Questioning some things

[Clues_Of_Blue]

Those of you who know me know I have been bouncing from one rough life event to another for years, without really any time to take a breath in between. I can state well enough the things that have happened to me, but haven't had much energy to delve deeply into what those things have done to me. In the time off work since my partner had major surgery (yup, another fun crisis), I had time to start pulling at threads, to get a Mental Health Care Plan, see a psych and talk to a counsellor. As much as I always knew my life has been a steaming pile of crap, the threads I am pulling are connecting dots and giving rise to possible clarifications of events and what has arisen in their wake.

My childhood was severely neglectful. Mostly emotionally, but also in some physical ways. We kids didn't sleep in the (perfectly good) house, we slept in a caravan nearby - Mum cleaned up her and Dad's bedroom and the kitchen after the mouse plagues, but apparently our rooms weren't worth the effort. He carries on about her "unfit" parenting, but it's not like Dad did anything about it either. We were fed and clothed well enough. Never a lot of attention from either of them. I don't remember a single hug from either one during my childhood. Mum would immediately disinfect her hands if by some chance she came to touch one of us. Some years later, post parental divorce, Mum's settlement money ran out and we endured a brief stint without a home, a much longer (years) stint of inadequate food and no hot water.

I actually became pretty functional after moving out. Worked, studied, maintained a place on my own. Went through a couple of less than healthy relationships and endured with surprising resilience. Then came the last relationship. First two years, no major problems. Then bam, he's unfaithful. Enter ol' Blue's depression, that's the straw that breaks the camel's back. Damn fool remained in contact with him and we tried again at the relationship. To be fair, he didn't repeat that particular mistake. He tried hard to redeem himself and be a better partner. Until the ring was on the finger. Engagement in place, all effort fell away little by little. Dear gods did the neglect become overwhelmingly severe. I kind of got that there was a theme, but it's literally only now, years after breaking up with him, that I see why it was that straw that began my depression - just how closely what he did mirrored my parents' behaviour.

[Jstar49]

Hi Blue,

Gee you did well to squeeze a nap in between all that feasting! Or maybe your family eats on time somewhat ( at mine we're always waiting for someone or something...)

It's nice that your partner appreciates your sibs. Sounds like you're building a new family, one which is much more supportive and caring than the environment you grew up in.

I think thats really all we can do as adults hey. I mean, I still get angry at the stuff which I have spent so many years recovering from, and angry that I can't get my dad to admit any responsibility. And it hurts. Hurts that others get so much of his affetcion and regard blah blah blah. Truth is I don't play by his rules and so I suffer the consequences. But this makes me who I am! And I have strengths and abilities untapped and unappreciated by my Foo (family of origin) family. Sorry this is about me not you Blue!

Blue said: A lifetime of being taught it's not okay to feel, or getting hurt further if any vulnerability is displayed unfortunately does give one a blockage with trusting or allowing feelings to do their thing.

That's it exactly. The shaping that occurred at that early age, by 7 most sources agree, sets our capacity for many things, and it's hard work to change it. Possible, but difficult. I had a major problem with anger. Couldn't name it, feel it, express it. Becos in my family that wasn't ok, or safe. Dad was very angry, but internalised it, so that for me as an empathic type, I could sense it in his footsteps.Knew it when he punished me. It kept me cowering, and i still have trouble expressing anger appropriately altho lots of work (and regret for inappropriately expressed anger) has helped me. It's a more healthy relationship now and I allow it to do it's job, help with setting boundaries and keeping me safe.

Perhaps some of the childrens books about feelings may help you to learn the basics, and begin to understand how your emotions help you, not just how unsafe it feels to have them. There is one set in particular I'm thinking of but can't track down, but I guess use whatever resonates.

What are the PTSD symptoms? How does it manifest, if you don't mind talking about it? I'm a great believer in treating symptoms, esp when we can't get to the cause. That may help untangle the knots also.

Hugs

J*

[Jstar49]

Hi Em,

Ha, ecomama- yep, that's how I knew I'd enjoy connecting with you lol!

