Decades of depression and loanliness, where to now?

[QldMouse]

I’ve been reading these most amazing posts, from people who sound so nice and are suffering so much. Sadly I can relate so much to so many
people. With apprehension can I share some of my story in the hope of getting a reality check and possible advice.

Like so many I had a sad childhood which then turned to fear, shame, loneliness and depression in teenage and young adult years. A partner was found for me, I lacked the courage to ask her out. A short burst of happiness followed with the birth of a truly wonderful daughter who gives me the reason to carry on each day.

Sadly my wife comes with her own inventory of baggage and has suffered depression most of her life. Over our 20+ year marriage
I’ve tried to remain supportive but have done a pretty crap job, and after hitting a low point I started getting therapy. I’m told I’ve made
a lot of progress but I don’t feel it myself.

I’m exhausted, I feel so lost, trapped and alone. I have no friends, no life, and nothing but fear. I’m over the hill, accelerating down the other side with only a few years to go. My wife has sought help in the past but without success, and will not consider counseling or any form of assistance. She remains medicated, but it had an adverse reaction on me. I feel so bad for her and shame that I’m such a rubbish husband.

The therapist I’ve been seeing thinks I should leave and pursue my own path to happiness, but I think she underestimates how much that terrifies me. The fear of being even lonelier than I am now and losing my daughter, the one person that keeps me going, I just can’t cope with that. I still love my wife but our relationship has been poor for a couple of decades. We don’t talk honestly, and she is a bit harsh on me at times. I’m not saying I don’t deserve it, and I understand I’m overly sensitive.

My therapist says that I have qualities that women are looking for, but I am very skeptical. I am paying her to make me feel better
after all. She also underestimates how truly bad I am around women. I have suffered social anxiety since I was young, panic attacks and a morbid fear of women. I literally cannot talk to a woman I like, it is hard enough for me to breath in her presence. I dread to think what they must think of me, my deep breathing is not rudeness it’s an inability to obtain oxygen. Pretty poor prospects really.

I’m lost, can I help my wife? Can I help me? Can I help us or is it really too late? How do you tell?

Thanks for reading, be well everyone.

[White_Rose]

My Very Dear Mouse

You never fail to amaze me. Offering me comfort when you are in a pickle yourself. Please take care of you, as you are much too valuable to get in a tangle.

I'm not sure I am a social butterfly. I do need people but until a few years ago I had no support. While I was with my ex I was really alone and what's worse, had no idea I needed anyone or that it was possible to ask for help. I must admit pride had a lot to do with it, but really I had no idea.

While I talk blithely about going hither and yon I don't see it as light-hearted or socializing for the sake of socializing. I work quite hard in my volunteer roles, and they give me satisfaction and a feeling I am helping to make a better world. Just a little. Some activities include being with others while others are more solitary. In my social life I like to be with others and that is entirely for enjoyment. I put my book club, meditation and home group in this category. Occasionally I go to the cinema and there are functions at church I attend, but not many as I am still not comfortable with everyone.

All this has come about because I moved to my current home 16 years ago and started afresh. My world has expanded in an amazing way since I came here from Rosewood and I never cease to marvel at how blessed I am. Yes there have been some horrendous patches and this past few weeks has been very difficult. I think, because I am no longer afraid to ask for help, I can manage my life so much more successfully.

How did I come to this and was it easy?, I hear you ask. Well, since you've asked I will tell you. My church has always been important to me and this is where I started. The then priest was very good to me and also a retired priest and his wife. They offered, sometimes insisted, on giving me support and started the process of believing I was perhaps not such a horrible person after all.

I made friends in all sorts of ways, some totally unexpected, and I learned with amazement and sometimes fear, that I was valued. I have no idea why this happened but I am still learning to accept this. Living on my own has given me space and time to discover who I am and what I would like to do with my life. Being part of the BB family has been and still is an amazing ride and one I will not abandon in a hurry. Just now I feel a little fragile and cannot talk to many people without being overwhelmed. I am confident this will pass though I have no idea how long it will take.

Please take care.

Mary

[QldMouse]

Thank you lovely lady,

I think I just really got the impact warm salutations can have. That was a very nice greeting and turned my frown upside down right away, thank you.

I've been figuring out that my wounds run deeper and longer than I had really considered, this was prompted by a session with the dumb psycho with the uncomfortable chairs. I'm not sure how my nice lady with the couch collection would view his comments, I will need a long session to get into it next month I hope. In the meantime I'll need to keep smacking the black dog on his snout with a rolled up newspaper and spinning the sadness and shame around in my head like a mini whirling dervish. Oh brother, its going to be one of those posts isn't it. Sigh.

