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Men isolated
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I'd like to hear from men. I want to know your inner feelings about anything that you feel isolated about. I'd like to know if you feel that the revolution towards equality of the sexes has gone too far to a point whereby you are feeling inferior to women or you feel women are being treated better in any way - just because you are a man.
Emotionally, are you feeling that you get enough support from females? Do you feel women are afraid to hug you to comfort you for any reason? like you'll take advantage of them? Do you have many female friends? Do you feel that women socialize better? What do YOU want socially?
Feel free, talk, let go of your restraints, take advantage of the anonymous environment to let yourself be heard. We can do this and be in error, that our presumptions are ill directed and unfair. It could be our own inapproachability for example that can sway women away from us when we need them most.
Are we misread? I know when I'm in conflict with someone I come across as a little aggressive or arguing in a normal male manner and that can portray someone that is not in need of support but is someone to avoid. NOTHING could be further from the truth.
So that's one gripe. I feel women don't pursue the friendship care far enough. Such limited care results in my feelings of isolation. I think I'm a "giver" apart from my supportive wife no woman supports me anywhere near the level I give to them. Is this an illusion? What do you think?
Two people. One a woman that enters a group, say a hobby group. She sits down and isn't feeling emotionally well. She is asked a question like "how is your day"? She burst into tears. The whole group of 10 ladies stand and hold her hand, hand on her shoulder, comforting and reassurance. She is not alone. They even ring her later and talk at length. The other person a middle aged male enters a motoring clubroom in his local town, his male friends restore cars and share drinks. He sits and realizes he was in no shape to attend. A guy asks him how his restoration is going. He is upset thinking about his car as due to his depression he hasn't been to his shed for weeks. He suddenly starts crying. The men, all of whom start to feel uncomfortable, mention a few things like" you'll get there don't worry". He is worried because he knows that half of the men there actually think he is a softy by crying, to stand clear of him because he has problems, to avoid him as it might upset their own happy day in the sun....
Tony WK
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Hi Tony /
So pleased to hear you mention things like this because l've noticed it to for years now.
l've also talked about it in other forums trying to get some kind of equality back into them when women have ranted off about men but we can't do the same back, heaven forbid if we were to talk about them the way mods allow them to talk about us, which they don't. l mean could you imagine if we were to talk about the size of their private parts , and that's putting that with a lot more respect than they often do . And men mustn't forget either that women have packs too , some. But it's right across in everything now as you say also and l see things you've mentioned all over the place also , not only in forums but in fhere's even some of it right here in BB by women and that's in good behavior mode, which just gives you idea.
Men have to start giving them as taste of their own stuff back.
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Hi random
I agree with some of what you are saying but, I dont feel to right the wrongdoing is to revenge women.
Women arent responsible for the advertising content on telly, more likely the mindset of the advertisers afraid of getting heaps of complaints from feminist groups.
Our unjust world isnt made just by "giving it back to them".
One example is my wife brainwwashing my youngest child against me. Karma comes to those eventually. By doing the same to her is to make me as evil as her. It fuels conflict. War isnt what we want, fair resolution is better.
Thanks for your input though random. We have to "right" the ship not tip it over.
Tony WK
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Hmmm Tony and Random I'm not sure I totally agree with you.
Yes I agree men need to be treated with a lot more respect, equality and kindness than what we are currently seeing but to me Tony this isn't how I experience the world as a woman...
"Of course men have done this for decades aimed at women but rarely now unless in a juvenile group. All of this is unacceptable now."
The same jokes and dumbing down of women still happens. All that has changed is it is less socially acceptable. The same disrespect still happens. It's just people are more aware of checking who is listening.
An example? I hate dealing with tradespeople. Can not tell you how many times (even recently) I have been told "get your husband to..." or "just write down.... And your husband will know what I mean".
Superannuation is another issue noone talks about. I have less than half the super of my husband and my super is good compared to my friends! Some have barely any due to being stay at home mums.
As a woman I will always be dependent on my husband otherwise I could not afford my medical care. How is THAT fair either? WE chose to have kids. But only I lost the security superannuation provides. What if he leaves me one day?
I understand that the constant attacks on the rights of men are detrimental to the mental health of men. But it doesn't mean the rights of women are resolved either.
What do you think?
Nat 😊
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Hi Nat
This is where this thread is healthy for us all.
To throw examples into the discussion to explain the other side is to educate. We men have our issues, eg more often losing our full time parenthood and lack of direct support but while we focus on that there is the flip side whete women are treated unequally. Unequal pay for some women and what about not being hired as they might fall pregnant?
All relevant. Thanks Nat
Tony WK
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Today I'm wondering.
What are the differences in men and women with - why the suicide rates are 3.5 to 1 ? roughly 800 women to 2700 men annually suicide. We should think about this. Why?
In fact suicide rates are more than double in indigenous communities. That is a real worry also but little we can do here if the inclusion rate is low on this forum of such peoples. If you are aboriginal or Torres Strait Islander- you are more than welcome to comment and join us.
I can, like you, have theories and that is all we have to go by.
Questions-
- How many suicides or attempted suicides are due to relationship issues?
- How many are caused by workplace or career issues?
- How many are from coping issues
- How many from discrimination
- How many from low self esteem or inadequacy issues?
- How many from physical disabilities?
- How many from injury
- How many from drugs and addiction
- How many from a narcissistic environment?
And so on. There is a wide scope. Yet here I am only thinking about depressive illness, bipolar and the like.
I know I'm not going to find the answers here. Many scientists are working on the issue and you only have to google it to see that.
What I'm more capable in providing here via this platform is an understanding of why men feel the way they feel and want to express such feelings.
Tony WK
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Hello Tony, and all.
I just read those statistics you posted Tony..How extremely sad they are. Way, way to many, even one a year is one to many..
Grandy
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Hi TonyWK
I know that Germaine Greer was a legend when it came to equal rights for women in the 1970's and good her because the mens club mentality had to go
In a boardroom in 2010 a female executive that had the same seniority as I sat there and said "Paul...you need a haircut mate" This was in a huge Australian company only 8 years ago....I think the equality has gone Tony thus resulting in a general low self opinion for some men...I am only one of the many
I could never address a female colleague re her appearance without serious repercussions including possible termination of employment or my contract
Its not a gender war at all...Just referring to your last post re mens well being and the woeful suicide rate
Thankyou for the latitude
Paul
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Hi Paul,
I see your point.
What do you see as the main issue causing male suicides? How can we reduce them?
You are a man with much experience with anxiety and abuse. Being told to get a hair cut would not happen in the reverse. Correct me ladies if that has been the case as its my assumption.
So, these sort of events, the trodden male, the demonised man, the male commonly losing his full time parenthood, or is it how men receive these life's events that result in triple suicide rates?
A few years ago a female singer on Australian Idol was told to "lose a few pounds". There was an outrage. So women do endure similar.
I think...
Tony WK
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Thanks Tony
I clarified at the end of my post it had nothing to do with a 'gender war'. It was an isolated incident.
Its only one of many examples of inappropriate behavior that can tip some men 'over the edge' especially when they are already suffering from serious clinical depression
It is directly related to the thread topic 'Men Isolated' and only involved me being bullied by a female colleague in front of my peers which can trigger a suicide attempt
Paul
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Hi Paul
Yes, so I'm wondering if being "pushed over the edge" is more likely in men? Regardless of who by...eg male or female.
This fragile state I am most familiar with. Could it be, logically, that 3 times mote men than women are roaming around in this state compared to women?
We also have 800 women a year suiciding. Thats also a concern.
Tony WK