Discussion: The Nature of Depression

[Automaton]

This may be a bit of a grim topic, so either don't read on, if it's too hard to read, or try to bear with me, but I've been thinking about the nature of depression, and I've been wondering, is depression what makes a chased animal (prey) stop when it is caught, and when it realises there is no hope of escape, stay down, and give up their life for the benefit of their predator?

You see, I've come to realise that when I am depressed, it is usually a time when, ultimately, I see no way to live and make it in the world, when my own life and survival seem completely hopeless with certainty. As soon as there is the slightest glimmer of hope that I can survive and my life will be worth living, the burden on my heart and mind lightens, and my recovery from depression begins. As long as I act on it, of course.

I wonder if this is depression's natural purpose -- to numb our senses just before sudden death, and reduce our physical suffering. If this is the case, then naturally it is only intended to happen just before we are killed, and not the way it happens in our human lives, where depression becomes its own prolonged state of mental and emotional suffering, when we are certain there is no way to make it. The reason we fall into such a prolonged depression has to do with our thinking lives, and in that case the cure in most of our instances is to *do* (without thinking too much), to connect with our inner calling, and seek genuine meaning in our existence, wherever we can find it.

The most important thing is to realise that we are depressed either because we don't see any hope -- and so we need to get out there, explore, and find it (because, trust me, it *is* out there, always -- you just need to look outside the box you've been put in) -- or because our body is out of balance, and giving us the wrong signal -- in which case, for our health, we should take conscious effort to bring our body back in balance (with nutrition, medication, routine, healthy lifestyle, exercise, whatever it takes).

I'm not sure if you're able to follow my reasoning here, but feel free to post your thoughts in this open discussion. Everyone's perspective matters, and there are no right or wrong answers here.

I am thinking that by rationally understanding the reasons behind depression we can learn to better help ourselves when we are down, learn what we need to do to end it, and learn to predict its coming (to an extent).

Would love to hear your genuine thoughts and experiences.

[BballJ]

Hi Automaton,

Great post! I was a little unsure what I was going to read from your first sentence but it well worth it, a very, very interesting take on depression and one that seems majorly valid as well. I seem to think depression can have a lot of meanings to different people, I have never really given it much thought about why it comes about, partly due to the fact my mental health is really anxiety based and not so much depression, but I understand that state of depression as well. The feelings of constantly being let down, feelings like you are not good enough... depression I think is our body and minds way of trying to combat those feelings. I like you reference to the animal being chased by a predator, it made a lot of sense in my mind.

Keen to read other people's thoughts.

My best for you,

Jay

[geoff]

hi Automaton, a good post and I'm sure there will be many people to contribute, my big question is why does our 'brain chemistry' suddenly change, although we are told that 'it includes genetics, changes in hormone levels, certain medical conditions, stress, grief or difficult life circumstances as well as we know it’s not imaginary or “all in your head.” Depression is more than just feeling “down.” It is a serious illness caused by changes in brain chemistry.
So does the change in our brain cause depression or is it a situation that makes the chemistry change, well I suppose both, but the psych's would know, but it doesn't matter because once we get depression we don't care where it comes from all we want is for it to vanish.
Perhaps at first we are like the prey and lay down to cop what ever happens, but at some stage there is a need for survival even though the pain is excrutating, maybe I'm just someone who doesn't know,although I know what depression means. Geoff.

[Automaton]

You do "know", Geoff, your intuition and experiences are very much valid -- don't ever put them under, or underestimate them. They hold the answer, and they are very much crucial to your own life, and to all those you touch.

So does the change in our brain cause depression or is it a situation that makes the chemistry change...

Personally, I think it's important that we get to the bottom of *why* it's happening. You can't really treat something effectively if you don't know the cause of it, and we can't rely on others to truly take care of our bodies, insightfully and responsibly -- only we can do that.

I believe, as it is medically noted, that depression can be caused *both* by your thought-world influencing your body, and your body influencing your mind. They are mutually connected. The mind depends on the workings of the body, and the body is controlled by the brain/mind, and therefore so are a lot of changes in it.

So, I think depression can technically be caused simply by a poor diet, or, more likely, a combination of factors that put stress on our bodies beyond what it is physically able to handle -- a "bad", unnatural lifestyle, as it were (and by that I mean the life we are forced to live). When stepping out of our old lifestyle and into a shocking, completely new one, depression often tends to vanish without trace -- I've found many personal accounts to this -- so in the case of the body influencing the mind, I believe to change the way we live and respond to things is what is most necessary -- to take on new routines, a new diet, and a new lifestyle.

Being autistic has taught me that I need to live my life to my own, to my body's, abilities and balance/standards -- otherwise I will only come eventually crashing down, and abuse and hurt my own body and mind with no respect for my abilities and limits. I think this is the same with everyone. Our body can only take so much if we don't listen to it, and push against its advice/counsel because we are told that's what you have to do to survive.

