I need suggestions on what to do

[samaz]

I started dating my now wife when we were 16 and both living in different towns. We would talk on the phone regularly and send letters and see each other every few months. I had feelings for her that were way to strong for that age but never told her. After 12 months i enrolled in a course in the same town and moved there excited to be able to spend time with her. When i got there she told me that she had cheated on me ( at this age cheating meant kissing) and that she wanted a break. She developed the relationship with the other that she had cheated on me with while on this break with them both regularly sporting fresh love bites. After a few weeks i lost my virginity to a stranger that i had no feelings for in a one night stand. I hoped that she would find this out so she might feel what it was like to be hurt. I left town soon after this to start a full time job in my home town.

i didn’t see her again for around 12 months but when i did she came up and hugged me and said she was sorry and that her and the other fella were over. I apologized for what i had done and was happy that they were over because i wanted to start again. Soon after this she started a full time job and moved into her own flat back in her town. After a few months our relationship became sexual. I was quick to tell her how i felt this time around because I didn’t want to lose her again and told her that i wanted to be with her forever. She responded that she also had feelings for me but she wasn’t sure about forever. She told me that she had lost her virginity to the other fella and that they had a strong sexual relationship. Over the next decade she trickled me information about her previous relationship while our relationship blossomed and after 3 years we became engaged and she moved to live with me. We lived together for 2 years before getting married and had our first child 2 years after marriage. It was at this time she told me that she didn't completely end things with the other fella when we got back together. I was hurt but didn’t press for details i just asked that she cut all communication with him.

during the next 16 years we sailed along as any other married couple would but she always said that i shouldn’t have any social media accounts as this was something women did and men didn’t use it. I knew this was wrong but did what she asked anyway. During this time she was very protective of her phone and I didn’t have access to her emails or any passwords.

fast forward to a month ago and the kids now use her phone and social media more than she does so i am suddenly able to see everything. I noticed that she had the other fella in her facebook friends. I approached her and said that i had asked her to cut all contact with him years ago. She said no because he is my friend. I thought about this for a few days and then told her that on order for me to understand this i need to know when it all ended. She told me I don’t know. I said well to keep it simple when was the last time you had sex, she said I don’t remember. I said i find that hard to believe and asked well when was the first time you had sex she again said I don’t remember. I said that i find that impossible to believe since it was when you lost your virginity. She said that their relationship is her business and not mine. I said ok but if you don’t remember when it was do you remember where it was she said in my flat. This hit me for 6 as this meant it was at the time that we got back together and if they really did have as many intimate encounters as she had said they had it must have continued for quite some time after this. I have been losing alot of sleep over this sometimes barely sleeping at all for three days, i have almost completely lost my appetite, my mind is filling in all the details that she won’t disclose and they are not good thoughts. I have asked her to tell me but she simply says that is all dead and buried but to me it is fresh information that hurts like it was yesterday. What do i do? Am i overreacting or wrong?

[indigo22]

Hi samaz,

Welcome to the forums and thank you for reaching out to us.

I'm sorry to hear how much turmoil you are in at the moment but it is understandable that you would be feeling this way.

The problem with relationships that start at a young age is that we are not yet fully aware of who we are or what we want. I am speaking from experience so I understand the dynamics at play. I believe there are two things here that need to be taken into consideration.

First, it is not unusual for a young person to be unsure about who they want to be with, so try not to be too concerned about your early relationship, she eventually chose to be with you, that part is important for you to remember. Not being upfront with you about everything was not a good decision, but we all make mistakes when we are young.

The part that concerns me about your story is that she was hiding their friendship from you. She didn't have the right to say you shouldn't go on social media, clearly this was to hide the friendship. But you also didn't have the right to insist on cutting all contact with the other person. None of us belong to anyone else, there needs to be trust and honesty in a relationship for it to work well. I think this is where the problem lies, in trying to control each others actions. You have now found yourself in a position of not knowing what to trust. I can see that there is doubt in how long the other relationship continued after you were a couple.