I have put a couple of the authors you recommend on my list to buy. Which Brene Brown du reckon? I saw 'Dare to lead' which looks appropriate for me atm. Stephen Covey also.

Thankyou, now I know where my Christmas money is going!

Cheers,

J*

[Jstar49]

Hey Tayla,

you seem a very empathetic person.

It would be difficult for you to understand ppl treating others in a hurtful way, I imagine.

Stay true to yourself sweetheart,

Love

J*

[Guest_4643]

Thank you Jstar, I try to be.

Hello to everyone here.

[Clues_Of_Blue]

Tayla, I understood your meaning. I don't like to make people teary, even in sympathy. Honestly, it tends not to occur to me that someone may empathise enough to feel that way, when I'm writing about such things. On the flip side, I appreciate the care that comes with your response to my story. Thank you.

[Clues_Of_Blue]

Hey EM,

It is pretty busy, isn't it? Kind a nice.

Haha, not averse to hippie things, or your nature in general. The inspirational quotes, though... ugh. Hate 'em. I think because they're usually used in such an offhand way, with so little thought, often ascribed to someone that had nothing to do with them. And they become automatic responses with so many people, instead of words offered in consideration of the individual one is interacting with. They are hollow, to me. I dislike hollow. /end rant

Oh dear, your partner's conception of "hippie" isn't flattering, is it? There are various ways to look at it, I typically think tree hugger rather than indiscriminately randy, haha. Sounds like that "friend" may have fit the latter description, though. Hardly a trait specific to hippies.

When you say expressing trauma reactions in words is "lofty", what do you mean? I think it just makes one go cross-eyed and daft trying to make sense of it...

All good, I didn't assume you remembered details, but it doesn't hurt to ask. I haven't actually come across the term "childhood schema", so you've given me a pretty good lead on things to look for. Ol' Blue is somewhat decent at research, given a few useful key words. I agree knowing oneself is exceedingly important, and knowing those close to one is nearly as helpful. I have done that more through the Myers Briggs Type Indicator, which is a completely different model for looking at personality. It's been a handy tool for examining some things about myself and others.

I'm not a fan of the term "cheating", it seems almost innocent like a child trying to win a game. "Infidelity" or "adultery" better describes it as the crime against decency that it is, in my opinion. Maybe I just have an archaic bent.

Blue.

[Guest_4643]

I understand, you've done nothing wrong Blues, all good.

[Clues_Of_Blue]

Hey J*,

I'll be honest, I'm often the someone the family are waiting for, so food is ready when I get there as a general rule. I live a bugger of a long way from anyone and am usually pressed for time around work prior to Christmas so any food or presents or whatever get sorted in the morning - it always takes longer than you think it will.

I agree. We're working on it. My siblings and I are all acutely aware of what we lacked, and refuse to perpetuate our parents' mistakes.

All good that you have your own stuff coming up, topics like this will do that. More than willing to listen if you want to elaborate on that tale. On the topic of fathers, I'm the one that talks to mine, neither of my siblings really want to. Can't say I'm emotionally invested, but it's a useful relationship. He's fairly financially savvy and resourceful, so it can be good to pick his brains about some things. He'll go into depth on any subject that isn't personal in nature. It is what it is.

It makes some sense that the early stuff sets the tone for where you go from there. We have had very different experiences with anger. That was one of very few emotions I saw modelled, so I had no problem with it. In many respects, it has been my friend - a protector and a motivator for change. I can see how your father's repressed anger would have made things hard for you as a child.

I hadn't considered children's books. Not actually a bad idea. I think I have a decent grasp of most of my emotions at this stage, but as I told EM, I tend to think on two tracks simultaneously. On one track I will feel a thing, on the other I will be disengaged and analysing it. The more I talk to people, the more I think this probably isn't normal. Makes meditating hard, I can be doing the exercise just fine on one track while my thoughts are running amok on the other. Sigh.

