Is depression a natural reaction to an insane world?

[Unbeliever]

This is a thought I have been pondering for a while.

The default to view depression as "something wrong", or a "brain chemical imbalance" or as "a disease" or something that "needs to be fixed" or requires "medication" or "therapy" appears to be the most common response of practically everyone. 

From doctors, to psychiatrists, to therapists, to the general population, to the depressed individuals themselves... the universal belief appears to be that "the person needs to get help".

But what if... the living in depressed state is correct? What if it isn't an "imbalance" or isn't something "wrong"? What if being depressed is the only natural state to be in for an intelligent, empathetic, compassionate, informed, thinking individual to exist in the current state of our world?

What if to NOT be depressed about is the true indication of mental sickness?

I'm not saying that being depressed is fun in any way... most people on this forum would be well aware that it sucks. But that is not what I'm saying. 

What I mean is... could existing in a state of depression be completely natural for someone living in a place where so many things are obviously terrible... both on a personal level and in the world as a whole?

My reasons for this perspective are numerous. Far too many to write in only 2500 words. But basically...

The real world is an extremely depressing place for any person that cares at all about anything outside of themselves.

Eg. If you care about animals... the reality is many beautiful species are already lost forever, many others are so close to the verge of extinction that even if everyone worldwide decided to do everything they could to save them... they would still be lost. At home there are people that still buy people animals as christmas gifts, refuse to desex their pets, the massive amount of pets put down in pounds annually. There is backyard animal cruelty, the dog racing industry using live bait, shooting race horses with legs, women's hormonal treatments for menapause, the meat industry, birds choking on our plastic half a world away, overfishing. The list goes on and on.

It is reality and it is depressing. Care about animals and feeling "depressed" about it IS correct. And that is one tiny subject in a plethora of subjects.

3 billion people in starving poverty, the water wars, religious fanatics, corrupt governments, womens rights violations, slavery, wars, child rape, etc etc

It's the people that are not depressed that worry me.

[Unbeliever]

*cont. from above.

I am well aware that there are reasons why this "locked in" view of depression has happened. I understand that significant progress has been made in mental health (this website's existence is testimony to that) and much of the stigma related to it has dissipated recently. I can even acknowledge that psychiatry and phamacuticals has achieved positive results for many sufferers (although I do dispute some of the statistics that claim that medication that made a previously unhappy person "feel nothing" is a "positive result"... but that is a discussion for another time).

I am not outrightly saying it is wrong. But it does concern me greatly that such a rigid outlook has become so universally dominant to the point that no other perspectives are even discussed anymore.

Which brings me to my next point...

I can only speak for myself, but I assume that many people joined Beyond Blue for the same reason as I did. To simply find out if there were other people who felt or thought about things as I do, to know that I was not alone. To see that my personal suffering was not uncommon or "weird".

After extensively reading through this website the first 3 weeks after joining, I soon realised that this is a great site for many people to find like-minded individuals who have or are going through similar things. It obviously helps many people feel a sense of "belonging" which is wonderful and necessary to help them. This is a wonderful thing and I am glad for those people who can see that their struggles are shared with others.

However, after weeks of daily going through countless pages of threads after thread and reading so many peoples struggles it gradually became unavoidably obvious that the "shared relatable experiences" that I initially came looking for were not anywhere to be found.

There were things that that I read that I could relate to in some way or at least understand, but nobody was discussing any of the things that is at the core of what I have been struggling with for so long. Since I came mainly to find out that I "was not alone" this unfortunately made me feel more depressed than before I joined (the irony abounds). The end result being that I felt lonlier than ever. So many sad people struggling, but apparently no-one like me. My heart just sank.

This is not the fault of the website, or of anyone involved. It was just a fact.

Ugh... hit the word limit again. I'll try to make the next post my last one.

[blondguy]

Hi Unbeliever

Thanks for posting.... if you didnt there would be no forums. I understand where you are coming from as having 'clinical' depression is a dark place to be in for sure

Most people on the forums are having difficulty in one way or another where their mental health is concerned

You mentioned "If you are depressed all the time, that is bad, you are ill, something is wrong with you that must be fixed via any means possible because you are flawed and mentally sick"

It would be great if we could all be 'fixed via any means possible'. There are many gentle people on the forums that have the misfortune to ride the roller coaster of clinical depression....and its not something we enjoy.