This situation could potentially cause a long term rift in your relationship and should be addressed in some way. You need to find a way to come to terms with how you feel about the past events, and I think some counselling would be helpful in that regard. Would she be open to couples counselling so that you can both express yourselves with an unbiased third party. I really feel that this is your best way of clearing the air for you and your partner. If she refuses to participate, then you should get some counselling on your own. Not sleeping, losing your appetite and ruminating on unanswered questions is unhealthy for you, so please give this some thought.

I hope this is some help.

Take care,

indigo

[samaz]

Thankyou for your reply

i agree that it is young but i guess i was different in that i knew who i was going to be from very early but don’t expect it from others and don’t blame my wife that she had to work it out.

i did feel bad about trying to get her to cut him off but he is someone that i know I can’t trust and had to let my wife know how I felt about him.

the access to social media stuff doesn’t bother me but the secrets do. As i have tried to make our marriage open to all communication but my wife is the opposite and blocks any communication when things are hard, not only on this matter but in most cases.

i will definitely try some counselling and ask her to attend with me.

[indigo22]

Hi again,

I'm glad to hear you are open to counselling, I hope you can find some resolution. The communication does need to be two way, so I imagine it's difficult for you resolve things with your wife when she is not communicating as openly as you are.

If you feel comfortable talking about how things are going, we will be here for you.

Take care of yourself,

indigo

[samaz]

1. So i went to see a counselor today, i showed them what i had written down and we had a long talk about what to do about the situation. I said that i am at a point that i just need to know some time frames, i love my wife and it is going to take a hell of alot to break what we have beyond repair. The counselor said that i will need to have some preparation to prepare myself if revelations come out that i am not prepared for. And somebody that i can confide in at anytime even if that is a phone call to lifeline. 
   i attempted to talk with my wife this evening and it all started relaxed and calm. I asked why she hadn’t told me about her friendship on snapchat to which she didn’t reply but said that i have never been in contact with him on there. I said well why do you have a friend on facebook that you don’t speak to which she replied well i did say happy birthday once. I know that she lied straight to my face with that because i have now seen the conversations though these were all innocent but still that is a lie. Somehow i managed to not call her out on that and remained calm. The conversation continued calmly along the lines that I didn’t want details but just want an idea of a basic timeline so that i know what i am dealing with. She continued with her answers that she doesn’t remember and it is not my business while growing angry. I still somehow remained calm but she began yelling and eventually stormed out.
2. She has refused to attend counseling with me so i will continue this on my own.

[indigo22]

Hi again Samaz,

I am so glad you had a constructive meeting with the counsellor, feeling supported through this situation is really important.

It sounds like you made a little progress with your wife, at least things remained calm for a while. I think over time you may be able to find the answers you seek, but it will take patience which you seem to be able to manage from what you have said. I am sorry that your wife has refused to attend with you, but I am very glad you will still continue yourself.

If you need support between your counselling sessions, please feel free to continue this conversation. I am following your post and will get a notification if you reply.

I hope you are able to get some rest and feel less stressed soon.

Take care,

indigo

[HappySheep]

Hi Samaz, I agree entirely with Indigo.  Feelings that a partner is not telling the truth, especially about a sexual relationship that may have continued once you were together, will continue to eat at and eventually destroy trust in the relationship.

I'm impressed that you asked her to go to counselling with you, well done.  If she refuses to go with you, you will need to have a serious conversation with her. Plan it carefully because it sounds like the two of you are not communicating well at the moment.  Pick a time and place where you won't be interrupted and plan what you want to say. Give yourself a few dot points that you need her to understand. If it helps keep them clear in your mind, write them down.  From your discussion here, I assume they will be something like: a) concern about secrets, b) assure her that you just want to understand and c) why won't she join you with a counsellor to try to help have this conversation. Try not to get angry. 

I also agree with your counsellor, this may all be easily sorted, BUT it may not, and you might get some answers that you don't want to hear.  You may need to prepare yourself to make some decisions based on the answers you get.

But, it's obviously eating away at you, so well done for trying to raise the issue rather than going with the ostrich/head in sand principle.

