Do I have complex PTSD, BPD or BP? Help.

[Evie81]

Hi guys,


Just tapping into a communal knowledge base here. Thanks for reading.


I am diagnosed as having Bipolar Disorder, I am on medication for this, which seems to have performed miracles for my depression. I have been hospitalised for BP several times, for a manic episode, a mixed episode and twice for depression.


A possible BPD diagnosis has never been brought up by any of the psychiatrists that I’ve seen. In fact, I’ve asked and it has been denied by 3 different professionals. However I feel that my symptoms have a lot in common with BPD, mostly the abandonment issues, and then there is the obvious overlap of mood instability with BP.


I have been with my partner for nearly 7 years and also enjoyed long-term relationships before this. However my partner and I have been struggling lately due to a relocation and him starting a high pressure job with long hours. We have been on the verge of breaking up and started seeing a relationship therapist.


A central theme within this therapy are my abandonment issues. I experience tremendous anxiety and/or rage when he has to go on yet another business trip, arrives home late or is not truthful about his whereabouts. I come from a family of junkies and lies about whereabouts/what they were up to/not returning home resulting in me living with family members, and 2 foster homes, were normal for me. In this context one might be able to see how this sort of trauma would affect future relationships.


Our relationship therapist has floated complex PTSD on my part, this as well as several issues my husband is facing with lying and confrontation. Meaning we are on opposite ends of the spectrum as I need accountability and truth to make sure I’m ‘safe’ from past experiences. If not I can become hypervigilant, anxious and erratic. He says he lies because a confrontation can result in strong emotions on my part and round and round in circles we go.


From my understanding complex PTSD is often interchangeable with BPD with the main difference being the abandonment issues. Obviously not negating the overlap with BP as well and one can see a red herring emerging.


My psychiatrist denies both the complex PTSD and the BPD and says everyone, including him, has abandonment issues. My reactions are perfectly in line with what to expect when a partner lies and walks out to avoid confrontation according to him.


Should I ask for a second opinion? What do you think?
 

[quirkywords]

Evie,

Welcome to the forum. This is a sharing, friendly and supportive community.

I can see that you are searching for an answer to your symptoms. What do you think would be different if a dr agreed that you had one of the other disorders you have mentioned?

Do you have a good relationship with your psychiatrist and do you trust his opinion?

I am not a doctor just a person with a lived experience. if it is very important to you to have another opinion that is up to you.

Do you feel your medication while helping with your depression has not helped with your mania.?

I was diagnosed with bipolar when I was 16 many decades ago. I was in denial for years and then took medication which helped stabilize my moods. I have wondered over the years at times if I have been correctly diagnosed but in the end I decided the medication works with few side effects and I don't have the huge highs and lows that wrecked my life for years.

Thanks for your post as it raises question about diagnosis and what is the most effective way to treat your symptoms.

Quirky

[Just Sara]

Hi and welcome to our BB forum community Evie;

I'm sorry you're dealing with Bipolar as no-one deserves to go thru its symptoms; being hospitalised isn't fun either. I'm wondering what your intent is by seeking even more disorders to label yourself with. CPTSD and BPD aren't diagnosis' to want, I can assure you.

I'm glad you've found great medication support because this can be a dicey ride for some. Bouts of depression or mania are insidious so finding the right mix is, as you say, life saving.

Your childhood sounds upsetting; i'm sorry it was like that for you. Being thrown around from one family to another would've been really difficult to deal with, but you seem to have come thru it well thank goodness.

You're an intelligent woman with loads of insight, a caring husband and 7 yrs together. It's nice you've found your Mr Right. I sort of understand his rationale though re lying to avoid conflict; my ex used to do the same.

When men are constantly being confronted about their behaviour, it can wear them down causing angry responses or withdrawal. Projecting our fears onto them isn't helpful. Instead, ask for what you want and he should do the same. This type of dynamic isn't about any disorder, it's about relating in ways that promote better communication and intimacy.

Abandonment issues should be something to work on, not analyse all the time. It's in the here and now recovery happens. Changing your patterns of behaviour once identified, can make a world of difference; to both of you.

I've been diagnosed with cptsd and wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy. Dissociation and the fight/flight/freeze responses I've dealt with have broken me in the past. Recovery has been a long winding road with very frightening moments. So please, just focus on your psychiatrist's recommendations for now; life will be so much more calmer.