It's important to realise there are many ways to live and survive, and not every way is right for every individual. We are different, even our bodies are all different. We need to learn and respect our individual workings. You're welcome to challenge me, but I believe our body always knows what is best for it -- even if we are born with a disability, "faulty", or "different" -- there *is* an internal balance, we just need to learn to feel and recognise it.

[metester]

Thanks for your post Automaton.

My view is that depression is different for everyone and it is both a physical and mental illness. Unfortunately chemical imbalances in the brain are physical. Genetics play a huge roll in this. There are many triggers that cause the release of these chemicals and the body is unable to bring them back into balance or simply the body produces too much of one or the other. The view that society unfortunately has is that depression is simple and easily fixed by a positive attitude or keeping busy or exercising or simply "snapping out of it" etc., etc. I feel sad when I hear this because depression and it's causes are complex and I believe, cannot be solved by a linear approach. Depression also has degrees of severity and what works for some does not work for others. It is true that stability can be achieved through medication, psychotherapy, exercise, diet, relationships etc., or more commonly a combination of many. Some people have been very successful in coming back to happiness through these methods and some have battled for years having tried, what would seem, them all. Psychiatrists themselves admit to the complexity and superficial understanding we actually have of the illness.

Success in beating depression is also measured in many ways. For some it could be returning to work, for others mending family relations, others may be thankful for being able to maintain a daily routine and others simply pursue acceptance. Sadly for some, it can take decades and what they see as success is viewed by society as failure.

This is my personal experience with depression. It is complex, misunderstood and there is no "one size fits all" approach to recovery or it's definition.

[Flipflop]

I have read all that you wrote and most of the responses.

Agree on some aspects.

I managed to live a reasonably full life by hiding my depression, used to take to drinking in the end as I knew that it would help me sleep and easily blame others for how I felt. That worked for a while but one day you wake up and know that it is “you”...you are the one that is angry at life.

And that hidden anger becomes depression?

Or always has been?

I read about genetics, my grandad gassed himself, my uncle also committed suicide (mother’s brother) and my aunt (mother’s sister) literally gave up on life, she didn’t leave her house for years and when taken to the hospital, refused treatment and died. Not a good run 😊

It is in the family but it doesn’t mean that I have it by default, does it?

I have good days and bad days, tried speaking to a psychologist but that was a waste of time, he just suggested that I do tasks which I was already doing.

I don’t know what is the best approach, I have stopped speaking to my mother as she puts me down at every opportunity, even though I am an over-achiever, as some people with depression are, a way to compensate.

I am finding it hard to pretend that I am fine, when I am not anymore.

it is so frustrating, I have a beautiful home, no financial problems, support from my ex-husband and a hound that gives me joy everyday.

Why can’t I just “snap” out of my debilitating mood?

[Just Ken]

The best explanation I've seen for depression is that its purpose is to make people rest when they are ill. Unfortunately at least three things can go wrong. The reaction can be excessive so people are depressed for minor reasons, they can have a source of continuous inflammation like an autoimmune disease or they can be stressed which changes the way the immune system behaves.

[bigstar]

Great analyses.

My first episode of MD which landed me in hospital came after months and months of intolerable anxiety.

Since my research, I've realised the word anxiety corresponds with the release of adrenalin non stop on your body--putting most of your organs into overdrive and shutting down your digestive system. The body does this because it wants to give you the best chance at surviving a threat. Unfortunately there is no threat--without no threat -- most people enter a cycle of being anxious of anxiety--one you enter that cycle unfortunately it turns into a fire that fuels itself. After weeks of this style of adrenalin and almost no sleep my nervous system finally broke--the anxiety dissapeared and I landed in pure nothingness--some of the most intense depression I hope to never feel again. Giving up is the right word--my body on the physical level was convinced it was in the maws of a lion, waiting to be devoured, when in reality I was just in bed with no threat at all.

[ChrissyStar]

Your description about feeling like a lion is attacking (anxiety) when in reality your laying in bed...I've felt this many times.

For me...

The conclusion I've drawn is that there is a part of me that thinks it's going to sleep but another that doesn't want to because it's not healthy for the brain to be turned off all the time - so these two parts fight causing acute anxiety while lying in bed.

Unfortunately with me the depression wins and I lay in bed attempting to force myself to sleep, to not exist - sometimes causing headaches in my sleep in a self induced forced coma.

I swear I'm giving my self brain damage sometimes. But there's nothing to get out of bed for. I just can't do it. Like I'm possessed or stuck in a strong habit. I don't get it. Why i would "choose" to do this to myself.

II have mounds of fun stuff to do, ability, resources. ..but still i stay in bed flipping from acute anxiety and forced coma.

Recently I've moved to the lounge watching movie after movie - my brain is over being forced to do things it doesn't want to do.IIt wants to live!!! ---but everytime i stand up its just too hard. Not worth the effort.

Where's the relief?

Why on earth do i do this - why can't I just get on with my life!

......yes, I can relate to ypur post...you're not alone. It's ok - we'll get through it. Eventually.