[samaz]

Hi,

just thought i would update on the situation.

i have been doing alot of reading of self help books to try and put my mind in a better place. This has worked in that i am now sleeping and eating better although my thoughts often wander on to the topic of what actually happened.

both my wife and i have been really busy with work over the past few months which is making it extremely diffucult to get any time alone with each other ( i work fifo and run a transport business on my time off while she works 2 part time jobs along with all of the kids sporting activities)

i attempted to plan a weekend away for just the 2 of us and went as far as booking the accomodation for a romantic weekend. When she found out i had done this she refused to come saying that we can use that money for something better, so i canceled the accomodation.

i have been attempting to talk with her about the ex boyfriend when we do get the opportunity however this never goes well with her always getting defensive straight away and saying that i have never let her forget that. I reply that is because I can’t close the book because I don’t know what it is that i am actually closing off on and that we could get some couples counselling so that we can get past it once and for all.

she flatly refuses any counselling and gets very angry for me asking her to.

i guess being madly in love for 20 years i sub-consciously ignored warning signs and only seen the good. So have begun trying to work out how to read her behaviour better so have begun asking questions that i know the answer to order to observe how she answers. For example “do you know where that power tool my brother gave me for Christmas is?” ( i know that she gave this away to her brother because she thought that i didn’t need it as it was a unique tool that i have seen at his place) she responded that “it is in the back room somewhere but i don’t have time to look” This i know sounds like a big deal but it truly isn’t. The big deal is that in telling me this she was able to tell a lie directly to my face without giving any clues in her body language that it was a lie. I have noticed this a few other times, and this really makes me wonder how much i have missed over the years.

i don’t know anymore if i am going to be able to just move past all this like she obviously wants me to if she continues to attempt to just sweep everything under the rug, i think i am going to have to just tell her that i am going to need her to attempt to work it out with me or we need to seperate. 

anybody have any ideas?

[HappySheep]

Hi Samaz, I think it boils down to: You know she is lying to you and you are not happy to let that go. If you want an open and honest relationship, you need to get past her blocking and defensive anger every time you want to have a conversation about it. She seems to deflect questions and ignore issues without wanting to talk about them. I'm not implying any blame here. There are many reasons someone lies in a relationship and refuses to have difficult conversations - not all of them are for nefarious purposes.  Does she fear conflict? Is she intimidated by being challenged - perhaps by something in her past?

Over 20 years of marriage I have come to know that my partner is a compulsive liar because she comes from an abusive background and fears being seen as less than perfect.  It has taken us years and years to work through that - to see that I'd rather have the truth, and even if it makes me angry, it won't make me think less of her but lying will make be end the relationship - because, like you, I need to know where I stand.

So, I suggest that you not test her and play her games but openly challenge a lie you know to be a lie - and ask her why she needs to lie to you.  Maybe you should work with your counsellor on how you can do this is a gentle and constructive way to avoid it turning into a fight but in a way that lets you say what needs to be said. You would need to plan carefully because liars are great at turning a conversation into 'you're making a big deal over one tiny incident' when YOUR issue is not the incident but the lying about it.

[samaz]

During the last couple of months i have been trying to discuss this with my wife, she always says that she is to busy to discuss it when i try during the day, which she is because she works full time and on top of kids sport commitments and domestic jobs it doesn’t leave either of us much time, however when i attempt to discuss on the rare occasion that we get some time when the kids have gone to bed she says that we can’t talk about it because the kids may hear us. This is extremely frustrating so i booked us a motel room and organised the kids to stay with grandparents for a couple of days so that we can go away, just the two if us. My wife said that she would rather we spent that money on something we can use, i replied that we can afford a couple of days away together to which she replied that she would rather we did something together as a family with the kids and attempted to make me feel bad that i wanted to do something that excluded our children. I ended up canceling the accomodation and we didn’t go away.

the frustration got to the point that i told her that i was leaving if she didn’t discuss the past with me, she then told me that she did sleep with her ex after we had got together but it wasn’t my business because we weren’t exclusive and could not give me a time frame of when it all ended because she can’t remember. We did not ever have a conversation about being exclusive because i was unaware that this was a thing that people did, i may be naive but i thought that most people only had 1 partner at a time and on the other hand we definitely didn’t have a conversation that we would be non-exclusive. And given the fact this was hidden from me for 20 years indicates to me that she did think that we had some sort of exclusivity