No touch, No intimacy, No sex

[radish58]

Hello,

I have been married for 42 years and I love my wife, though at times I feel empty,  sad.

I am a social person, I talk to just about anything,  I keep myself reasonably fit.

The relationship with my wife has gradually become frustrating. We are for the most good friends, while I am an outwards person, my wife is happy to watch her favourite shows on television,  or a streaming channel.  If that makes her happy, I don't have a problem.  

My wife does suffer from anxiety and at times as I have said to her, it is not so much what she says, it is her tone of voice, it can deflate me.

Our marriage, we had ample sex and if the children weren't around she loved me carresing her body, especially hey bottom, just gentle rubbing.

Our sex life has taken a nose dive, I mean it is non existent. Each time the mood is there, something takes it away,  the mood dies completely. 

This morning as I walked behind her, I gently touched her bottom, she was dressed as was the case most times except,  in the bedroom, her reply " would you stop doing that ". I said you used to love that, stone silence.

Yes she has body issues,  I am her husband, to me it makes no difference. I saw her naked the other day, her response " can i have some privacy " , I replied I am your husband, again dead silence,  I walked away.

We have 3 beautiful adult children and 2 of the best grandchildren.  We see each other at least once a week.

I feel torn, I do get upset, angry. I have retired just 5 months ago and although helping out family keeps me busy, I ask my wife where would you like to go on a holiday? 

Her response is family or the painful one, we can't afford it, I ran a successful business for 38 years, she was all for selling and retiring, we made money, we have money. I am questioning whether I should go to Bunnings and get something for a project as she makes m3 believe I am wasting fuel, now I don't know what to do. I do know th8s cannot continue and I will again try and raise the matters. Thanks for reading. 

[white knight]

Hi Radish, welcome

Reading your truthful post I cant help but feel there is an underlining problem you might not be aware of. Her blunt replies that aren't really full explanations is not in line with the respect you'd expect in such a overall successful marriage.

Holidays- "cant afford it" well I'm your vintage and if younger I'd even tent it if it meant going outdoors. We caravan it now and even an old caravan isnt that expensive, the problem appears that there is no eagerness to go on a trip otherwise she'd think up ways to overcome the tight money situation (from her perspective). We live on our pension and are able to save money each fortnight so I question her attitude and that negative attitude could be her focus on the grandchildren/children and/or that secret real issue. Playing guessing games is a technique my ex wife would use and frankly it's not necessary and can end up destructive... hence you arrive here.

Tone of voice. This is the same as myself, anyone's tone of voice to me signals there attitude. I really cant understand why she cant maturely say "can we talk"... and mention the issues. This lack of direct but fair, gentle and reasonable communication isnt much to ask for and without it, it leaves you in no mans land. As you have been recently retired she has signalled that you should even drive to Bunnings, a mans retreat, so it is like you are bound by your immediate area. We've been retired for 10 years (DSP) and there has been times when money was short but we've talked things through and found a timeframe and my wife has encouraged whatever concept I've dreamt up, but she knows that a flat blunt response is demeaning and she knew my ex wife so she has a clear understanding of my limits.

One idea is to ask her for a detailed and long conversation without distractions. At that meeting you bring up all the issues and write them down. Give her ample opportunity to answer fully. Then go away and review her answers. After 42 years remaining together is still not a given, because your mental health, freedom and pleasantness around people you are in the company of will be your priorities as retirement continues on. So those meetings will enable you to make up your mind about how to overcome the problems of abrasiveness, love making and affection. Clarity is the intent, once you have it then your mind is clearer, one way or the other.

This might be relevant.  A relationship I had for 10 years (not my ex wife) was erratic. I took a liking for buying a trike- 3 wheeled motorcycle. It would cost $40,000. I ran a business so it would be a business purchase and all the benefits of that concept.  My partner held the purse strings and she had allocated a pocket money arrangement for me. It was adequate but not for buying a vehicle. She then said "if you want a trike save for it our of your pocket money". I told her, "my calculations are it would take me 42 years". In a nasty tone she replied "then you better start saving". With other issues like step children we soon parted and I ordered yellow!