I have a pinned thread on cptsd called; 'Complex PTSD - what is it and how do we cope?' There's also a pinned thread called; 'This Bipolar Life' which is posted on regularly by members. It's a long running thread you might find really interesting and helpful.

I'm here most days if you want to talk or ask questions.

Kind thoughts;

Sez

[Evie81]

Hi both,


Thanks for your responses! Very insightful, and both of you are absolutely correct in questioning my motivation for not being ‘satisfied’ with my diagnosis.


I trust my psychiatrist implicitly, he has done amazing for me on the medication front and I still see him every fortnight for therapy and support. He knows me best by far and for sure is the most authoritative person on the subject.


I guess in the back of my head I’ve always questioned if my diagnosis is correct seeing my struggle with abandonment issues, which is at the core of BPD, and my partner saying that I can be very black and white in my reasoning. Albeit this usually as a result of me questioning his lying as he sees the truth as more of a ‘grey’ area, something that entirely baffles me.


My medication has done me the world of good and you are entirely right that the diagnosis doesn’t matter if you found something that works for your symptoms. However that still leaves me wondering if my abandonment issues are an ‘untreated’ symptom.


I had never even heard of CPTSD until the relationship therapist floated it. I obviously gave that a little Dr. Google and found myself in some symptoms, like hypervigilance, but certainly not all manifestations.


I guess that all psychiatric disorders have some sort of overlap, with mostly the same genes and/or trauma being at fault. My psychiatrist almost had a laugh when I brought it up with him and questioned why a relationship therapist would attempt to label me. Still it shook me particularly with articles floating about pointing out the similarity between CPTSD and BPD, the diagnosis that has as always plagued me in the back of my head.


I guess in that sense my partner is right in that I can’t live with a grey, or rather under question, area.

[White_Rose]

Dear Evie

Hello and welcome to the forum. You have thrown an interesting mix into your post and I wonder why you feel this way. You know we all have symptoms of just about any mental illness you care to name. In the physical medical world there obvious differences between medical conditions. A broken leg does not end up being diagnosed as the 'flu. Or at least if this happened I think I would be suing the doctor for malpractice.

Many of our MI have a depression component because we get depressed having a particular diagnosis. I had a little chuckle to myself when I read about your psychiatrist denying you had BPD. My psychiatrist believes labels are not useful. Instead she believes it's better to treat the symptoms as they arise. If you are examining someone's childhood it is to find out out what sort of childhood it was, not because it means you have a certain diagnosis.

We have had many arguments because I wanted a 'diagnosis' (hence the chuckle) which she was not prepared to give. It seems I am not the only one to believe having a specified illness is helpful. I have come to agree with my psych because it leaves me free to explore myself and what I feel/think/say/do without feeling some of it does not fit the diagnosis and is therefore irrelevant. If everything is on the table, so to speak, we can eat the elephant, one bite at a time.

I have abandonment issues and get very anxious when when my therapist goes on holiday. Not logical I know but it happens. I am getting better at waiting, which is really my issue, and do not believe the psych will never return. It is hard. Can you talk to your psych about whatever troubles you rather than wanting to fit it into a tidy basket?

Quirky has asked What do you think would be different if a dr agreed that you had one of the other disorders you have mentioned? What do you think would change? Your psych has helped you with BP and given you meds that are working well for you. What if he had not said you had BP but the pills would help your moods? Would there be a difference in how they worked?

Using myself as a model I think telling ourselves we have ..... is more because we can relax and feel our MI is not our fault (which is true) and we cannot do anything about it (which is untrue). How does that feel to you?

Looking forward to your reply.

Mary

[Evie81]

Hi Mary,


Thanks for being so welcoming as all of you have been! Thank you!


It’s funny how you mention that you worry, or rather no longer worry at this time, that your psychiatrist will return. This is exactly my problem. I’ve read about this and I think Freud coined a phrase, the name escapes me now, which was about infants trusting their care giver would return. A developmental stage that is crucial to developing trusting relationships.


I obviously would not remember a stage this early in infancy but given my family history this might well be the case, as I thoroughly believe that my loved ones will not return upon any unexpected departure. Which causes me extreme panic sometimes resulting in irrational rage. As I told my relationship therapist ‘I fight to keep my husband’, which is obviously paradoxical, that at the very least.


I’ve also read this is one of defining characteristics of BPD.


