Anxiety on questions regarding religion.

[NZthrower]

One claim giving me anxiety I have heard some religious people say of atheists is that atheists only deny God because they want to sin. I have been watching an atheist deconstruct this claim on youtube. He says that since religious people believe that God wants us to know the truth and is perfectly capable of conveying truth to us humans, those who make such an assertion would have to acknowledge that God has failed to convey the truth to atheists and thus sends them to hell because of their sincere mistake in belief. Furthermore, he also asserts that if the existence of God is self evident, then why would any sane person willingly deny it. I like to put it in the same terms as denying the colour of the sky to be blue. Furthermore, if it is so obvious that God would send you to hell for performing certain acts, why would you deny it just so you can sin for a while just to end up burning in hell for eternity? This really has left my mind in circles contemplating such things, and this could also potentially result in strain in my relations with my atheist friends.

Furthermore, there's also this common claim that some Christians think that if you repent to God for your sins, he will forgive you and you will go to heaven. However, I think any just god would see through any insincerity and only acknowledge repentance if it is sincere. Also, this brings up the question of having to be accountable for the consequences of one's actions and how God would view accountability for the consequences. Also, I'm in the process of wondering why is it vital to question everything, be skeptical of everything including beliefs you hold dear and not just blindly believe in every single claim you encounter. I'm finding this hard to do as I have an instinct to believe in all sorts of wild claims.

[CalmCat]

Hi NZthrower,

What a deeply intelligent post, I enjoyed reading it, thank you so much.

The beauty of life is to be skeptical about anything and everything. I believe in; what you give out is what you get back. And what I give out is love, with the hope that it comes back to me multiplied.

Stay safe and smiling.

Regards,

Doz

[therising]

Hi NZthrower

It is always important to question that which does not entirely make sense to us. When we suddenly begin to question beliefs that have been long held beliefs, it's typically due to a rise in consciousness for some reason. To go even higher in the way of consciousness may sometimes require us to let go of some of the beliefs that do not make sense to us.

Sin is an interesting one indeed. I once heard the origin of the word sin to be 'to miss the mark'. Sounds so much nicer than the concept that leads us to imagine forever burning in hell. Whether we've missed the mark in the way of showing loving kindness or we've missed the mark in a way that leads us to understand our self better, to work on hitting the mark is the goal in life. I believe this is where our focus should lie. While we're focused on sufferance, we're not focusing on ways of evolving to becoming great marksmen.

Personally, I was raised Catholic. Over the years, I've looked into the practices of a variety of religious faiths as well as general spirituality. In many different practices there are highly questionable aspects and ones that do make sense. I have found that what I can relate to when it comes to helping me hit the mark, I put into my psychological and spiritual backpack for my journey in life. So, you could ask the question 'What is in my friends' backpacks in the way of life?' If there is much in the way of kindness, thoughtfulness and love then they travel divinely, no matter who they do or do not look to to worship.

If your friends are divine people who occasionally miss the mark (as we all do), then you are blessed to have them in your life.

If you have an instinct to believe in all sorts of claims, I suggest this is based on your natural intelligence. Natural intelligence allows us to not only instantly dismiss that which does not make any sense at all, it also requires us to sit a while with certain concepts so as to see what sense we can make out of them. To wonder is a truly divine gift that leads us to become wonderful.

🙂

[geoff]

Hello NZthrower, a rather explosive thread to begin with, and welcome to the forums.

I'm an atheist but suffered from anxiety and depression which people would know and the many points that are raised, will create many discussions.

I know there are people who believe in God and I respect that, that's their choice and have no argument against that.

I just wanted to post this as I have to go out, but there are points I'd like to query, just as the opposite may happen.

Geoff.

[PhoebeWings]

“Sin is an interesting one indeed. I once heard the origin of the word sin to be 'to miss the mark'.”

That’s exactly what it means.

And for anyone who has any faith in words of the scriptures, don’t forget, it says clearly that we are all created in GOD’s image.

[geoff]

Hi NZthrower (NZ), I'm not sure 'atheists deny God because they want to sin' and that 'God has failed to convey the truth to atheists and thus sends them to hell'.

I don't want to make too many comments, but is there a 'hell'?

Interesting.

Geoff.

[NZthrower]

Something that also has been bothering me is this idea that if a god/gods don't exist or souls do not exist, then we're nothing more than just a collection of atoms/proteins and thus we don't feel anything. One counterclaim to this is that just as a novel is worth more than the words that make it up, a human being is worth more than the matter that makes it up. But part of me still denies it and thinks that the counterclaim does not make sense, that if we're made up of atoms/proteins, then we're only worth as much as atoms/proteins. It's because of the fact that my Mum subscribes to such a view on atheists that I have so much damned trouble trying to get around this.

[TheBigBlue]

Hello NZ,

This is an interesting topic. I guess I would refer to myself as atheist. But it’s not because I want to sin, it’s just that the whole religion philosophy doesn’t fit in my life.

so no, I don’t believe in a god, nor the devil, nor heaven or hell.

it might seem odd to you, maybe crazy, but believing there is no existence in any form after death is exactly what I believe.
But these differences in opinion between us all doesn’t make one person any better than the other. And I am still friends with many different people with different religious beliefs. Some more strict in their practices than others, but as long as we can understand that we all believe in different things then there is absolutely no reason why we still can’t be friends.

For me, I value other things in people. Are they trustworthy? Reliable? Kind? Respectful? And a whole bunch of other things. For me religion doesn’t play a role in what I think of someone. I respect their opinion to believe or follow in a religion, but I also would hope that in return the same respect is returned to me.

i grew up in quite a strict Catholic household, church every Sunday, going to confession, doing the first communion & confirmation etc.

But none of this stuff fitted my view of the world. My dad still goes to church every week (well, before the pandemic) & I don’t think any less of him for going. It’s an important part of his life & I wouldn’t want to take that away from him.

So even though we all have questions, or may be uncertain about our own or others beliefs, there is no right or wrong, or good or bad.

Theres just differences. And that’s what makes our world & it’s people amazing!

[zachery_f]

The question of atheism is actually a very difficult one. If a person doesn't want to believe in God, he cannot be changed.