Sexual Health and the Idea of Never Having a Partner

[Azzdog]

Hi everyone, I'm not sure how to put this but hopefully it will make sense.

I am a 24 year old male who currently is in therapy and sees a psychologist regularly. I have OCD, anxiety, depression, and autism, and when you put those all together, it becomes understandable why socialising is a major problem for me. One major cause of my current situation is the fact that I have never hd a girlfriend or had sex. Because we live in the digital age, it is almost impossible to avoid the fact that a lot of people are in relationships and that modern society is obsessed with the concept of sex. You would almost have to live on a deserted island in order to completely avoid all the triggers associated with it.

My cause of concern is that I have no one that I can relate to on this and that I feel like I struggle to articulate how bad it is for my mental health. My psychologist says that I am well in the normal distribution for young men but that doesn't really make me feel any better. Because I am shy, introverted, and have a lot of hobbies and interests that are not in line with contemporary society, I genuinely feel like I will never have a girlfriend, never have sex, and die alone. This fact alone has meant in the past 6 months, I have had 5 separate stints in a psychiatric ward due to concerns of my own safety. I was wondering if there are any other young men out there who feel the same way and are currently in the same boat, and if there are any young mens health groups around? I feel the latter would be important for me and reassure me that I am not the only one who feels this way.

[Azzdog]

I have values and principles that I have developed on my own. I don't consider myself a sheep or someone adopting certain values to fit in with a certain crowd. I have developed my ow identity and I am not going to change that for the sake of hooking up with someone. I have a well-developed personality, that I have worked on since high school, that is interesting and fun to people willing to take the plunge. You just have to get over my initial awkward stage (which doesn't ever really go away haha). I know this because I have had good reactions at Orygen in the group programs where, I have been told by the facilitators, that they believe I am looked up to as a leader. That meant so much to me, even if I didn't believe at first.

Whenever I hear stories of people losing their virginity at 13 years of age, it actually makes me incredibly sad. I feel like that the only reason they are doing that is because of the media and its obsession with sex. At 13 you should really be focussing on hanging out with friends, goofing off in class, just doing what a typical 13 year old should be doing. We are being forced to grow up so early now that there is no wonder why young people enter adulthood with a cynical frame of mind. I am incredibly cynical about the world because I've known for a while now that the world is not set up for you to win. It is set up for you to fail in and if you manage to break through and succeed, then you have defied the odds and beaten the system. I think we all undervalue how hard that is to do.

I guess you and I are quite different to the rest of the people our age. We see the world for what it truly is and that makes it harder for us to be content with who we are and find friends or a girlfriend. In that sense, it is not such a bad thing is it? We are empowering ourselves to be the best versions of ourselves that we can be by improving others lives which is going to give us so much more fulfilment than having a hook up. That is how someone improves their body image and their wellbeing. That is how you focus on yourself. That is what we need to keep doing because we are only going to benefit others lives and, therefore, our own.

[HamSolo01]

I know exactly what you mean re "might come off as a snob" because of your energy. I find that it can be very hard to socialise with a proportion of the population who are VERY extroverted and say a lot of things - most of which is probably throwaway comments. I'm really not one for small talk. I can see it is important for breaking ice. And that's why I like it. But then some people have a whole second layer of ice that it's hard to get past. People are impervious. I think the way in which society has become increasingly atomistic is to blame if I'm perfectly honest.

Fear and pleasure seem to be the two ultimate alternatives we have on offer. You either fear and act accordingly, or you are pleasured/pleased and act accordingly. I think you are spot on when you talk about how everyone just expects relationships to happen and then they are shocked when you say you haven't had one or been in one. Honestly, focus more on being able to chat - rather than being outgoing. Conversational skill is definitely more important, then I think focus on outgoing. Also, early on in the piece you have to open yourself up to new experience. This is essential. But once you've done it enough, you get used to things like introducing yourself, easing the tension in a new scenario and also just being "you"

"I have developed my ow identity and I am not going to change that for the sake of hooking up with someone. I have a well-developed personality, that I have worked on since high school, that is interesting and fun to people willing to take the plunge. You just have to get over my initial awkward stage (which doesn't ever really go away
haha). I know this because I have had good reactions at Orygen in the group programs where, I have been told by the facilitators, that they believe I am looked up to as a leader. That meant so much to me, even if I didn't believe at first."