But this does not answer your question. As per your question, no, do not believe a diagnosis would make one iota of difference to the ‘cure’. However obviously BPD is a very stigmatised, probably unfairly, diagnosis which leads to you being pushed back in the mental health system and not being taken seriously.


To be frank with you I’ve always suppressed my more BP like symptoms, ie abandonment issues, to professionals for fear of being labelled as such. However I am now unable to hide them in relationship therapy, with my partner laying out his problems with my behaviours. Talk about mirrors.


Again, the diagnosis makes no difference to the cure of course. Yet I still wonder where I fit for want of a ‘tidy basket’ as you mention. Not that it’s helpful of course but this might be another of my challenges in my struggles with coming to terms with my mental illness.

[Evie81]

Freud object contastancy; 

[quirkywords]

Evie,

Thanks for your replies and for your honesty.

I have learnt from your replies and from Mary and Sez.

I understand more about your Ned to have your abandonment issues. like your psychiatrist I think that many people have abandonment issues but they may manifest themselves in different ways. My partner was adopted at 9months having been left in a baby home . he has abandonment issues.

I know that I used to think when I had another issue on top of bipolar I may have another label but now I just deal with my behaviours and focus on how I can change them. Whenever I forgot something I used to think I had dementia like my mum did. I also think I have some Asperger qualities but as people say we are all on a spectrum of most mental illnesses.

i am glad you trustnyour psychiatrist.

How would it feel if you saw your abandonment issues as just that an issue you could change and learnt to live with, rather than as an untreated symptom.

Is your relationship therapy helping you.?

Thanks again for your willingness to explain your feelings.

Quirky

[White_Rose]

Hello Evie

Thanks for your reply, so open and full of insight. May I ask you for a favour? BPD and Bipolar have such similar initials that I am unsure which condition you are talking about. When you write BPD it's OK but when you write BP it can be unclear which you mean. Can you write BPD or bipolar to differentiate between the two please? Ta.

I believe insight is really the basis of managing any MI. There's not a long way to go if we do not recognise what is amiss and admit it to ourselves. And this is where I am (now) agreeing with my psych. Labels mean little or nothing in a positive way. Being labelled a bright student sounds very nice but puts on the pressure to constantly perform. So what happens when that student is unwell? And does being bright mean the student can shine in every subject? I think this relates very much to psychological conditions.

You are right that BPD tends to give you an unwelcome label though I would be extremely concerned if a psych of any persuasion refused to take you seriously, refused you treatment or help on those grounds. Indeed it makes me feel you are better off without a diagnosis, simply a group of mindsets that you struggle to manage. It seems to me that once given a diagnosis to you the therapist may start looking for the symptoms that you do not have and concentrating on those.

To be frank with you I’ve always suppressed my more BP (BPD?) like symptoms, ie abandonment issues, to professionals for fear of being labelled as such. I know it feels helpful to 'know' what's 'wrong' with you. And we can obsess over this until we become incapable of thinking about anything else. If several psychiatrists have said no to BPD please accept they know what they are talking about.

You may have some of the signs and I am willing to bet everyone here has at least one of the diagnostic symptoms. In most cases it is a minor issue that can be blown out of proportion. I know I worry about abandonment stuff but it's only one part of BPD. You need to look at the severity of each symptom as well as their presence.To give a physical example, the difference between a mild cough and pneumonia. When your difficulties reach the pneumonia end of the continuum then it's time to worry.

It is a struggle to reach a useful understanding of whatever MI you have but remember it's not the be all and end all of the situation. What do you think you will do if the your psych agrees you have BPD?

Hope I have clarified a bit more.

Mary

[Evie81]

Hi both,


Thanks so much for both your insightful responses.

You have both really put my mind at ease. I guess having been smacked with one label always leaves you wondering where the end of your ‘insanity’ is - the sort of unhelpful talk my psychiatrist would scold me for 😉


The analogy about the mild cough to a pneumonia is really helpful as it the advice to see my abandonment issues for what they are rather than a symptom.


The relationship therapy is definitely helping albeit bringing up issues, as mentioned tiresomely over my past few posts (sorry!), that were previously buried in a cemented coffin 6 feet under, or more like ignored on my behalf.


These are the joys and harrows dug up by therapy.


I shall become more active on the forum as I can see how a little support and reassurance can go a long way for those struggling.

Thank you both again!