You are spot on when you said that mental illness is not uncommon or weird and good on you too. Mental Illness is no different to a physiological illness. There are chemical imbalances occurring which does make life very difficult with depression....anxiety or a mood related disorder

Great to have you as part of the Beyond Blue forum family

my kindest for you

Paul

[Unbeliever]

* cont. from above.

I will try to explain...

I know that people love me, I don't suffer from anxiety or panic attacks in public, I am well aware that personal aspects of my life are not nearly as terrible as so many other people on Earth and that in many ways I have been extremely fortunate. I understand that things are rarely static and are constantly changing, I am not socially awkward or struggle meeting new people, I am not suffering from a terminal or debilitating disease or aching from a crippling heartbreak from losing someone I love.

I do not have many the typical symptoms or internal beliefs that usually accompany severe depression.

I also find things like the universe overwhelmingly beautiful, the world, the planets and stars, the biological diversity and how those things came to be, chemical compositions of the universe, even the knowledge of things invisible to us like the physics behind how everything works and purely mental non-tangible things like philosophy. These things are beyond gorgeous to me, almost magical in mearly existing at all. I know that I appreciate things that the majority of people don't even know exist, let alone ever spend time thinking about.

I am still healthy, my childhood was good, my mother was wonderful, I was ridiculously lucky to have her and my grandmother. I have suffered no major personal tragedy. I was born to a country by fluke that has no civil wars or famine or suffering population.

and yet am extremely sad... relentlessly so for a very long time now. I hate myself to a degree that I cannot stand to see my own reflection... and I mean literally, ever. I don't have "highs and lows" just lows with occassional "deeper lows". I have absolutely no desire to live to see tomorrow, not because I think it is impossible for good things to happen but quite simply because... I have seen enough.

I recently had my fortieth birthday. And I just cried and cried... for the first time in a very long time.

It occurred to me that day that I was middle-aged. But I wasn't crying because half my life was gone, I was crying because I realised that I was ONLY half way through my life and there is no way I can survive another 40 freaking years... it's just too long. I'll lose my mind long before I make it that long without a doubt.

So in the end I created this thread just in case anyone like me ever came to this website, so it would be here and then they did not have to feel as alone as I did.

... damn, 2500 again.

[Unbeliever]

* This will be my last one...

I have spent a long time thinking about this. Why am I so sad when I meet so few of the common criteria that is usually hand in hand with depression.

and after a lot of slow elimination all I have is this one thing. The thing that I cannot escape from no matter how hard I try.

At the core of my sadness, the one thing that rips my heart apart is humanity.

I am disgusted to be a member of our species. Even contributing in a small way feels like an insult to my very existence. I have felt that way since I was about 11 years old.

I think there are many reasons for this. For example, in previous generations there were these "unifying" moments that people experienced, that entire generations shared and celebrated together.

Some were human achievements like a person walking on the moon for example, moments where an entire world looked up and were proud and could say "look at what our species achieved". Others were the end of horrible things like World War 1 and 2. Moments where people all over the world celebrated together the actual end of something terrible and the day it was finally over. These were worldwide moments entire generations shared in awe and relief and felt pride in what they had achieved together.

But as I said earlier, I am now 40 years old. No-one has even been to the moon in my lifetime, or anywhere else. There has been wars being fought literally every single day of my life without a day off and not one has been "won" or "ended". There has not been a single "humanity unifying" moment at any point in my entire lifetime that we could actually celebrate together.

The closest I can think of is the Berlin wall being taken down. Unfortunately, I was 11 at the time and didn't even know the Berlin wall existed until it was being taken down. The next closest thing I can think of is planes crashing into the Twin Towers and I can't even think of a 3rd thing. None of these are "Wow, look at this amazing thing we did" worldwide cheering moments.

Sure, we have some great mobile apps, the Mars and Saturn probes were pretty cool and movie CG is pretty impressive. But what as a species have we actually achieved in the last 40 years? Things like bigger planes and faster cars are just refined ancient tech, not different from putting a digital clock in a spear. These are not "wow" achievements, not unifying moments.

We just spend our time trying to fix the problems we created in the first place, or we add to them.

It IS depressing.

[Unbeliever]

I guess what I am saying is that the current generation of people (Let's say from around middle-aged or younger) are experiencing a situation that generations have not experienced for quite possibly hundreds of years... a sense of "nothing". No achievement, nothing to bond over, nothing that the entire human race despite all their differences can point at and agree on that "this is awesome".

It is not like we have not had the opportunity to achieve great things in this period. We are the most highly educated members of our species to date with an practically unlimited workforce to dedicate towards anything we want.