Perfect. I did a group session once with a psych school and I was told similar. That tells me that both of us have qualities that people clearly find noble and good. That's always positive. The added assumption that people have with you according to that can sometimes be a hit to your self esteem. They assume you must have it good with women because you are a leader, easy to relate to, a bit different or quircky. But see how they are all conventions and assumptive in nature?

More on its way

[HamSolo01]

Some bloke once told me that he thought I'd have it easy beacuse I'm a tall guy, who is sociable, not skinny etc. It hurt me at first because I realised that there was a convention that I was X and then I turned out to be Y. Now that I look back on it, I'm kind of happy about that. It's a very silly thing we do. It's a bit like how we try to seek patterns in meaningless coincidences too I think - just one of those odd things we do as humans haha.

"It is set up for you to fail in and if you manage to break through and succeed, then you have defied the odds and beaten the system." Personally, I think the world is neutral. It's not even set up. It's just as it is and we choose to pursue certain things and then accordingly we find ourselves in whatever mess/success results. That's one of the mysteries of life.One thing I find that often gives me hope and can lift me up is hearing about how bad other countries have it. Where there is a constant threat of death - whatever it might be from. This puts the whole virginity thing into perspective I think. It's like "boohoo I haven't had sex, yet I'm living and breathing and more or less can survive my whole life in this place without the threat of death". I'm honestly viewing sex more positively as a result too. After my religious experience in my formative years, sex was a taboo/sacred thing only reserved for marraige and I think that is nonsense. I'm not religious anymore, yet I still see some value in waiting for the right person. One is quite vulnerable when naked, especially in front of another person. I guess it just depends on the individual's tolerance level for nudity in front of another person haha. Being secure in your body's appearance is also important - that's why I started working out a bit more too. I recommend that for the MH benefits. That's the primary reason why ANYONE should do it to be honest. Never do weights to impress "the chicks". It's shallow as haha.

"We are empowering ourselves to be the best versions of ourselves that we can be by improving others lives which is going to give us so much more fulfilment than having a hook up." Precisely. You know what's funny? I think people begin to respect you for that. If they don't then they have insecurities of their own. Live and let live right? I think I'm beginning to change slightly though.

More on its way still.... lol a lot to say today

[HamSolo01]

okay so, this is where it's going to get a bit more risque 😛

I'm asking you this with every good intention in the world so don't feel as if I'm judging you lol. Have you ever considered visiting a sex worker? Personally, I have a very liberal attitude towards that sort of thing. I think it should be legalised, and regulated (we can get into the politics later on haha) but it's something that's consistently crossed my mind. Especially in the past year now that I have a substantial amount of money haha. Initially I felt like it was gross or dirty, but I can't help but think that is my old religious mind kicking in - obsessing over what you do with your genitals etc. It's not relevant in the grand scheme of things.

Considering that libido is something that often comes up in questions of mental health, I can't help but wonder if visiting a sex worker would potentially break down some of that anxious, weird stigma I have towards sex. It's a thought experiment. The furthest I've ever gone towards doing that was googling places lol. I'm not even convinced that losing your virginity is even that important, so one can't help but think that sex workers are there for a reason right? I must be clear, I'd be doing it for my own sake - not just to lose my virginity. I actually don't consider it something that's important. I just hate the cultural obsession over sex. Having said that, trying to express your sexuality and understand it as a natural process is important - repression is NOT healthy.

Forgive me if I'm stumbling into weird territory here haha. But I believe sex is part of life, repression is as unhealthy as obsession I think. Have you seen/heard of "incels"? That stuff is creepy man. Really creepy. They more or less advocate for a system where women can be dispersed equally as if they were some sort of commodity. I think repression is to blame for that sort of thing.

