My estranged daughter turns 21 today

[Jstar49]

Hi everyone, I'm completely new here so Hello and thanks for being here.

It's my eldest daughter's 21st birthday today and I'm feeling pretty emotional about it. She hasn't spoken to me in 4 years, and refuses to have any contact with me, my husband or our 10 yr old daughter. I was a single mum with her, stayed around her dad's town in order for her to have a relationship with him but finally left when she was 8, to return up north and be closer to family. That's a whole other story.

She was impacted by my PND, for sure, and things have always been intense between us. Chaotic too. Interesting, but not exactly stable. My marriage when she was 10 was the start of some kind of normal, and now I've never been so content or mentally/emotionally stable, even tho I still need to take care of myself, not get overwhelmed, and watch myself re: taking on others opinions/judgements.

I worry about her but I tell myself maybe it's for the best, maybe she just needs time and space to discover who she is, and learn to forgive the mistakes of the past and accept herself and myself for who we are.

It's hard tho. Today I just would love to see her, see her smile at me, hug her and tell her how proud of her I am. And hear whatever she has to say.

Anyhow, thanks for listening. I know there's others out there with similar stories. It seems like the world just needs a course in family harmony! It's so sad for the kids that get caught up in it.

Cheers,

Jstar

[Jstar49]

Dearest Em,

I can feel how much it does hurt such a loving, family -oriented person such as yourself, to have to go NC, and for your d and others to not understand.
Im so sorry that you’re still experiencing the fallout after such a long time.
my feelings weren’t caused by any sense of a projection on your part, so be at peace about that.

I guess it’s still challenging to admit that I mite need help making connections with ppl- I would def rather do things ( like a group) becos other ppl need it, rather than admit my own need.
the more you speak of your mum the more I get how complex a situation it is. Love and a desire to support entwined with the knowledge of danger and the need to protect the self.
I can relate.
thats family isn’t it!

well, not for everyone.
big hugs,

J*

[ecomama]

Hey J*

All good, how are you doing?

re: the "group" strand we were talking about. You can do and be and have anything you decide to.

My Counsellor brought up the "social connection" thing that she was first very concerned about for me, quite a while back actually like 1-2y ago lol.

Today it came full circle.

She brought it up again. We delved deeper, like REALLY deep. She found out more about me.
We jointly realised that it was far better for me to nourish the relationships (outside of family we're talking about) than to try to begin "new" friendships as a focus.

Not sure how it is for you, but whatever it is then you know.
Then you can.

Brene Brown talks alot about "belonging" as opposed to "fitting in".

I think so many of us who've lost our families find ourselves feeling cast adrift. Floating.

We miss that feeling of "belonging".

But we may have and may still do spend so much effort trying to fit in to our families. Trying to change ourselves, double and triple guess how or what and why we should say and do this or that.

Its HORRIBLE.

Belonging is when we be ourselves. And KNOW we "belong" no matter where we are.
Ofcourse Brene and others explain it all so much better!
We are authentic.

For me that's the difference between good friends and the others.
I can absolutely and totally BE my authentic self with my friends.
THAT is so difficult to find so when we do find those friendships, it's good to nurture them.

Off to work on the car again lol.

Love EM

[Jstar49]

Hey Em,

Thats so true, and similar to my own process. Like spending NYE with a dear friend, making the effort, following through, even tho I hate travelling and don't sleep well when not at home. Heck I don't even sleep well with others in my home- it changes the vibe somehow and I can't hit snooze properly. But...we did it, again this year. and those heart to heart talks where you can just totally be yourself, make up for whatever else.

Sometimes I get anxious about friendships, but then today I had that exact thought, to make sure I am connecting with those ppl I really want to. And to use the rest of the time to do the stuff I really want to do, whether it's home stuff, or exploring with T. Or spending time with H. I was able to recognise that I didn't want to go to a big group thing for someone who's leaving, and then knew that I don't want to do big group stuff at all! What a breakthrough! And how obvious it seems now that I know. Weird huh.

So I don't know what will happen with a small group. It will have to be a natural evolution, me thinks! I will probably be pretty busy this year, working and being involved in community stuff, so I guess what will be will be.