It is not like we have not had major problems to overcome in this period either. In fact, a greater number of people die from wars now than ever did in WW2, the numbers of displaced people without homes from war or climate change is astronomically increased, animal species are wiped out so commonly that most of the extinctions don't even make the evening news anymore. Poor people and children starve in such numbers it makes the heartbreaking situation in Africa in the 1980's look like a tea party by comparison. And despite this every year now about 136 million babies are born... enough to repopulate Australia over 5.6 times EVERY YEAR and increasing yearly. I could go on, but 2500 words.

40+ years of not experiencing any human achievement to unify our species, even for just a day. A laundry list of terrible situations of which we have not ended or found a solution for any of them in peoples lifetimes. They just get worse and worse and our species does nothing but argue and argue. Achieving nothing.

We can't just blame the greedy corporations, incompetent governments or "evil" individual conspirists for this. We are all responsible in some way for the species as a whole.

And I'm not saying that flowers are not beautiful or that the universe does not contain wonderous things. It does.

But it seems that the "happy majority", satisfied with their little distractions, and obsessed with their tiny worlds saying "just concentrate on what's in front of you" and "focus on the positives" are not living in the reality of what is happening at all. In fact, are completely ignoring reality and content with "it is not my responsibilty" which changes nothing and only makes things increasingly worse.

Which brings us full circle.

What if depression isn't a epidemic or a sickness to be fixed? What if we depressed few are the conscience of our apathetic majority?

[Just Sara]

Hey stranger; it's really nice to have you back expressing your perspective. Not so nice to know of your despair though; I'm sorry.

I'm not here for an argument; I'm here to hopefully dispel some of the woe in your 'voice'. I've felt (and sometimes still do) the anguish of questionable existential humanity.

As for accomplishments in your lifetime, I wouldn't be typing here if it wasn't for life saving mental health professionals and resources. That's a mighty big step in the right direction. So is addressing political corruption, child abuse, freedom and the many areas of advancement in human rights.

In the 90's when Princess Dianna was killed, I wept at the foot of my bed not realising I was only one of millions. That event caused an outpouring of love and compassion never before experienced; humanity grieving together.

It changed laws and drove home how destructive obsessive endeavours are and; brought us together as a world family.

We're slowly changing as a species. It's not an overnight success by any means, but we're doing what we can. Just like addressing our mental health...one small step at a time.

We're learning to be more pragmatic after decades of letting loose with money, power, superiority and perfection. Yes, there's a long way to go, and it seems more frantic every day due to negative focus on news. Yet, as a single entity, I'm successful doing what I can to change things just by talking to you. I have choice, and that's power. Information isn't power anymore, it's 'how' we wield it.

We can't change the fact we've developed as an intelligent species; it just is. It takes millennia to evolve and this needs to be respected; we're not an abhorratian of nature, we're an anomaly.

Unbeliever...please bring your radar in towards yourself and get out into your local 'physical' community. You'll find amazing people and events to be proud of and contribute to.

Our instincts cause us to survive any way we can when we feel trapped or threatened. Ergo...mental illness. It's the ultimate escape from our own minds affected by a lack of boundaries and misunderstandings.

I wish you well my friend. Please continue to engage ok. Talking it out and taking other perspectives into consideration is a must to combat depression. I'm here if you need me...

Sez x

[Unbeliever]

Hey Just Sara,

I'm glad that you have some kind of human achievement that helped you significantly on a personal level (and it is definitely good that you are still here). Unfortunately, I'm unable to join you in that celebration after going through the process of "medication tweaking" and a variety of group therapy and councilling... it unfortunately would be more accurate for me to say that I survived despite mental health resources and professionals.

No ones fault of course. It is impossible to know the perfect balance for each individual and negative effects can happen despite the best of intentions. I understand this.

I can only assume that you are talking about advancementa in political corruption, child abuse, freedom and human rights in Australia... not in the world in my lifetime right? Although to be honest, even in Australia it is debatable. Pretty sure that Native Australians would argue that nothing has changed since the 1960's, we are currently voting whether a certain minority has "rights" because of who they prefer to sleep with in 2017... which is a bit embarrassing really, glass ceiling for women still hasn't developed many cracks yet really.

You say "slowly"... I say "glacial". Actually, that isn't even really true since after 40 years a glacier's movement is at least visually perceptible.