The frustrating part is that I started trying to fix this in my early twenties, even then I knew I was a broken person but had some smarts to know that. Looking back now, I'm very disappointed that in spite of over thirty years of therapy its only been the last two years that I've actually started to see some light. The enormity of my own stupidity is quite staggering, and the fact that it took an idiot two sessions to point it out. Ok, maybe he wasn't an idiot after all, just a rude blunt person with the IQ of a rock.

I'm very much full of the "shoulda, coulda, woulda's" right now. So much lost life, so much pain and sadness. So much frustration. I can see why people have expected me to explode, and maybe that would have been better. The health issues I have and have had due to stress are pretty serious. I just don't have it in me, I am so very tired.

You do amaze me, I've re-read your post quite a few times now. Sixteen years and what a journey? wow. I do see you as a brilliantly coloured social butterfly, and savior of the world, fighter for justice. You do have a colourful cape flowing out behind you don't you?

Your right of course, you did preempt my next question. How did you know that was coming? Reading those two sentences over and over there is a lot between those lines isn't there. I am so very impressed with you and your story, I really don't think I have the internal reserves to take a journey like that myself. I did actually try to go it alone and sort myself out a very long time ago, and it ended badly when everything got too much for me. Quite amazing I actually made it this far really.

Oh Mary, take care and be kind to yourself, and I will try the same. Deal?

[White_Rose]

Dearest Mouse

When we get into the later years of our lives and examine our wounds it can be a confronting experience. Most parents of children still living at home, whether toddlers or uni students, are usually too busy and too bound up in their children's affairs to consider their own lives. Once the younger generation have been launched into the world and following their own paths, parents turn to themselves.

This is both a good thing and unfortunately can be a harrowing time. I only left my ex when the children had left home and I was alone with him. No children to deflect the problems, even though they did not know this is what they were doing. So I summoned all my courage and left. And I needed all the help I could get, mostly from my children. To this day I do not know where I found the strength.

The wounds of my life are healing but that was something I could not foresee from where I was 16 years ago. In fact the fears and pain escalated in a straight line vertically. And I fell into the pit of depression big time. I never want to go there again, and I do not think this has happened even though I have experienced some very hairy times in the past five years.

One of my characteristics is being obstinate which has lead to missing out on help in the past. I have learned to be less obstinate but will not give up altogether. Obstinacy also has its positive side and without this I would have given up many years ago. Disengaging is a hard thing to do even when you have made the decision intellectually. It's far harder to let go emotionally. For example I found for quite a long time that I was watching TV according to my ex's taste and being very nervous when choosing a program of my liking.

These are small things but they kept me well and truly tied to him. I knew I could watch what I liked intellectually, but his voice in my head told me he would not approve. Silly really when you look at it objectively, which I never could, see it for what it was. Still took a long time to think for myself. The legacy of this is that I am quite vulnerable to being persuaded to act in ways I consider inappropriate and being quite sneaky and underhand because of the fear of being found out. Fortunately for me of late I keep my own counsel much, much better these days. It's hard work to get to where you want to be.

Looking at the whole journey in one go is frightening and a huge deterrent. Eat it like the elephant, one bite at a time. Forgive yourself first.

Mary

[QldMouse]

Oh sweet Mary,

I can not even imagine your journey, it scares the heck out of me. I am very humbled thinking about what you have been through, you deserve so much goodness in your life now. I so wish you well.

You are right of course, once you go over the hill and start accelerating down the other side parts of your life do seem to flash past in an uncomfortable stream of speed bumps. Having a child to focus on has definitely saved us in the past, I'll do anything to hold the boat together while my daughter is with us. If/when that changes I really don't know what will happen, but I fear exactly what your experience was. A cliff face of pain and fear going vertical, and I doubt I could hang on any more.

I did google obstinate, not because I don't know what it means because I have been accused of it, but I don't think that is really me (or maybe I am just being obstinate...). I'm too much of a compulsive pleaser, and really relate to the voice in the head whenever thinking of buying something, and the inherited TV taste. Oh brother. I love documentaries and so does my daughter. We very rarely get to see them though.

I already feel overwhelmed this week, these daily mountains are so daunting. I just want to make it to Saturday and get on the plane to go hide. I think that is the limit of my capability this week.

The thought of the magnitude of the challenge you have surmounted is terrifying, truly terrifying. The fact that you have been on it for sixteen years just floored me. When we first started chatting I was thinking a few years, I missed that by more that a decade. The thing is I can see myself going through something similar, with the TV tastes, the harsh voices, the shame and fear and my own peculiar load of baggage. I lack a support network though, without any friends I doubt I could make it.