The words you've used- cast adrift, and missing that feeling of belonging.....describe it exactly. as do your words about fitting in....."But we may have and may still do spend so much effort trying to fit in to our families. Trying to change ourselves, double and triple guess how or what and why we should say and do this or that."

That is so true. And something else that i was contemplating ( with quite some anger)today. The way that my family's rejection of me, from a young age really, has made me so insecure about my self in other social arena's. I lack confidence to be me, becos me has never been quite right, or good enough.

Well, as of now I reject that! And I promise myself to be aware when i see it coming and challenge the heck out of it! ( Either that or I'll get all peaceloveandmungbeans about it and be all accepting as a thought etc etc. Not sure yet which way it will swing, tho I sense I'm gona have to work thru that anger first!).

Sleepy if you're reading along I was so proud of you when you said that you felt sorry for your folks, as you drove away. ATTA GIRL!

We have to love ourselves so much more, becos of all the loving acceptance that wasn't given to us, whether as a child, or as an adult and in a relationship. We deserve that.

J*

[ecomama]

Hey J*

Yes! Quite a breakthrough for sure! My Counsellor and I discussed this group thing ALOT this week lol omg. She was pushing and pushing for me to join in SOME type of group for quite a while now... but at the deep core of it all for HER to understand lol is that I already FEEL like I belong here right where I am.

I don't want to join a group.

I already have "my tribe" of family, my own family.
I already have "my tribe" of friends albeit they are disparate and not of the same 'group'.

I already have my profession which I truly love. The colleagues are okay but it's the FAMILIES I'm there for. I have a beautiful letter written to me by a little girl I met through my work who described how I changed her life last year, in all the ways I did. It's on my fridge.

I see these families at the shops and they run up and hug me, omg it's so beautiful.

I already have VERY meaningful relationships RIGHT NOW.

Those who don't see our value can go take a leap.

I know when we spend SO MUCH time and energy in trying to maintain these really difficult relationships, we miss out on what WE want to do and achieve in our lives, including having PEACE.

"Go with the Goers".

There's a lot of recovery time involved after we go Low Contact / No Contact, no butts about that, but we can BEGIN to create the environment we want immediately. Work on the rest over time and ongoing.

YEAH SLEEPY! I would feel sorry for myself if Sleepy drove away too!! On that note I read Alexa's text and responded lovingly and gratefully.
The difficult "boundaries" convo I was told to have with her by my C (and I agree) will come when it needs to. For now, it's more about "triage" for our relationship.

We're really working this stuff out!

Our awareness over the harm these other relationships cause is a biggie.

Then the decision whether we want 'that' in our lives.

What we DO want.

Love EM

[ecomama]

J* said "....something else that i was contemplating ( with quite some anger)today. The way that my family's rejection of me, from a young age really, has made me so insecure about my self in other social arena's. I lack confidence to be me, becos me has never been quite right, or good enough."

Yes well we know this isn't true.... the not good enough stuff...

Narcs have to have a victim, scapegoat, whatever.... what took my extended family by shock, horror and surprise is how THEY were then targeted by my mother after I went NC.... this went on for decades and WHO did they blame?

Me.

So the only calls I got were those family telling me off.
Telling me they didn't deserve that... (oh really? lol, did I ALL MY LIFE?)
One actually said "Yes because YOU are her daughter"...

wow lol that's the rub!

I hope they heard themselves.... but nah... it was more comfortable blaming me.

My grandmothers were where I felt loved and accepted. Kind of lol... I just spend more time remembering NICE things we did together than the other stuff. I can't resurrect them to find out so I'll let that be.

EMxxxx

[golden82]

Hi J*,

Thanks for your support 🙂 Yes, I agree - so much of the family of origin stuff and the scapegoating affects us scapegoats through life. We often end up with MH issues as you say brought on by this as we turn our blame to ourselves. It is a common thread for sure. Fortunately there are ppl like you guys on BB who also understand this and it takes the blinkers off a bit to awaken and realise we were/are just that a scapegoat. I have watched some youtubes which say that with counselling support and understanding we can come out of this better - because we are free of the toxicity. I think you are very grounded and get all this. I hope you're working your way through what you have been dealt. hugs to you too J*

[ecomama]

Hey J*

How are you doing?

Hey golden, tbh after going through about 10y of depression after NC, without Counselling... I wouldn't advise either.... it was tough.

