Is depression a natural reaction to an insane world?

[Unbeliever]

This is a thought I have been pondering for a while.

The default to view depression as "something wrong", or a "brain chemical imbalance" or as "a disease" or something that "needs to be fixed" or requires "medication" or "therapy" appears to be the most common response of practically everyone. 

From doctors, to psychiatrists, to therapists, to the general population, to the depressed individuals themselves... the universal belief appears to be that "the person needs to get help".

But what if... the living in depressed state is correct? What if it isn't an "imbalance" or isn't something "wrong"? What if being depressed is the only natural state to be in for an intelligent, empathetic, compassionate, informed, thinking individual to exist in the current state of our world?

What if to NOT be depressed about is the true indication of mental sickness?

I'm not saying that being depressed is fun in any way... most people on this forum would be well aware that it sucks. But that is not what I'm saying. 

What I mean is... could existing in a state of depression be completely natural for someone living in a place where so many things are obviously terrible... both on a personal level and in the world as a whole?

My reasons for this perspective are numerous. Far too many to write in only 2500 words. But basically...

The real world is an extremely depressing place for any person that cares at all about anything outside of themselves.

Eg. If you care about animals... the reality is many beautiful species are already lost forever, many others are so close to the verge of extinction that even if everyone worldwide decided to do everything they could to save them... they would still be lost. At home there are people that still buy people animals as christmas gifts, refuse to desex their pets, the massive amount of pets put down in pounds annually. There is backyard animal cruelty, the dog racing industry using live bait, shooting race horses with legs, women's hormonal treatments for menapause, the meat industry, birds choking on our plastic half a world away, overfishing. The list goes on and on.

It is reality and it is depressing. Care about animals and feeling "depressed" about it IS correct. And that is one tiny subject in a plethora of subjects.

3 billion people in starving poverty, the water wars, religious fanatics, corrupt governments, womens rights violations, slavery, wars, child rape, etc etc

It's the people that are not depressed that worry me.

[Just Sara]

Ooh...you're in the zone girl!!

I've loved reading every word btw. To me, having an opinion is half the battle. Some 'follow' so as not to rock the proverbial boat. You know me though, I like a challenge and I think you do too. So this thread and UB (big wave!) have given us something to chew on. Now you're in the mix, I'm happy as a pig in poo.

I've been recording a series on Foxtel. It's about finding new and exciting avenues to cold fusion and alternative renewable energy. I didn't say resources because that eludes to the physical earth.

I've been pondering putting a windmill in my back yard for a while now as a source of free power, but I'm not sure about legalities or council requirements. If everyone did this, (giving a nod to what you said about people doing their bit) it'd be a winner I think.

I don't think the powers that be would deal with it well as control would then pass to the individual. We wouldn't need to connect to the grid right? Isn't it odd that my focus has been on upsetting the status quo?

In Sth America a local scientist created a very simple home made methane gas thing-a-ma-jig that uses food scraps to provide enough energy to cook wit5h. It weighs little and is cheap as chips. It's a glued together plastic drum and PVC pipe local invention that now runs a burner in 3 homes of a very poor community. Bloody marvellous!

No govt or power company intervention either. It's people and inventions like this that'll change the world, not big companies. The fact that we're part of an affluent (not effluent) nation means the difference for us. There's so many bloody governing laws, our head spins each time we want to do good as single entities.

Another great project concentrates on creating the first ever magnetic propelled train inside a tube. If successful, which I have no doubt it will be, it'll negate the need for aircraft which contributes a massive amount of pollution to the planet. It'll be so fast we won't need them.

For those who focus on the problems, life will forever be plagued with problems because what we focus on...grows. I love my new show! It inspires me.

Sez

[blondguy]

Hi UB

I have absolutely no doubt that you are not boring anyone here as you definitely dont have any issue where self expression is concerned

I read this on your original post (I hope you are okay with me quoting you).....

Unbeliever said "What if to NOT be depressed about is the true indication of mental sickness?"

The forums are about what we think and feel....and being non judgemental can I ask you about your thoughts on this as its just my humble opinion that its a chemical imbalance making it a physical illness to begin with the lack of serotonin (which are produced in the gut) which helps our neurotransmitters function well enough to have a reasonably balanced life where our mental health is concerned

Thankyou for being a part of the forums UB

My Kindest thoughts for you

Paul

[Unbeliever]

Here is my concern Paul (or at least one of them).

