Not sure if I can have kids (mentally)...

[Raven66]

Hello,

I am not in a very good place, particularly right now - I ride between Anxiety and Depression regularly, self-helping with the anxiety has been helping although I still have a ways to go, but recently the Depression has hit me again hard. My primary thoughts revolve around life purpose, and kids... I am mid thirties now, but don't know what to do.

Most people around me are having kids, and I know my husband wants a child but I don't think I had ever really wanted them (deep down I thought I would just suddenly turn all clucky over children and want one, but if anything I think I have gone the other way!) I don't enjoy being around kids, I don't like holding kids, I get irritated by them very quickly and usually just get away as fast as I can...

I have really tried to want to have kids, really tried to think about life (with or without kids) and I am utterly lost... I am quite sick of hearing "it's different when they are your own" (which may be true) but it doesn't help at all to keep hearing it - just makes me feel like a damaged/broken female because I don't want babies.

Aside from my strong family history of Depression (quite severe) and other medical conditions, I can barely keep myself above the water, so how would I be able to cope with a child? Aside from being terrified of the actual pregnancy and birth process, it is not something you can change your mind about half way through, at the end you have a dependant, for life.

I know I'm stewing on scenarios that haven't even happened, but I'm scared I will panic... I practically panic just thinking about it, the life changes involved, being stuck at home (if COVID-like situations return in the future), etc.

I don't want to have one for the wrong reasons (as I don't know what my mental state would be like, given that I don't want to and see no joy in it) but I feel the pressure, particularly from my husbands family, which is again the wrong reason.

I don't know what I am asking here, it just feels like a rant. I wonder if any other women feel the same?

Would the stress actually impact the health of a baby if we tried?? I suspect it can't be healthy...

I have to pretend I am never going to have kids to just get through the days when the pressure feels intense, or my worrying and stress brings on horrendous migraines/headaches. I love my pets, love my hobbies, love my husband - but I can't seem to mentally cope with the idea of having a child...

Thanks for reading

[Tay100]

Hi Raven66

Welcome to the forums, we hope you enjoyed our online space so far. We are here to listen and provide help where we can! Of course rants are welcome too hahaa

Firstly, I'd like to point out that what you feel is normal, valid, and natural. No shame here. You aren't alone in wanting kids, being concerned about pregnancy, and about any potential health concerns. What I suggest that you be clear with your partner- communication is key in big conversations like this. You could write down what you feel and why, and what triggers these thoughts. This might give you some clarity before you speak to him. Please don't feel pressured to do anything you don't want too- that's if you want to wait before having kids to mentally prepare, gather information about your health concerns, or actually not have kids at all. What do you want?

Let us know how you go,

Tay100

[ecomama]

Hi Raven66

I think it's AWESOME that you know this about yourself!

You've listed so many reasons why you don't want to have a child or children and I would support you 150% in NOT having children.

I have my own opinions of what the 'right reasons' are for having a child but ONLY for myself. Never would I try to talk someone else into having a child. That's lunacy.

You express the 'right reasons' for NOT having a child and I congratulate you.

You would absolutely have to be 100% on board with ANY eventuality of every part of this process and these are NOT "easy" processes whatsoever.
I would predict if you are not willing to go through whatever it takes, indeed the outcomes would be miserable for you and probably for the child and your husband too.

It's like me saying "I have to get dogs. Everyone around me is telling me I must have dogs. I don't like dogs, in fact I can't stand dogs around me at all. I already have enough on my plate with MH issues and I'm afraid of the responsibilities but can someone change my mind about having dogs?"

The answer would be no. No one should try to pressure you or try to change your mind either.
You can be a great Aunty, wonderful wife but most importantly you can true to yourself.

It's YOUR body, YOUR life and YOUR decision.

I've worked with families for decades. I've seen too much to think anything is simple in raising children. It's not. Especially when the headspace of parents is not altruistic.

I applaud you for knowing yourself.

EM

[Emmen]

Hello Raven66,

Welcome to the forums.

Regardless of what we hear, not all women are pre-programmed to want a child. There's nothing about you that's damaged because you don't want children. I know couples who have either chosen not to have children, or are simply holding it off until (and if ever) both parties are ready. Unfortunately, the idea that all women want babies and that there will be a turning point in a woman's life where she wants babies is so ingrained that individuals like yourself are made to feel inadequate.