The symptoms are a lot less potent than they were. I would have vivid memories or visualisations when something would remind me of the infidelity (which came up a lot - it's a very common topic in most forms of media, including a huge proportion of the "music" that gets played on the work radio). Early on there were nightmares, too, on the nights I got much sleep at all. Constant intrusive thoughts on the subject, powerful bouts of the same emotions I felt at the time. Again, reduced in frequency and severity at this point in time, but still present. I never knew what to do with any of it, just tried to shove it down and get on with life.

Blue.

[Jstar49]

Hi Blue, and evryone,

I found it! The books are 'When I'm feeling...." (sad, angry, happy, nervous, jealous, kind, loved, scared, lonely). By Tracey Moroney. The reason why I thought of them is that I got so much out of them reading them to my daughters. Kids books are great actually. I love them, and miss reading them to kids. I think lots of dads miss out on the wisdom cos they tend not to read to their kids as much as mums do. Altho that's probably changing.

On my thread (which is titled something like" my estranged daughter is turning 21"- real catchy huh!) we're having a long convo about families and narcs and all that, so I'll not get into it here. My dad sounds a bit like yours, great to tap into sometimes. He can be very mocking tho, and he is close to my sister ( she works for him) so I don't trust him. I have confronted him about the effect his physical abuse/punishment had on me and he scoffed.

I can hear the truth in what you say about anger, how it helped protect you. Yes, I need to cultivate that more. I need to let anger be my friend, and to hell with what 'they' say. Because it's such a no-no in our family there's very little honest anger. mums scared of it. Carpet sweeper.

Were you scared of the anger you saw as a child? I don't understand it really so would like to know how anger can be ok for kids.

That stuff about meditation- I think thats normal. It seems pretty common to be thinking a lot during any meditation attempt, even tho you're simultaneously at peace with it. I guess the trick is to be at peace with the thinking. Getting into the practice of noticing, then letting go. Observe the thoughts, and let them go. Then observe the thinker BEHIND the thoughts....These are things coming back to me from my meditation days. Observe the pain of sitting, allow it to be there, let it go. The more you fight it, the more involved you get with the thinking, and the less detached you can be about it all. Breathe.

With feelings, maybe instead of encouraging the mental activity, you could focus on the sensations in your body with a feeling. So, anxiety. you might notice yourself feeling anxious, and then...ahh, the chest feels tight. Just observe it. Don't try to change it. It will probably change as you observe, or another sensation will take its place. You may feel hot, or notice tension, or smell something. There may be a thought associated, like.... I can't do this....Just observe. DO NOT JUDGE. Very important. It is all good.

Zen 🙂

J*

[ecomama]

Hey J* sorry to bump in Blue,

"that's how I knew I'd enjoy connecting with you lol!"

Thanks that's sweet! Me too with you and ALL of you!

I have put a couple of the authors you recommend on my list to buy. Which Brene Brown du reckon? I saw 'Dare to lead' which looks appropriate for me atm. Stephen Covey also.

Have you seen any of Brene Brown in her online clips?
Her very first Ted Talk?
Perhaps her Netflix special "The Call to Courage"?

She's progressed in her depth of "density" around her ideas A LOT over the time since her first Ted Talk.
I think one needs quite a lot of "prerequisite knowledge" about her concepts, her research and her 'style' of delivery (which may frustrate some ppl lol) before embarking on any of her later books.

I have her 1st book "Daring Greatly" and I believe this is a great place to start, after viewing as much of her online stuff as possible.
The title of hers you mention is for "leaders", and even tho we're all leaders of some type, it's for management and not so much a personal growth beginning at the beginning book.

OMG Stephen Covey is the BOMB! too lol.
I only bought his book "The 7 Habits of Highly Effective People" BECAUSE I couldn't find the one for families. Wow... putting the 'People' one in practice saw me get promotion after promotion till I worked for the Federal Govt. Amazing!

THEN I found his "The 7 Habits of Highly Effective FAMILIES". It's beautiful and amazing also.
I believe that it helps bond families SO WELL to become independently interdependent lol... for us it also gave us a strong foundation of resilience.
No doubt that the VALUES that he speaks of were the strengths that had us withstand such incredible abuse through the Courts.

"Thankyou, now I know where my Christmas money is going!"

Lol awesome.

Happy reading!

EMxxxx