Your Princess Diana comment is valid. Her death did bond a great many people I agree. But not really what I was talking about as an species"achievement" as such and certainly not something the worlds peopel could celebrate together and feel proud of, so not quite what I meant. I appreciate the effort of trying to think of something though.

It is scary, to realise that you can't think of anything though in such a large amount of time during the most modern period of human history huh! I really do feel sorry for the younger generation. We are so hard on them for their faults, but we really haven't been very "inspirational" at any point since they were born and "intelligence"? Not sure if they've seen much of that either... I know I haven't.

And 40 years is a long time Just Sara at least from a lifetime perspective... however you try to rationalise it. From an "achievement" or "development" perspective... the whole world would be on fire before a conference is held about what to do about having "hot feet".

I do know why you ask me to focus on a local level. But Sara, I see the exact same problems on a microcosmic level as well.

I'm sorry.

[Nigelpm]

Hi Unbeliever..yes I agree with you entirely..I think the only way to avoid whats going on in the world is to avoid what going on in the world...just find one thing that you can do to help or heal something...animal,vegetable or mineral..then shut the rest out..then you have done your bit!

[Just Sara]

Thankyou so much for replying Unbeliever! It made my day..

And thankyou/welcome also Nigel; the more the merrier. 🙂 Nice comments too...please stick around and peruse the forum, or start your own thread. I'll be looking out for you.

Unbeliever..you've addressed much of what I wrote, thankyou. I didn't have a long think about what to provide as evidence - I thought as I wrote. When I talked of Human Rights etc, I was talking about centuries of abuse world wide. Princess Di just jumped into my head as what I though was positive progress.

I like your comparison to glaciers; you're right, slow just doesn't cut it. I guess our focus and intent may be at different ends of the spectrum, but our acceptance of humanity's existential progress being less than desirable is equal.

Re depression; I'm so sorry you've had an uphill battle finding a balanced medication regime. I'm one of the lucky one's who found the right blend without much issue, albeit later more than sooner. Med's are only one strategy for recovery. It'd be great if you could elaborate on other avenues of coping.

Hey, I still struggle with accepting 'life' as we know it. What saved my sanity (from where you are) was letting go of ruminating and seeing my back yard as the be-all and end-all of my accountabilities/responsibilities.

If I get in a complaining mode, I send emails/letters to pollies and relevant big-wigs to vent. Oddly, they've 'all' replied.

I really wish I could spend more time writing as I really admire your tenacity and will. I need to get to the bank before it closes for the weekend, but I'd love to return and flap my pretty gums.

Talk soon...

Sez

[Unbeliever]

I can't "avoid" it. I can see many of the results and the causes on a "local" level as easy (if not easier) as I can on a "planetary" level.

As for "healing" something. That's been a constant thing since I was in primary school.

Stopped my mum from using plastic shopping bags and to use bread bags as bin liners when I was 6 and have only brought my own bags since.

Why? Because I learned back then they never broke down and choked oceanic animals. That was about 15 years before it became "popular" and the 10cent per bag disincentive. I also can't remember ever going to the beach without ending up with handfuls of rubbish (which really sucks now since they removed all the bins).

Decided to never own a car until the combustion engine was replaced at 8 years old. And as a result I have never driven.

Why? Because after I saw the Exxon spill back then, learned about the standard processes to drill, refine and transport oil and discovered that wars are fought for years over oil resources... it just seemed like an unreasonable trade just walking 20 minutes to the shops or catching a bus. Plus I had seen alternative engine designs that existed back the which were excellent.

Decided not to have kids at 11.

Why? The ads on tv with all those poor starving kids in Africa. When I found out it was happening in the millions increasing the population when we couldn't even feed little kids we already had just was obviously selfish. That was in 1988.

I've been nursing injured animals for as long I can remember, sometimes waking up 4 times a night to feed them with droppers and releasing them in they were native. I bury dead animals I find on the road as a sign of respect. Wont own non-native pets like cats and dogs, after I found out how many native animals they kill (and how much meat dogs eat and where it comes from).

I volunteered at a zoo for years, hoping to educate people and schoolkids about how to protect and save endangered species.

I boycotted companies like Nestle, Coca Cola, KFC etc for over 20 years after I found out what those companies did. And avoid products like pate, veal or anything with palm oil for over 15 years and tell everyone who will listen to do the same.

I have never walked away from a person in trouble, even when I knew I would lose (Women being attacked or raped, kids beaten by their parents, etc)

Do these things make me feel like a better person? No

Why? Because you don't deserve a cookie for doing what is obviously your responsibility to do.