You're right that having a child is a lifelong commitment. You can't change your mind halfway and that is a terrifying prospect. While some may tell you that children are rewarding or that they're happier that way, it doesn't mean everyone will feel the same way, especially when you weren't even mentally ready to be a parent in the first place. Again, unfortunately, we live in a society that plays down how much it takes of a woman to have a child - mentally and physically. Not to mention the years after spent raising a child. It's actually good that you are thinking through the longer term issues, although I'm sorry it's causing you to be depressed.

As far as I'm concerned, you not being ready for a child simply means that you should stand firm on not wanting a child. I understand the thing about pressure - honestly, on the day I got married, people were already anticipating a baby without even asking us if or when we wanted a child! So yes, that societal pressure, especially from families and friends will always be there. But ultimately, it's your call because it's your child. It's important that you're ready for that (both physically and mentally) before you decide to have one. If one day, you feel ready, then you could try. But if you never do, there's still nothing wrong with you. You're fulfilled in other ways (through your pets, hobbies and husband), and this is a perfectly good way to live as well.

Have you spoken to your husband about how you feel and about your concerns (esp over the mental health issues and concerns over coping with a baby in the long term)? If you can get his support and understanding, none of what anyone else says (even if it's his family) should matter because you're both on the same page.

Warmly,
M

[imbadwithnames]

Hi Raven, welcome to the forums!

I am exactly the same as you. I do not want kids at all and have been told literally my entire life "oh, that'll change, you'll come around, it's different when they are your own" ectect. My family have a history of mental illness along with me, who is very mentally ill too, plus had a rough childhood and would never ever want to inflict what I went through on another child. I even had a random stranger tell me (when I was talking about how I am going to have a small child around due to someone close to me being pregnant and how I wasn't looking forward to having to deal with all that) "Oh, it will be good practice for you when you are older with your own". (like what?)

The fact of the matter is, people like you and me are not predisposed to want kids. I volunteered in a pre-school for literally around 3 days and was just like "Do I want one of these? NO. NO I DON'T".

I think all of your reasons are perfectly valid and I am so proud of you for standing your ground on this. Some people have kids just because their partner wants them and then end up resenting both the partner and the kid, which is nothing that any of us want for you.

I think the best course of action is good honest communication with your husband about your very reasonable and valid concerns. If you feel like you may struggle doing this alone, couples councilling is an option with a person who is trained to deal with exactly issues like this in couples.

Maybe they might even be able to help you work through your own issues so you can come to a compromise that you both love. If you got married there is a fantastic connection there, and I think it is fair to assume that you will both be willing to work out a solution that you both love.

Rooting for you, keep us updated when you feel comfortable!

[ecomama]

That's such great advice i'mbadwithnames.... it's all so true.

I laughed when you volunteered at a preschool for "literally 3 days" and KNEW you didn't want 'one of those' lololol.

What a brilliant thing to know about yourself! I honestly applaud you both!

I'm so sorry you feel the pressure of family and society etc, it's such a load of balony.
I think "society" has a LOT of catching up to do with the random comments made off the cuff.
How does anyone know anything about a stranger?
Some people may have been trying desperately for years to have kids and a comment like that, can have horrible impacts.

The pressure on me was UNBELIEVABLE from all angles from about 18yo and that's too much. Fortunately I did want them. Maybe not quite in multiples but that happened too.

Because of the pressure I went through, I sat ALL of my children down many times and said to them "Don't ever think I need you to have children for ME. I had you to have YOU. Not to predestine you to have children for me."

Well done guys.

EM

[readyforthevoid]

Please know you are not alone in feeling this way. In fact there is a whole school of thought about not having kids.

The thinking goes that by having children you are exposing them to a world of guaranteed suffering. Please think of our current events and their consequences. Consider climate change. Consider overpopulation. Consider the many medical issues that can go wrong with your child, all because you succumbed to a biological impulse, coupled with pressure from society. As a woman you have so much value beyond your womb.

Please read the wikipedia article regarding antinatalism. Please have a look at books such as David Benatar's "Better never to have been" and understand the concept of his "Asymmetry principle."

This life is not sunshine and rainbows. Real suffering exists. It is dark. If we had to contemplate the totality of suffering worldwide in the next minute we would be broken. We are shielded somewhat because we live in a developed country.

Us antinatalists do not advertise who we are and what we believe for obvious reasons. The fact is the concept has existed for thousands of years in Buddhist canon.

I will leave you with a quote from a respected philosopher, Arthur Schopenhauer. "If children were brought into the world by an act of pure reason alone, would the human race continue to exist? Would not a man rather have so much sympathy with the coming generation as to spare it the burden of existence, or at any rate not take it upon himself to impose that burden upon it in cold blood?"