I did get a small taste of elephant (not really of course, I'm an animal lover) and really don't like the taste (ie. loneliness).

Thank you, lot of thoughts there. I'll stay in the hole shaking with a tight hold on my morsel of cheese.

[QldMouse]

Hello lovely Mary,

Just have to get a therapy post out, I hope your week is proceeding well and you are feeling better and happier. I've been running what you've said about your journey, and the conclusions I've jumped to (got to get exercise somehow) and I have so much respect for all you have accomplished. You are an inspiration to be sure.

I guess some journeys don't end, I think I had that discussion a few times on a couch or chair.

The lessons do seem to be that people need people. That is one thing I keep reading out of your posts, and we have spoken about this a bit early on, I have not forgotten. I know I am happier when I do get past the fear of being social. Ms Couch keeps saying "practice" and that repeating the challenge makes the pain wear away.

Now 48 hours from departure, oh my. I don't know if I can post from over the water, I think they only permit posts from Australia. If I can't, I will miss this thread greatly.

I am hanging in there, working very long hours to make everyone else happy as usual. I have a high state of panic around how everyone will survive without me, and if they will even notice I have gone!! Our discussion over the needs of the many vs the needs of the one is also circulating in my head. My we have covered some territory have we not? You are or course right, and I treasure you council. Maybe you should become a councilor as well, your advice is better than most I've paid good money for. Seriously, you know I'm right.

Sorry, got to go. I was just bursting to talk/blog to someone even briefly or I'll burst and it will be a mess to clean up.

All the best sweet lady.

[White_Rose]

Oh Mouse, I do so want to show you how to reach into yourself and know how strong and and brave you really are. I remember an episode of Voyager where Janeway is talking to an alien (who else) who had been asleep for many hundreds of years to find his wife had died in her capsule and he was regretting her fear of life. He asks Janeway what she would do when caught out by the rain. "Would you scuttle from shelter to shelter trying to keep dry or would you walk through the rain and get wet but showing you resilience?". Janeway looks at him in surprise and says, "Me! I'd take an umbrella".

I would love to give you that metaphorical umbrella.

My journey was just that, my journey. I think there were many points where I could have taken a short cut but missed the opportunity because of fear. There were times when I wondered if I enjoyed being hard done by, playing the part of the victim to get sympathy. I know there were many times I wanted to give up and I have no idea where I found the strength to refuse my ex offer to return. I think it was because I knew it would always be on his terms and if life was not good while we lived together, having escaped but returned it would be far worse.

I had no friends to speak of when I left. I battled on my own and went to a psychiatrist who was not the best. Falling asleep while I was talking to him was the nicest thing he did. Always late, often sarcastic. I was quite afraid of him I later realised. My GP took a long time to convince me to leave.

I stayed on the journey because of my children, even though they were grown up and had families of their own. I also stayed because of my obstinacy. You say you have this characteristic so I feel you would manage. Remember, not all of the 16 years were terrible and I had many happy times. I am merely defining the beginning of my walk to freedom and joy.

Please don't let my experience stop you from doing what you want to do. We are all different in needs and coping ability. I believe you have the ability to do what you want rather than what you have convinced yourself is the best. Perhaps you should read a little more of the good Dr.

Any change is painful to some degree and to step out onto the road, like Bilbo Baggins, taking nothing with you (metaphorically) is the hardest part. Once there it does become easier. Well, this is your journey and if you can take away or use any of my journey please remember that putting one foot after another will get you there.

Mary

[White_Rose]

My Very Dear Mouse

Just read your second post, the one above mine. I hope you got a chance to read what I said. Also I hope you get a chance to say goodbye for a week and a half. You can post on BB while you are out of the country. BB is reserved for Oz residents but when you go on holiday out of Oz you can still post. I hope you do

Saw my GP this morning and she insisted I wait a fortnight before I see her again. Such dereliction of duty, however I do have a couch appointment next Thursday so maybe it won't be too bad.

Yes, you're right, people do need people. Not as props but as fellow humans who interact with each other. Making the effort is hard and like everyone else, we both shrink away from doing something that may cause a bit of tension and discomfort. As your couch has remarked, every time you get out of your comfort zone you are smoothing the prickly bits. One day you will find they have dropped off.

Just a thought, who said you were responsible for the welfare of others? They are responsible for their own happiness. You cannot do this for them no matter how hard you try. I think it's a way of running away from your own responsibility to make yourself happy. No one can do this for you either. I know, oh how I know how hard it is. I also know the rewards, the peace and the triumph of self over adversity. Imagine every time you take a step forward I am playing Fanfare for the Common Man by Aaron Coates (spelling?) for you.