Some partner forget that marriage is a compromise that each member is there to ensure their partner is happy and everything is negotiable.

Reply anytime

TonyWK

[Fiatlux]

Hi Radish58,

I will only assume that you are both of retirement age.

I am a 56 year old female going through hellish menopause. I also can’t be touched or hugged as I feel like I am about to suffocate or worse feel like a volcano is erupting inside me.

Husband is 61 and just doesn’t get it no matter how many times I try to explain it. He’s also a touchy man with a high sex drive.

Have you ever considered that your wife may also be going through depression due to hormone deficiency or imbalance?

Dont take it personally but aging sucks for many of us. I understand exactly what she may be feeling and going through. Losing estrogen is like losing your womanhood. Things don’t improve as we age, it’s down hill from here but she may need medical intervention to help her through this time of her life. 

Wishing you all the best but don’t let her go and don’t discard her as many husbands do when we are at our lowest. Fiatlux 

[therising]

Hi radish58

I think one of the hardest things to contend with in a marriage at times can be inner dialogue. If we could hear our partner's inner dialogue, everything would make so much more sense. Sometimes delving into a partner's inner dialogue, through open and honest communication, can be the way to go. The challenge though becomes about both people having or giving themselves the freedom and courage to open up and express what's going on internally. Sometimes a partner can be facing so many different triggers we're not even conscious of.

To offer and example of inner dialogue and a trigger, as a 53yo female who's on the super cuddly side (not what you'd call slim), mirrors have become a trigger more in life now than ever before, especially straight before or after a shower, while I'm standing there in all my glory. The bathroom mirror can trigger the harsh inner critic in me to come to life and it can get pretty brutal. Just some of what it sounds like, 'What the hell has happened to you?! You used to be so beautiful. Now look at you. Your hair is grey, the amount of lines on your face continue to increase and you're so overweight it's repulsive. How could your husband love that?!!!' and on it goes. On a far lighter and self loving note, the same mirror can trigger a far gentler facet which can sound like 'Throw some colour in your hair, blue, pink, purple or whatever. Bring your hair to life. Don't be so hard on yourself. Remember, inside that body you find 'repulsive' you grew 2 amazing human beings. You are colourful, you are the producer of life and you are beautiful'. Inner dialogue can really mess with a relationship at times. No matter whether my husband says to me 'I love you no matter how you look', the harsh inner critic can chime in with ''No matter how you look' just means he knows you're fat but he accepts you and your fatness anyway' or 'He's just saying that because he wants sex' or 'He's just saying that so he doesn't get in trouble'. Sometimes a husband just can't win when he's up against his partner's harsh inner critic. Can be seriously tough competition.

Without going into too much detail, while my husband and I have drifted apart in a lot of ways, the intimacy side of things has actually taken a completely different turn. It doesn't mean what it used to. Now, it's about energy and imagination more than anything else. In regard to the energy side of things, if what used to give your wife a 'charge' was a caress of the bottom, maybe that produces no charge anymore. So the questions could involve 'What would create charges or triggers of excitement that can be felt?', such as simply tucking her hair behind her ear, 'How can I trigger my partner's imagination in exciting ways, like never before?', 'What experiments could be done in the way of experimenting with each other's increases and decreases in energy during intimacy (a wonder filled/wonderful and exciting roller coaster ride)?', 'What if it simply became about having fun and a laugh on occasion or on other occasions it was a form of stress release or maybe even a form of increasing each other's energy levels out of a low?' or 'What if it was all about getting my partner excited throughout the day in ways they can relate to (aka 'a long lead up through foreplay')'. Btw, sexting can become a thing for older couples. Of course, important to delete the texts. Sex can be used as a resource for many things. If depression could be a factor, a possibility Fiatlux mentions, romance can go a long way for some. My personal definition of romance is 'Anything that speaks to the soul'. Depression can be such a soul destroying experience. If you can bring a person's soul to life in ways they can really feel, the kind of charge that creates can be a life changing and naturally exciting one in some cases. If you're willing to venture seriously far outside the square, 'How to bring a person's soul to life through sex' could be worth researching. While it may not be your cup of tea, you could find it's hers. It could bring a whole new and exciting facet of her to life. 'Tea parties' could take on a whole new meaning. 

