Help. I don’t know who I am supposed to be and feel lost

[Daniel12]

Hello there I don’t usually do anything like this but I wanted to see if anyone has any advice for me. I am a 25 yr old who on the surface should have everything under control as I have a good job, good family yet I increasingly feel like I don’t know what makes me who I am and often feel down and flat when trying to find answers. I know people have much more reason to be depressed than someone like myself but I just constantly felt flat and lost searching for how I am supposed to be and what makes me who I am.
I have been trying to find a partner which has been the source of countless rejection which is all part of it I know but often I’m left feeling like I’m quite a boring person with nothing really that interesting to tell anyone and I am confused as to how to act

I’m usually a quiet natured person but I feel this incredible pressure that I can’t be like that and I am confused as to where I am at with my life

it is difficult for me to put into words I guess it’s just a lost type of feeling of what my place is and who I am and I thought at 25 I might have an idea of this

I know my post hasn’t given a great deal to go off but if anyone has experienced similar at my age I’d be glad to hear what approach you took

thanks

[therising]

Hi Daniel

Could it be people are misinterpreting what they're sensing when they're around you. This leads me to think of my 21yo niece who is one of the most soulfully beautiful highly intelligent natural people you could ever meet. She is so incredibly shy in social situations. She's painfully shy; you can almost feel her discomfort. Some will judge her as 'incredibly shy' and will acknowledge that engaging her in conversation involves a considerate thoughtful approach. Such people are careful and at times won't push her because they know how incredibly challenging it is for her. On the other hand, I have an aunt who can't help but judge her as 'rude' and 'boring'. She's far from rude, being one of the most thoughtful, considerate and polite people I know. She's far from boring if you really know her. My aunt's misinterpretation is not my nieces fault, it's technically a fault in my aunt, the fault of misinterpretation (aka jumping to conclusions/ignoring all the facts).

In recalling a conversation with my niece, I suggested to her she's 'a natural' or 'a sensitive' (able to easily sense/get a feel for things). As one, she remains herself under most circumstances while knowing she's judged for it. She can naturally get a feel for boring conversations and won't engage in them if she can help it. She's not arrogant, she simply can't engage in what she senses as uninteresting. She can naturally get a sense of what is worth listening to. She naturally has a brilliant imagination you can easily trigger through conversation. If you don't trigger it, it's like all you're doing is talking to her, they're just words and nothing more, requiring basic responses.Her sense of humor is triggered through her imagination.

Not sure whether this will work Saturday but what if you were to really push your imagination to the limits, really exercise it. Instead of imagining what people are thinking of you, imagine stuff so outside the square you can't help but smile. Someone speaks of politicians and you imagine all politicians appearing as gorillas or giraffes, for example, with human voices. Someone asks you what you do for a living and you imagine yourself in some superman type outfit, with your underwear on the outside of your tights, as you carry out your daily work. So, every conversation you engage in, you engage in it with a smile. No one has to know what you're imagining. I suppose it's a bit like the old public speaking trick, imagining everyone in their underwear.

[Daniel12]

Hi therising

I empathise with your niece if she is being called or misinterpreted as rude or anything to that effect as I can imagine this would happen to me too. I would have to admit that I can be shy which contributes to the “quiet” label but it is within large groups that are unfamiliar or when I am first meeting a few people. It feels as though this is not normal whilst the logical part of me suggests otherwise. Now that you have mentioned it I can relate to what you say by not having certain parts to me triggered in conversation as it does feel at times people are talking at me not with me.

If I self assess myself, I actually deep down don’t believe I am lacking in conversational skills, my strength in this area is 1-on-1 it’s never been in a group. It is just got to a point where I feel very beat down by comments like “he’s quiet” and the tone it’s said it like I’m a weirdo because I am not some clown that’s the loudest one in the room.

I don’t know what you think and I have mentioned it a couple times but a large issue to is I actually see people actively tune out while I’m talking or even stop listening and continue/join a conversation elsewhere. Then I’m left in a position where I’m almost like mid sentence and I’m thinking in my head “they are definitely not listening” and I have to stop talking otherwise I probably look stupid. When this happens enough times I have now developed the belief that I’m fundamentally an uninteresting person to talk to. In addition to this, to be not as loud by nature is wrong and to just be down to earth is not exciting enough to attract someone.