Anyway, as I said it's a thought experiment. I'd be keen to hear what you have to say on that one. To make it clear, I'm not considering going to one because I want to please other people. I'm considering going in order to understand my own sexual nature. See the difference? Anyways.

I'd be keen to hear your take on that.

Hope you had a good b'day yesterday mate

[Lee lee 73]

Hey Azzdog and hamsolo1,

I'm a single female, 45yrs, unfortunately, never had a relationship (it is literally kiling me)- have had sexual partners.

How old are you guys, if you don't mind me asking?

I hear both your struggles with dating 😢

I seriously do think a sex worker is a brilliant idea. Sex workers are often suggested to assist with sexual health. We're all human. Or Even think about 'casual dating' on the apps - if you haven't already 😉

Lee lee 73

[Azzdog]

I struggle to socialise with very talkative people because I just can't keep up with them. Their minds a running a mile a second and I just don't have the ability to match with them word for word. In a sense I'm okay with that. I've learnt, in some way or another, to accept the fact that I'm not going to be incredibly talkative around every single person. That's practically impossible. I know that around certain types of people I can open up quite a lot so it's something I can handle.

It is the fight or flight response I think. Not that we are the violent types but its either stay and fight the bad thoughts or runaway from the situation that is causing the tricky thoughts. The statement about learning how to chat rather than being outgoing is absolutely spot on. I have never thought of it that way. I think I have been learning how to chat more these past few years, rather than being outgoing. The fact that people seemed shocked that we haven't been in relationships is something I'm going to bring up today in the meeting at Orygen.

That's true, I think thats why some people are so shocked I have never been in a relationship. They see me at group sessions or leading the group at the hospital groups they do there or the conversations I have with my clinicians, and they are all amazed and shocked it hasn't happened before. It makes me feel like I am doing something wrong on dating sites and the like and my bad traits are the ones being highlighted there not the good ones.

People have said the same thing about me. I am tall, broad shouldered, who has good social skills and a broad range of interests etc. and that's why I feel like I am dong something wrong.

I guess when I said the system is set up for you to fail I was getting a little political haha. I often find it hard to put myself in the shoes of those less fortunate than we are. When it comes to technology and food I can certainly do it. I have spent time overseas where food preparation and the like has to be considered a lot more than we do here. Seeing impoverished places overseas makes me appreciate the fact that I don't care for the latest iPhone or a really good car. The technology I have serves the purpose I need and there is no need to replace it unless its broken.

I need to start working out a bit more too. Its been hard due to my decline in my health over the past few months. But I am eating a bit better so hopefully I can start making other healthier changes

More to come

[Azzdog]

Honestly, I have given it some thought. I have done the same as you and googled some places. I probably went a but further and actually visited a place but couldn't walk inside. I haven't told anyone that actually but I felt very ashamed about it. The first thing was that the only way I could have sex was to pay for it and the other thing was that I was doing something waaaaay out of character for me. I have a liberal attitude o it as well and I believe it definitely should be legal as it serves a purpose. But I wasn't able to go in because it just isn't me. I felt very pathetic for the next few days after that experience.

My thoughts on this go back to the idea of having a body image/sexual health/young mens health group. I don't think just going out to have sex with a sex worker is honestly going to help me personally. It will be more of a business/transaction like process where it is more about having sex rather than making love. I guess thats the old soul in me coming out there haha. I think having a place to have a conversation about the cultural obsession with sex, talking and managing it in healthy ways, and meeting others around the same age as you would do wonders for me, and other young men I reckon. I don't know how you would feel about that. Repression is certainly not healthy. Giving people a space to talk about their own lack of sexual experiences would only be a positive. I just hope others see it that way as well.