[radish58]

Hi, I am male and about to turn 66. I sold my business 6 months ago and transitioning into retirement. I am married , 42 years, we have raised 3 children who are all now successful young adults. I have posted once before " no touch, no sex" about a month ago and thank you to those who responded.

I have had a number of discussions with my wife, things have changed since I sold my business,  I am around home more often, doing things I haven't been able to and enjoying the tasks, I am getting back into surfing,  which is truly my happy place along of course with family ( goes without saying).

I never thought myself as being anxious, my wife yes. I received a message from one of my daughters yesterday saying of a funny experience my grandson had that day. I arrived home from an exercise class and asked my wife did she also get the message? She replied NO, i began telling her and she kept saying spit it out, why is he at the hospital, i said his not,  and told her the message, the enjoyment was taken away. My wife said " I have lived with her for more than 40 years, I should no". I replied you think the worst with everything. 

This is her anxiety,  we barely spoke after that, I sometimes fear repercussions regardless. 

This got me thinking I am also now anxious,  I never used to be.

I have raised her anxiety before and suggested she talk with someone,  I am here to support. My wife has shot getting help or anxiety down.

She says she needs space, our marriage isn't in a good place, I am trying my hardest, if our children were home now, with the at times toxicity of our marriage,  I would not stay under the same roof, the negativity would worry me too much. 

I will seek help for my anxiety, I am generally a cool, calm, collected person, after last nights episode,  I became too realise, i think I am now an anxious person,  the test I took here confirmed that.

Some work ahead it seems, I am going to take it on, I hope my wife does as well. 

[indigo22]

Hi Radish58,

I had a look back at your other post as well to get a feel for what might be happening in your marriage at the moment. I am only a bit younger than you but I don't have a partner so I am going to talk from the perspective of what I witnessed when my father retired.

As others have advised, there could be many reasons for your wife reacting differently but I have not read anything so far coming from this perspective. I don't know your wife's personality so you will need to be the judge of wether or not this could be a contributing factor.

My mother was very set in her ways, was a stay at home mother and had her routines she had been doing for years while my father was working. Certain days for certain things like washing day, shopping day etc.

When my father retired, he was very restless at first, wanting to go out and do things together. However, that did not sit well with my mother because she was so stuck in her routines. She was used to having the days to herself and suddenly he was there all the time and I think it took her some time to adjust to that new dynamic after all those decades. Is there a chance that something similar may be happening here?

With respect to her reaction to the message, if you know she tends to think any message is going to be "not good news", then start by saying you got an amusing message, or something along those lines, so that she is not steeling herself for the bad news. I have been dealing with depression for most of my life which means I am often thinking about things that have happened in the past, but with anxiety it is the opposite, it's worrying about what might happen now or in the future. So with that in mind, could you become more mindful of the way you approach a conversation that is not "bad news"? It's also a fact that we women are more emotionally wired and some of our reactions can confound the unsuspecting male. It never hurts to ask if there is something she wants to talk about when you are confused by her reactions.

I hope this helps a little, feel free to continue this conversation if you wish.

Take care,

indigo

[radish58]

Hello,

I am a 67 year old retired man. I sold my business 18 months ag9.

My partner of almost 45 years broke her knee while evacuating a friend's home...ceiling collapsed.

My partner has had anxiety for a number of years after I would say a workplace incident. 

She is now in recovery. 

1 week after her accident her eldest daughter gave birth to our 3rd grandchild. We were to look after her son during her hospital stay.  My wife's injury made that not possible.  While family stepped up,  she was nonetheless upset. Her anxiety from what she went through peaked and to her credit sort medical help.

Our other daughter just gave birth to her 2nd child and our 4th grandchild. We were meant to look after her son during the hospital  stay, her injury didn't allow for this, so our other daughter stepped up, that was until the day before the birth, she and her family came down with the flu. So we stepped in along with the help of family. 