I will try this Saturday and see what I can do. I don’t hold out much hope for myself if I’m honest and I am in two minds about going because I really don’t want to get inside my head again. I’m also not keen on being labelled quiet like it’s a massive character flaw and immediately judged as weird because I’m not some in your face character.

I believe and friends have described me like this that I am down to earth, initially introverted but not shy it’s more once I break the ice and am comfortable my personality starts to show, it’s more I probably need the other person to “show up” to the conversation but there’s times in the past I have carried conversations but that’s where I’m constantly judging myself as uninteresting to the other person.

It feels like the way is wrong and not attractive, most of that probably makes no sense so sorry if it’s a confusing ramble.

[therising]

Hi Daniel

I think we can be left to doubt our social abilities while not giving any thought to other people's inability to respond to social cues. What I mean is our quietness can be a cue for another to throw us a line but they don't know how to. Or if someone can sense the conversation is dwindling out or becoming uninteresting, in their opinion, this can be a cue for them to ramp it up or take it in some other direction but, again, they may not know how to.

What comes to mind is 'acting'. All the actors show up for an evening on stage. They all have lines. Based on this, the whole 2 hours or so just flows. The end of each line is the cue for the next line for another actor. Now, imagine the whole play was improvised. Unless these actors are all sensational at improv, there are going to be a lot of awkward pauses. So...

You can show up to an evening event/party where only a few key players are great at improv. The rest are not so expert. When looking back, how many people did you come across at gatherings who were really good at improvising? Some may have been good at the lead in to the scene you find yourself in but, beyond the lead in, that was pretty much it.

Someone who's good at social improvising will reach into a person and pull out an aspect of that person. What now comes to mind is - while I could ask you 'What do you do for a living?', I may actually instead choose to ask you 'If you could imagine being anywhere in the world right now, where would it be?'. You might imagine a desert island or perhaps a commune in Tibet, playing guitar. Triggering your imagination, I haven't just brought out the visionary in you, I've also triggered the adventurer. It's the visionary and adventurer who will speak to me. 'What songs would you play, while in the place you imagine?' would then bring out the musician in you. We are multifaceted creatures who don't necessarily want to talk about what we do for a living. Typically, someone who's great at social events will lead you to talk about what you like, love or are passionate about and then they might use your responses to tell you how they relate to that. For example 'I can relate to your vision of that commune. I've lived in a few myself. You have to experience this, they are amazing' and then they might add greater detail to the conversation, such as talking about the quirky people they met. Back and forward the conversation goes between the 2 of you 🙂

[Daniel12]

Hi therising


I think you make great points and it’s something I will try this approach even though I may not have the ability to do this. If I really think about it though, particularly if I am one on one with someone say over a coffee I believe I have good conversation skills and typically my approach is to use what the other person says to either ask a follow up question to go further, relate it back to something I have experienced with regard to the context we are speaking or try to inject some humour in some form.

Some of the problems I’m having now is and I’m confused about it all and would appreciate your opinion is that given I would say I’m a quieter person and probably more mellow is this unattractive to women for example. I don’t believe I lack layers for lack of a better term I’ve just never been someone who works the room for example I’m more having smaller conversations in the background.

I have said it before but I’m really confused that to be a more quiet, mature, laidback and just down to earth person and not a loud/larger than life character is uninteresting. It’s really hindering me because half of me believes it is ok and I have a lot of things I can talk about but because I’m not like the life of the party then I’m not someone a potential date would think is fun enough or whatever.

I feel very all over the place with this stuff and it’s a constant battle to just accept what I am. I feel strange as well like I have more confidence but also don’t at the same time because of more dating experience etc.

I’m also very worried that Saturday might be a disaster where I get stuck in my head again and I’ll spiral the next day thinking how pathetic the way I am is. I’m on edge about going but I will go because to just be there is something I guess. Sometimes I also feel pressure at these things because I want to meet someone so subconsciously I’m putting pressure on myself to go out of my way to try rather than see what happens. I’m not sure if that makes sense and I am struggle to manage that because of loneliness feelings and a bit of lack of hope.


Sorry again if a lot of the points I make seem to be all over the shop I’m just fighting a battle where I want to accept myself but I’m still confused because I can’t seem to meet someone who would suggest the way I am is ok

[therising]

Hi Daniel

In my opinion, it's easy to be attracted to quiet people while I enjoy getting to know them. I'm more inclined to get along with a quiet person than someone who's overpowering. By the way, in no way do I believe your challenges are all over the shop when it comes to working things out. Being multifaceted, I think it's natural for us to deal with multiple facets of our self, all at once on some occasions.