It's tough enough, but getting all the MH support you can get, to GET through the "grey area" time to the 'other side' is the healthiest way to go IMO.

I'm not saying I'm not sad when I think about it all / them all. But less and less do I think about any of it anymore really.

For me it was like grief. There was a very long recovery period.

When we can acknowledge our feelings, nurture ourselves in all ways possible, I believe we CAN live a life free of the abusers and it's a far more gentle one, more on our terms too.

Love EM

[Jstar49]

Hi all, hi Em,

I'm doing ok atm, thanks for checking in on me Em. How is your busy life?

The book is really helping- 7 habits-

It's opening me up to a different way of looking at things. Taking responsibility for my own happiness much more, acknowledging how much i have tried to change others so they could make me happy- duh! When was I gona learn! Funny how I have repeated like a mantra for so many years, "You can only change yourself, not anyone else"

Yet when things went really pear shaped in my family, as I tried to re-connect and support thru my sisters difficult times, I TRIED TO CHANGE OTHERS!!! Or I blamed myself, and tried to change myself so that they would change. Or something. Covey talks about the maturity continuum, and I recognised that despite my beliefs about myself, I was being emotionally dependent, in that I was still needing others to get what I wanted. And so I tied myself into a situation , and allowed myself to feel hurt/opened myself for rejection so many times, because I was trying to get what I wanted for myself and my family from others. My family weren't able to give me what I wanted. They still aren't. So I was building my emotional life on other people's weaknesses...! (Covey quote)

So! Am keen and willing for that one to change! Just that shift in thinking has helped me to be happier, and to look around me for what I want, and how I can get it, or make that happen in our lives. For me it's about connection, so everything we've been saying Em is on the money for me with this, connecting with those ppl who we really enjoy, and who aren't just 'cheap seats'....LOL!

D and T and I are planning a mini break- straight after a counselling session lol! However hopefully it's a positive thing. Perhaps by not returning straight home we'll find it easier to break habits and form new ones. More scenery and driving and real talking, less tv and grunting....:)

Cheers

J*

[Jstar49]

Hey Golden,

How are you doin'?

I have been wondering about what has driven me to seek a higher level of connection with ppl than my famly is comfortable with, and i think this touches on what you've talked about. Being an empath, and always feeling that there was more, somehow. Looking for it in my relationships, but powerless to get it or create it. And then being scapegoated, or laughed at for being vulnerable or nice or defenseless. I don't know what purpose was served, or how I could have changed things earlier, so that my childhood was happier, and my relationships and self esteem and everything was different, but I guess I'm looking at it as, that was then, and this is now. I am not going to let 'them' take my joy for one more minute!

Hope you're going well, and still taking those small steps to recovery 💚

Hugs,

J*

[ecomama]

Awww dear J* what beautiful posts!

The uncovering of ourselves then discovery of "us" and then building on that.

I knew you'd love Covey's works, you found them right at a great point in your life, beginning in a new career field (we trust lol) and reforming your perspectives on your family relationships.

I Pray you go from strength to strength from now on.

As with everyone here.

Oh you'll end up like me quoting Covey all the time now lolol!!!

You may not have read this one yet but "we judge other's actions by our own intentions" is the one that came to mind when reading about your familial ties.
You need to read that over and over again and with his explanation too, to really get it.

Also the smacker of a one lol.... "seek FIRST to understand, then be understood".
Aha.... Oh I hold my hand up there!! I DID NOT DO THAT SIR!
I DO do it alot. But the other day when my son drove through the garage door and woke me up to tell me.... I did NOT. lol

Then apologised to the darling when he got so upset.

You will LOVE the Families one. You really will.

And he had a great cassette tape that I have been unable to find on CD.
The 7 Habits of Highly INeffective People LOL!
It's SO FUNNY Hearing him describe so many things I've done.

That gorgeous, gifted, blessed, generous man.

PLEASE let me know how you're going with it all.... it's RICH dense material! LOL!

I had both the books on my bedside table for decades. Dipping in to them whenever I remembered too... they're AWESOME reference material.

Oh golden joined us in the Crafting Circle thread so that's beautiful!!!

OH HAPPY DAY!

Bestest wishes
Love EM