For someone to claim that a brain is chemically "imbalanced", one has to assume that therefore the person claiming that believes that there is such a thing as a brain that is chemically "balanced".

Have you ever even heard or read of any scientist, any phamacist, any brain specialist ever use the phrase "a brain that is chemically balanced" before? Ever? Anywhere?

Of course not. Because there is no such thing. Even scientists that devote their entire lives and careers to study brains don't even know that such a thing exists.

Even if they had some idea of what a "perfectly balanced brain" would look like... and even if they somehow found a way to induce one into a condition that somehow fit that group of scientists ideal "balance". Are you absolutely confident that you would want one?

Would you trust someone elses definition of perfection? They say that "one persons heaven is another persons hell" for good reason. Because "perfection" is just like "normal" there cannot be a singular definition. It doesn't and shouldn't exist.

What about a "range" of acceptable balance. Fall within this predefined range you are well but above or below these "lines" you are unwell.

How exactly do you think such "lines" would be determined? And who exactly would be the one qualified to make such a decision?

Would they use their own brains as as the base template? Or use an exceedingly happy persons brain? Or take 1000 brains and then average them out to find the "optimum balance avg"?

Admit it. After all this time, with your "issue", after all the doctors and psychiatrist and other expects you have seen, your hours thinking yourself... you have never once thought about this. Am I right?

We hear these things, read about them, people tell us these specific terms... and we just accept them, never question them, never think about them.

Why? Because we are unhappy. And we want that to change. Whatever the cost. And even if it happened to be a lie, it would still be a price that most of us would pay... simply to be "happy".

But without scientists, or doctors or pharmaceutical companies knowing what the goal actually is, or where those lines exactly lie between their definitions of "healthy" and "sick"..

... it's nothing more than "frankenscience".

Take this, put it there, mix ingredients... record results. Results not what you were looking for? Then take this instead, put this over there this time, mix ingredients... record results.

[Unbeliever]

I might feel differently, if a few things I saw around me were different.

For example, it is standard practice for "normal happy" people to "unwind" from their days to day life with a few alcoholic drinks. On weekends... a few more than a few.

In fact, countries around the world who are famous for their excessive drinking regard Australians as "drunks". Although news stories mainly focus on the drunken footage of teens on the streets on a friday night, even they have released data that "binge" drinking and alcohol consumption is becoming a problem in Australia.

... and why do people drink? To escape from the thoughts of their day to day lives or to enhance the experience of their "not entertaining enough without alcohol" lives of course.

But what exactly do you think they are escaping from? Or here is a much better question... why is this method not enough for depressed people to cope and be considered "normal"?

Anyway you slice it... it is self medication to get away from their personal realities. This IS how many "normal, happy" people "cope" and most of these people are not included in the "depression" statistics.

... and let's face it. If the occassional weekly alcohol binges were enough for us poor depressed people to cope, we would all probably be a "few times a week" alcoholics too (and be considered normal happy people to boot). But for a large % of us, we tried that method at some point and it was not enough.

Of course, alcohol is just an example of something people use to escape from reality. I used it simply because it is a blatant obvious one that is difficult to refute. But there are many more... and most of these are regarded as obsessive behaviour. Things that we devote so much of our mental energy and time to so that we don't have to think about all that "other stuff".

Now I'm not talking about a little (enjoying things a little is fine of course), I mean borderline fanatical obsession, where the greatest displays of passion in their lives are focused to a degree that is almost entirely absent from the other things in their lives.

Standard ones are... sports, religion, sex, food, "the bachelor", gaming, reputation, money, gambling, etc but it can be anything really.

My point is, I see normal people doing anything, literally ANYTHING to escape... not from the "big bad world" but just to escape from their own personal reality.

But why would "happy" people do that? And why exactly are we the depressed so determined to become one of them?

[Just Sara]

Hi UB, Paul and Pepper;

This has turned into quite an interesting discussion. I understand Paul's enquiry completely re depression and imbalance. I concur with Pepper re personal accountability. And for the most part, I get where 'you're' coming from, although I find it more argumentative than productive.