My antinatalism comes from my absolute disgust at suffering and empathy for those who suffer. Every corrupt politician with their snout in the trough destroying people's livelihoods. Wage slavery just to have shelter. The fragility of our world (COVID). The aftermath of this and the ripple effects on the economy. The fact is that people overestimate their happiness. The lie that suffering somehow confers meaning in an indifferent universe.

Of course I could go on forever, and I am not the pariah you might think I am.

[Tangney]

Hi Raven66, I agree with Imbadwithnames and others who have posted replies. I chose not to have children at a very young age and have never regretted that decision. I'm at an age now where people have stopped bringing it up and asking questions. I never felt the biological pull. However, something that has started to happen to me more recently is that I'm now asked whether or not I'm a grandparent, so the whole thing has come full circle, something that I never even contemplated when I was younger. I think you're right to stand your ground because being pushed into making an irreversible decision that's permanently life changing just to make others feel comfortable usually doesn't go well. I've seen the consequences of those who've While I wouldn't change my decision, I wish I had been more prepared for the price that I would pay socially, as lots of thing happened because of it that I didn't expect: 1. I've lost relationships where the other party couldn't accept my decision. I had to learn that it was important to lay cards on the table early on so that expectations wouldn't be misplaced; 2. I lost friends as they began to have children. Many gravitated away from me and towards social groups of other parents. As time went by, we had less in common and their interest in my life waned, as my lifestyle was outside of their lived family experiences; 3. I was expected to be completely fixated on friends children and their development etc. Friendships that were once balanced, rich, and grounded in years of being close moved to being distant and, in the end, on their terms only if the friendship continued to exist at all; 4. Women without children are often mocked or seen to be somehow lacking in human understanding and care (remember a former PM being called barren?); 5. Invisibility is an issue as their are very few depictions of mid life childless women in the media; 5. Women who are childless, not by choice, tend to feel resentful of us; 6. It can be a lonely and isolating experience and if you choose to stay on this path, especially if people around you don't understand your feelings, it will be important for you to try to find groups and seek out others who are in the same position who you can socialise with. There are a couple of really good podcasts on the ABC website about what it's like for women who choose to be childless. In saying of all this, I wouldn't change my decision for anything. Good luck.

[Guest_4521]

Hi,

I am a mother myself, with mental health problems I have had my whole life.

If you really, really, REALLY don't want them, don't have them. It's your choice. You aren't "broken" because you don't feel the urge, and a woman who does have the urge isnt superior to you, either.

You don't need kids to be fulfilled in life, male or female, mentally fit or not, pink, purple or bright blue with green spots.

You can only be fulfilled by having kids, if you want them in the first place.

[Raven66]

Thank you everyone for contributing to this thread - it is great to get perspective from others experiencing the same (or experienced - those 6 points were very interesting learnings!) and to understand that I'm not alone in these thoughts.

I actually have great open communication with my husband (he knows I REALLY struggle with any difficult conversations) and I usually start with a few text messages, A). because I can't talk or just cry and can't speak, & B). I can read it over and over until I understand it more myself and articulate it clearly - once the worst is out I can then seem to talk with him calmly. He knows far more than my family will ever know...

I have spoken to him about this - and while he can't deny the hope that I may change my mind, he will not put pressure on me to do anything because he also doesn't want me to have one for the wrong reasons, particularly if health is impacted. I just can't turn off the little inside voice that says "you're crushing his hope" - that's the depression.

I really appreciate Tangney's response - having chosen this path. I have already noticed my drifting away from friends who have kids - there was always a regular barrage of, "so, when are you having kids?" and the blank look my husband had not knowing how to answer politely. My anxiety was (and is) the severe dread around this that I would often just stay home instead to avoid these intrusive questions (and I also see the point of women who have been unable to conceive easily being, as you say, perhaps resentful of my decision - which is why these questions are bad!). Avoidance became a great deal easier with COVID, although it will prove its negative effects later when I struggle to make connections with people... (but that's another problem in itself).

I truly believe that kids just aren't the right path for me, unless my thinking drastically changes in the next 5 or so years... unlikely.

I just don't know how to let go of the guilt that I feel (societal pressure!!) if choosing this path - or the (perceived or blunt) disappointment from families... I don't want that to hang over the decision.

Thank you again to everyone who has contributed to this thread, I really appreciate the open forum space.