Enjoy your holiday and don't forget the photos. A pity we cannot put them on BB but I think that would lead to some serious clogging of the system.

Mary

[QldMouse]

Oh sweet Mary, A white rose by any other name would smell as sweet ...

Could not resist bashing the bard, I find myself in a very strange state of high panic. Like I am rewriting that old movie High Anxiety. Shame about Gene Wilder, a very sad recent loss to the world.

That is a huge amount of brain poking content in those two posts. I remember Janeway and that alien. She had off the cuff replies down pat didn't she. I remember the Myth Busters episode where they proved that running through rain got you just as wet, if not more than walking through it. And the chance of going arse up was reduced. I actually love the rain.

The first post reads like you just came from my lady of the couch. I think you two would get on, perhaps too well. Everything you say about your journey adds to the mountain of respect I have for you. You are so right about children, really the only reason I'm still here and have hung in the last few years is because of my daughter. I have some hope, it has taken a great pounding the last few weeks like hope got mugged and robbed. My hope did have some change in a back pocket so I'm still eating.

I had to go alone and restart my journey several times already, like Bilbo it has been over high peaks and very low valleys. The peaks were nicer.My couch says I have "resilience". I know my energy and reserve is at a real low again, I'm looking forward to the plane tomorrow and 14 hours across the ditch. I sleep well on planes.

On to your second post, thanks for clearing that posting question up. I am taking my laptop on the journey, I'm lost without one and work is an issue. SO I hope to be able to post, and worst case I'll be back in just over two weeks.

Your GP is pacing you!?!?! Ok. Well have a good time with your couch. But it still looks like you have been parking on my couch, we had a very similar discussion about my compulsion to assume the worlds problems. If I ruled the world there would be some sorting out done all right. I had a very hard time in parts of the world I worked in, in Australia people have no idea of the suffering. I need to move on, injustice is one of my triggers. It is easier to prioritize the world and all the little creatures ahead of me.

Thank you for the theme song, I always liked the tune and now it will be in my head for days.

Please take very good care of yourself, and I hope the next few weeks are uplifting. Goodbye for now and hopefully the next communications are from the other side of the Pacific.

[White_Rose]

Wonderful Mouse

I am going to miss your approach to writing for the next couple of weeks. Such lovely, pithy word pictures.

No need to use the A word when offering bardic quotes to me, no matter how mangled. I love it, probably more so since this has been the first time anyone has said anything so lovely.

Have you been watching the re-run of Voyager? I bought the set of DVD some time ago as well as The Next Generation but still watch them on TV and get annoyed by the ads. Janeway does appear to have it all. It was nice to see her in some episodes needing to rethink her actions. It's been so long since I watched The Next Generation I find I have forgotten most of the episodes, so when I see them on TV it's like watching a new series. And Will Riker gets younger on every episode.

I was thinking last time I saw my couch, how funny it would be if it turned out we both talked to the same couch. Given that we appear to get the same lectures etc. I think I must ask if anyone calls her the couch. I know my psych would find it amusing and immediately get the reference. Trouble is she may be too smart for me.

Why is it I keep getting the impression you are going on holiday alone? I thought this was to be a family holiday with your wife and daughter. Or maybe I am picking up the vibes that you would like this to be a solo trip. To quote another well-known figure, "Please explain".

I'm told I like to stand up to injustice. It does get me going a bit and, like you, I get easily carried away and it takes ages to calm down.

My GP often talks about resilience and the need to become resilient. If she would just wave her magic wand it would all be over and done with. She has this idea that I must do it by myself. My GP is one of the strong women in my life and she cares what happens to me. Can't argue that.

Not sure I saw the Myth Busters program but I had heard this on some program or other at least as far back as 2010. I remember because it was the last time I visited the UK and I discussed it with my friend. So now I take an umbrella or walk through the rain with less likelihood of falling over.

Keep the music playing in your head. It will help you to continue moving forward. Come back greatly refreshed.

Mary

[QldMouse]

Hello Mary, and the rest of the community I suppose.

I hope you are well, happy and enjoying life again, and your poor car is feeling better. I'm so glad you liked my assault on the bard, only a wee word play.

Oh my if feels so long and yet so quick (and filled with chaos) this last almost-week. There have been real highs and real lows. But I have limited time and internet here so onward. Voyager, love it ... have some of the set on DVD. TNG, would like the set, but its on a long list. Riker, haha on yeah, and when he shaves his beard and has a chin smoother than an androids bottom. Or not.

Time running out, got to run sorry.

Be safe, well, and happy. Almost half way.