I have not heard of that and that is really creepy and weird. And that probably comes back to my point about the need to talk about this more. That is definitely a sign of repression because we live in a society that takes this all for granted. People who struggle in this area are being left behind and have no voice on this issue. It means that they handle it unhealthy ways. Personally I isolate myself and have developed anger problems because of it. I harm myself and can be very hard to talk to when I am struggling. This is something else I am going to talk about today.

Thanks man, I did indeed have a great birthday. The first time I have said that in a LONG time. I actually enjoyed my birthday. Spent it hanging around good friends. Thats what it all should be about.

Hope you're travelling well at the moment dude

[Azzdog]

Hey Lee lee 73

I am 24. As I said in the post before this one I'm not sure if its something I can do. I felt pretty pathetic knowing that I would have to pay to have sex. I guess it is just the old soul in me coming to the fore. I don't get much responses on the dating apps to begin with. I don't know if I would get any responses if I wanted to start casual dating. I'm not sure I'd get any matches based on my previous experiences with dating apps.

[Quercus]

Hi Aaron and happy belated birthday to you.

Was reading quietly, saw the turn in conversation and thought of something I mentioned to Mitch/Hamsolo01 once. You mentioned you feel pathetic considering paying for sex. So what about asking a friend to help?

Whether it is to help you find someone you connect with or even if they'd consider a friends with benefits situation to help you build confidence in your sexuality.

I know plenty of people who have been in that situation. Where the relationship is more about company and friendship than passion.

There's been a bit of talk here about not knowing what women want. What's wrong with asking? You mentioned you have good friends. So why not ask if they can help? Tell them you want to experiment with a physical relationship but need the security of someone you trust and feel comfortable with.

Whether it is men or women nearly everyone likes company and to feel attractive and appreciated. I think if you find a trusted single friend it can be flattering to be asked... provided you are both clear about your expectations and boundaries.

Is this too out there or a possibility to consider?

[HamSolo01]

Hi all

I am 24 Leelee73. In a very situation to young Aaron here.

Thanks evryone for dealing with this topic kindly and maturely haha.

Well Aaron, you've gone further than I have. I understand your reservation though. I'd probs be the same. It actually reminded me of an event an old friend of mine once did. There were three young blokes just hanging around and then they decided to go to a brothel. They didn't actually have an intention of going there for any reason, just to walk in and then ask then go and leave. Just as a joke type thing I guess. Anyways two of them were in for it and the other guy was very reluctant. Like really reluctant. They weren't gonna do it, just go there and have a look. It sounded funny. But this one guy really didn't wanna go.

They all did and then left. But the weird thing now is that same guy who didn't wanna go in there now acts like he is a player because he has hooked up and has a gf now. He was the typical guy at school Who wouldnt hurt a fly but then gets a gf and now all of a sudden acts like Casanova.

Anyways. I'm. Not sure if yuou can relate to that or if youve seen it.

I think I've decided to focus on getting my TESOL certification done and then maybe work with that for a couple of months. Maybe I'll. Meet some new girls that way? Or I'm considering travelling to the US. Aussies are popular there haha 😉 so maybe I'll experiment a bit while travelling? Worst case scenario I go to Amsterdam, go to a sex worker, smoke too much weed and then move to Europe haha.

But yeah, sex worker is still an option. I find it comforting just having that as an option if I need it. Like a form of ammo stocked back. If I did then I'd go independent, I wouldn't go to a venue. That's my inner capitalist speaking haha. I'd prefer the money to go to the girl, not the venue. I've considered going to one but not for sex, just other stuff to break down the barriers. If you catch my drift haha...

Nat, I like your idea. Dating apps have that as an option. I think its harder to do that though than actually going on an old school date.

Also Aaron, I went on a tinder date a month ago with this gorgeous Canadian girl. She was born in Hong Kong, but moved back to Canada. The date was really fun, we shared food too. I walked her to her car coz it was late and a bit dodgy. And then I never heard back from her. It was a hard pill to swallow but I learned a lot about myself. So keep trying mate. I'm probs gonna leave it for a bit tbh.