I once heard someone mention how incredibly powerful imagination can be. Of course, imagination only works if it holds elements of logic and we can relate to what we're being led to imagine. I'm definitely not going to be able to presently imagine myself as a 20yo old male Olympic champion figure skater. I'm past 20, I'm not male and I have no interest in figure skating. What you could lead me to imagine is myself as a relaxed public speaker, speaking to a crowd of thousands. I should add, I am terrified of public speaking. For me even to speak in a room full of 10 strangers who are hanging on my every word as I read from a speech would lead me to shake while listening to my heart beat pulsing through into my head. If you could lead me to imagine I have the ability to speak to thousands and actually enjoy it, if you could really trigger my imagination (my ability to visualise), you'd have me convinced. Of course, putting it into practice is another part of the challenge. I think the first part of most challenges involves our ability to easily imagine the process and the outcome. If we can't imagine anything other than failing, then failing is typically the outcome because that's where our brain takes us. All sounds simplistic but it's not. It can be far from simplistic, the process of altering perception.

Through repeated experience, certain neural pathways are created in the brain. As Joe Dispenza (a brilliant author) puts it - if you imagine your thoughts are like riding a sled in the snow and you take the same path over and over again, your thoughts begin to take the path of least resistance, that path etched into the snow (your brain). It becomes about creating new pathways. Of course, we have to imagine we have the ability to create new ones. Neuroplasticity is an interesting field of research.

A new pathway may begin with 'There's nothing wrong with me enjoying kicking back, being the observant strong and silent type' or it could be 'I'm going to learn to work a room and actually grow to love it and thrive on it'. Imagine that 🙂

[Daniel12]

Hi therising


I think there’s definitely merit in what you mention about the way you perceive/imagine things. I think I have definitely developed the narrative in my mind that to be the more quiet laid back character I am is wrong. It’s almost a default position for me to take and it largely gets triggered by pressure to find a partner because as the different people I meet/date continues to really go nowhere it almost reinforces it on my mind.


I have really tried to clear my mind recently and try look at stuff like this objectively and I think none of the people I have dated really would have a bad word to say about me as a person I think it’s a matter of just not being the right fit. I think I need to stop taking it out on myself because it’s an exhausting process. Maybe I can use the way you described to imagine myself as a way of restructuring the way I think about it.


I can admit myself that with regards to the whole dating thing I may have impatience to a degree and maybe it’s because of my culture there’s pressure to get this sorted and I would like to find someone whilst still young. Sometimes I look at it and I just feel whilst I have been putting myself out there and meeting people whether it’s from online apps or whatever it’s frustrating that none of these seem to stick. I begin to search for answers as what’s the issue I am putting out there when logically it’s just probably not the right fit.


My fear is given I’m more quiet in nature and I’m not someone who would approach someone from across the room due to anxiousness and it’s just out of character that I may not meet someone because I don’t go out of my way to find it. I know you can’t predict the future it’s just seeing everyone around me sort of just meet people randomly I’m just disheartened because it seems like these random meetings are such a remote possibility for someone like me because I’ve never really had this happen, so as a result pressure on myself to seek it out just builds and builds.


I feel a bit on my own in this as well because everyone around me has met someone and it’s a bit like what am I doing wrong or how am I going to find someone when I’m basically on my own


I’d like to try use what you mentioned in terms of imagining things in a different light to help my mindset and my help me personally and socially I guess pressure is really getting to me because I know it’s silly to say but I feel I’m missing the boat a bit.

[therising]

Hi Daniel

My daughter has spoken before about her interest in the Myers-Briggs Type Indicator (MBTI). It's a fascinating look into the theory of personality types. I thought this topic might be of interest to you as it manages to help put together different traits which go toward better defining both our strengths and areas that require some work.

Was looking at YouTube today and managed to reach a conclusion about where I fit in when it comes to the MBTI. By the way, I don't set out to define myself specifically, I simply like to wonder. I asked my daughter 'In your opinion, am I an INFJ?'. 'Absolutely' was her response. I'm an Introvert, INtuitive, a Feeler and Judgemental. When I ran through the strengths, I thought 'That's so me'. When I ran through the areas that challenge me, I thought 'That is so me'. By the way, the judgemental aspect is more so about judging through analysis or calculation, rather than opinion. If I judge an intensely critical and highly degrading person to be depressing, I'll reach the conclusion they're depressing, unless they can convince me otherwise.

