idea that arrogance lends a hand in our judgements of mental health is an old chestnut.  But not as old as Agatha Christie's murder mystery books, some stories published nearly 100 years ago.   If you read some of those titles, ex "The Pale Horse", "The Big Four" or even "The Secret Adversary" you'll find this slightly arrogant, assuming or indignant preface from the author:

"To  ALL THOSE WHO LEAD MONOTONOUS LIVES  in the hope that they may experience at second hand the delights and dangers of adventure"

Do we have a winner in the arrogance stakes ?   Time to moderate and add the yellow new sign.   I'm not sure this itself isn't a tad arrogant, I mean, surely the existing mins/hrs/days of updating suggest whether a post is "new" or "old".    I'm still hanging out for an edit button.  On myself as well as beyondblue.

You know that Frank Skinner was debunked in Boarding School ?   Had to switch from top bunk to lower bunk to appease the dorm bully.   Lol.

Adios,David.

PS   Geoff - isn't the yellow NEW bubble a certain yellow/caution colour ?  Just saying.   Hope BB paid the Hazmat colour copyright............Ouch !

[S_A_D_]

Thanks David,

You got me giggling. Congrats!

Facetiousness is about taking something terrible and hurtful and highlighting the absurdity or the situation so everyone can have a good laugh. It's useful when empathy just don't cut it any more, which seems to be my life story. It's about replacing the last resort option with an extreme measures coping mechanism.

I don't know if that quote is correctly transcribed, but the appropriate word is vicarious, not monotonous. 

You do realise my reference to Skinner was as Burrhus Skinner, the second most famous psychologist to ever live, not the british comedian, right?

Doctor, please transplant that edit button into me STAT

[The_Real_David_Charles]

Dear (explained) Facetious,

Here's a dilemma.   If you know that you're being facetious then isn't a bit cruel to be that way and not opt for empathy (cut or uncut) and simply avoid a confrontation in the even that a snarly comment might not come off as "fun" ? A better coping measure might be to shut up ?  Or nod ?   Intent seems to be over riding action.

I'll give you an ex:

a) Daughter (18) returns from a social visit. 

b)  Daddy asks politely "How was it ?"

c)  Daughter half shouts whilst brushing past "GET STUFFED, DUMBO !"

Now, I love this kind of interaction.  It tells me my daughter finds our relationship solid enough to be facetious.  Plus, the alternative would be to bottle up emotions and attempt some self harm in the privacy of her bedroom.   Which is worse.

I'm guessing if you don't have teenagers this exercise in definition would be a waste of time. Anyone with experience of teenagers, on the other hand, would just laugh and say "Yep, been there".  

Communication is an interesting subject. Can we really "read" people ?   Why do psychiatrists favour cardigans and brown felt ties ?   Why is the Moderators Cat hogging the heater ?

Adios, David.

PS    Here's a shorter version:  "When Medicare repeatedly post my new Medicare card to a former address (despite numerous admin calls) are they also being facetious ?  Or is this the govt's way of saying I am cured ?".   Discuss.   Just making my point about sometimes it's better just to shut up.  Or eat air.

[S_A_D_]

Already cruel situation in order to highlight the rare and coincidental nature of "the perfect storm". 

The theory is that in extreme situations a person has virtually no control or influence over how events will unfold. Then we apply the old anecdote from AA: "God grant me the courage to change the things I know I can (and should), the serenity to accept the things I know I can't (and shouldn't), and the wisdom to know the difference." 

Since I can accept I've lost control of the situation, I might as well focus on the rarity as an indicator of absurdity, and have a laugh. And it would take an extraordinary lack of empathy to be laughing in hell without sharing how you were able to arrive at a mental state of happiness under such circumstances. The courage that it takes to risk offending people in order to show others a silver lining may be the pinnacle of empathy.