What has become apparent to myself and other family members was her depression.  Her sisters have individually spoken to her as has one of our daughters and myself.  She refuses to accept it, even her doctor asked her was she depressed,  she said no. The stress, the good and the bad has and is on a daily basis

What can we do.....please  

[therising]

Hi radish58

Your wife is so truly blessed to have such a deeply thoughtful and caring partner in you. For you to be researching a whole variety of ways in coming to help and serve her (including coming here) speaks volumes as to your nature.

I think different people can experience or may consider depression from different perspectives. For example, while depression can be considered by some as a mental health condition that you 'have' or depressed is something you 'get' or 'become', the question may be 'How does my wife experience this depression she's in?'. If you were to ask her 'At the moment, do a lot of things feel soul destroying?' and she answers 'Yes, they do', you can then ask 'Do you feel like you're in a soul destroying depression or hole in the ground, which you feel you can't get out of without someone helping to raise you out of it?'. So, a less clinical and more natural approach.

For some, the mind/body/soul approach can be more relatable. From this trifecta approach, you could say 'A lack of soulful experiences in life (soul), which can create a hell-like kind of inner dialogue (mind), is definitely not good for dopamine production (body/physical chemistry). Is your wife more so a natural or soulful kind of person, who's less about mental issues and chemical deficiencies or imbalances? Another possibility could involve you addressing 'Has the level of exhaustion, experienced through ongoing stress, reached depressing levels' or 'Has this soul destroying lack of energy become depressing?'. If life is the feeling of plenty of energy running through us (chemical energy included), the opposite of that can be a depressing sense of lifelessness.

Sometimes hitting on a definition of depression someone can fully relate to is what can bring about a much needed revelation for them. Wishing you and your wife only the best in regard to the way forward.

[radish58]

Hi

My wife had an accident nearly 3 months ago. She is doing real well with her exercises. 

I have been caring for her with family assistance. 

The problem we have is communication. With my wife, it is not so much what she says. It is the tone used to say it. This has also been picked up by numerous family members,  mostly on her side, as well as our daughters. 

This was occurring before her accident, and since being her carer,it has got worse. I appreciate that her injury has impacted her day to day life. Still, when her own sisters pick up on it, that's not good. I have told her this numerous times before, and often it gets turned back on me.

It was decided by both of us that I have a few days away, and I did.

Coming home was more like I had just gone to the shops or something. It wasn't like I had 3 days away. Her communication makes me go silent, or my defences go up, and I speak up, and she now says, " All right, you win". I respond " where is this winning coming from?" I will be doing housework and in my mind get criticism over the smallest of things. The other day I was transferring clothes from the washing machine to the dryer, I do that and go to another room to get something and come out with her yelling " come on it should only take 30 seconds ", I was behind her and asked " who are you talking to "? She replied " no one." I want to help her recover from her injury and I will. After that I am not sure. I love her, we have 3 lovely adult children all doing their own thing, 4 grandchildren. We both deserve to be happy and enjoying retirement.

Her accident aside this has been going on for so many years I truly can't remember. Does anyone have any suggestions on how we can move forward? It is getting harder every day

[Croix]

Dear Radish58~

Welcome back to the forum. Looking be it seems your partner who had had an injury and may be depressed as well as feeling she cna't look after the grandchildren when needed has developed an abrasive and accusatory manner towards you.

I do realise these started before the incidents incidents and relations between you had not been good. A great pity as being together for over 40 years is something to be valued.

It look like the the change must come from her, you are already doing most of the work around the house and do not mention picking fights.

May I suggest two things? I hope they are possible. Firstly couples counceling may be of great help as it introduces a third disinterested party. I'd recommend Relationships Australia - 1300 364 277, and if they do not have an office near you then the may know of an equivalent. They do have a sliding scale of fees depending on circumstances.

The other thing is your wife needs both a physical and mental set of tests with her GP during an extended consultation. These should also examine the possibility she is depressed, has anxiety or has some other mental health issue.

Trying to get your wife to agree to these may be difficult, however your daughters and other family members may be able to help.

I'd also hope they support you too, trying to face all this on your own would be very hard.

You know you are welcome here anytime

Croix