It's interesting how our greatest abilities can also relate to our greatest challenges

The strengths of an INFJ:

Sensitive to the needs of others
Reserved
Highly creative and artistic
Focused on the future
Values close, deep relationships
Enjoys thinking about the meaning of life
Idealistic

The challenging side:

Can be overly sensitive
Sometimes difficult to get to know
Can have overly high expectations
Stubborn
Dislikes confrontation

I think figuring out why these challenges exist, how they came into being, is handy in the way of self mastery. For example, it may be difficult to get to know such a person perhaps because they're highly sensitive to feeling the full impact of betrayal or rejection and have felt it several times in the past. They don't want to feel it again so they tread carefully. Perhaps redefining and/or better understanding betrayal or rejection may help with overcoming this challenging aspect. Another down side to this personality type - Being judgemental, they may judge themself harshly and, while being an introvert, get stuck in their own head when it comes to such judgement.

I think if we can relate to who we are in some way (even if it's through the Myers-Briggs theory), it can mean going out into the world with a strong sense of our strengths and our challenges. We can know why we're ticking the way we are under the circumstances we face.

🙂

[Daniel12]

Hi therising


Thanks for explaining that to me, it very interesting and I have seen it before but never really understood it so thank you.
I think majority of those traits you just outlined for the strengths and challenges I can relate to a lot.


It definitely feels like it would be hard to get to know me particularly upon first meeting. Whilst I would say I’m an open person and I like to talk the more reserved and anxious side of me holds me back. The judgemental side is definitely geared toward myself and pressure I place on myself. It’s funny I think I have high expectations but it’s almost 90% geared toward myself, with regards to other people I think I get let down when people I know or want to get to know don’t display basic morals that are sort of conditioned to me. I would say this was an issue but I think it’s turned into less about others and more judging myself to a point where it’s really scrutinising every move I make which I’d like to thank lockdowns for for worsening that problem.


Whilst I’m still very confused as to where I’m at, I feel like I’m starting to get the picture of what I am. What I would like is to just be able to accept it when I am in social situations and use it as a strength not be anxious to be comfortable/natural in myself.


I have this birthday tonight and I really don’t want another repeat of people tuning out while I talk and me almost looking for it and getting disheartened and then the tape of thoughts play through my mind all night to the point where when I’m on the way home I fall into a depression because I have an inability to meet people or not be weird.


I guess just wanting to go and being there is a step in the right direction, I just get really anxious about getting stuck inside my head and being judged for not being the life of the party. Hopefully I won’t panic and capitulate again

[therising]

Hi Daniel

How did the party go? I hope things were a little different this time, even if 'different' involves you noticing stuff you never noticed before. Maybe you still felt awkward yet had some revelation you've never had before or met someone who opened your mind in some wonderful way. I hope so. Progress can feel so painstakingly slow at times. Progress at a snails pace can kind of feel hopeless at times, yet it still remains progress nonetheless.

🙂

[Daniel12]

Hi therising

The birthday went ok, I tried to mix with people as best I could and made an effort not to get trapped in my head or try force things out of myself that are unnatural which I have consistently done in the past.

Sounds a bit silly but I sort of approached it with the mantra of knowing that yes I am more laidback and reserved but this shouldn’t be a drawback.

I was able to talk to different people in my own style and I guess it felt like a small amount of progress in the sense that I felt more like myself and stayed more natural and I can’t remember too many times I thought I was coming across weird. Inevitably there were a few occasions where I thought about it but I just seemed to rationalise it better just thinking I’m a down to earth bloke and laidback I don’t need to force anything.

I guess it showed me in a small way I can talk to people but in my own style which should be fine I guess.

I didn’t really get a chance to speak to anyone or meet anyone in terms of females other than the friends I knew there which is a bit disheartening because feels like another wasted opportunity but I didn’t really have much opportunity to.

I can definitely relate to what you mean when you say progress can feel painstakingly slow, this is how it feels with my search for a partner. I have been going on dates and stuff through online apps and things like that but I don’t seem to be the type where I happen to talk to someone like at something last night and it goes from there.

This could just be luck because despite all the anxiety and stuff like that I get socially I definitely open myself up and try to put myself in situations even if I worry about it in advance. Just feels like it’s really stagnant at the moment in that area and I don’t really know what I should do about or whether what I am doing by exposing myself out socially is even just a good start.

Thanks and hope your weekend is going well

Daniel