I'm not sure why you use alcohol as anecdotal evidence; it actually enforces what Paul suggests. People 'use' their drug of choice because it bumps up 'feel good' brain chemicals. Use too much, and it becomes problematic due to addiction. (Another chemical imbalance/response)

As Paul also says, brain chemicals are created as a 'process' within the whole body. Our brain isn't a separate organ supporting itself. In essence, it's holistic cause and effect.

The reason science hasn't focused on balance, is due to the same reason you started this thread in the first place. Focus is on what's 'wrong'; what hurts or harms. Baselines are necessary for studies to not only be empirical, but to be accepted within the scientific community as valid.

It sort of works the same way on BB. The main focus (among others) is 'recovery'. We don't need a baseline because each person/diagnosis is individual and therefore avenues of recovery are subjective, yet it's still a worthy endeavour.

I totally understand why Pepper's engaged here as sadness also pervades her life. Her efforts in attempting to identify and explain what she reads is personally important. (This is my interpretation and not aimed at speaking for you Pep's. If I'm off point, please rebuff. I apologise)

Depression is debilitating no matter which way you look at it; a response to a screwed up world, a chemical imbalance, an inability/fear of personal accountabilities or, all of the above.

You didn't say one word about my post on amazing developments occurring in science/technology world wide. Why? It isn't all doom and gloom UB. There's 'hope' in the form of positive focus/action in people - despite brick walls.

Could you challenge yourself to change focus in your next post? Writing positively will change brain chemicals and hopefully give you a rush of 'happy'. 🙂 I know it does for me.

Kind thoughts;

Sez

[Unbeliever]

hehe... sorry Sez.

Been meaning to get around to it, but I've barely slept the last 4 days. My brain is running on fumes.

Communication has been limited. Not personal. 🙂

[Moonstruck]

Life is a tale told by an idiot...full of sound and fury....signifying - nothing!

[Verona]

Why is it nobody has written in this thread for the last 6 months? I found it to be the most inspiring topic of all. Anyway, it is how I feel. I am not on medication, nor have ever been diagnosed with depression of any kind. Its just deep inside me, I mean "depression", you can call it "dissatisfaction". And the reason is the world around me, to be precise, that I have to share this planet with our species. The saddest fact is nobody can change human nature, which is cold, selfish, and lazy. Humanity's readiness to hurt or kill to satisfy their selfish ambitions is beyond any words.

A new research shows it is not due to climatic reasons the mammoths came to the extinction, as previously thought, but due to overhunting by early humans. Ahh, another reason to keep the door shut from the outside world.

[Peppermintbach]

Hi Verona (and a wave to Unbeliever and all);

Welcome to the forums 🙂

I’m personally glad you resurrected this thread. Sorry, I don’t have much to say right now as I’m still mulling over your words...

But I must say that I’m fascinated by what you have written. I often feel this sense of “dissatisfaction” with the world (or call it what you will) isn’t always a very well explored area in terms of its contribution to mental health issues.

Thank you for giving us something to ponder...

- Pepper

[Just Sara]

Hi and welcome to our BB community Verona; (Shout out to UB and Pepper too)

I totally get where you're coming from. You seem such an intelligent and caring person. It's difficult to read of your disillusionment with life.

As this thread suggests, it does seem an insane world so it's understandable you're finding your life more depressive (and complex?) than ever.

Now living in recovery, I've seen both sides of the coin. My personal opinion is that technology has broadened our scope of 'inclusion' to being part of the whole world instead of someone living in a small community.

We're being bombarded with problems from every possible direction of the globe and every moment of history.

I've had to pull my boundaries in to my immediate environment. It's a survival tactic that's worked thank goodness.

Is it fear that drives you? Injustice? Guilt? Why do you focus on the whole, when focusing on your community provides opportunities to help? This ultimately improves the whole, just as I'm doing by posting to you today; small ripples can create big waves.

We're not helpless or powerless. It's just that feeling so small can render us that way. One saying that's helped me come to terms with feeling insignificant is; 'What I focus on - grows'.

Focusing on everyone/everything else takes me further away from me, my power, my qualities/abilities and my uniqueness. I now give what I can and,...it's enough! I'm enough...

We can't change the past, but we can learn from it. Focus on what we 'can' achieve; it's a simple path to a peaceful mind.

I'm sorry if I seem to 'preach', but I truly know the damage that being angry at the world can do. I don't know you, but I care about you just as I care about everyone who visits this site.

Take care and kind thoughts;

Sez