Narcissistic parent/s

[ElectricBlue]

Hi all, so what has made me come here is a recent argument with my mum. This is the only real argument we've ever had and it's made me realise that she is a narcissist (my dad is possibly one too but right now I'm dealing with mum). My whole life I have just put up with her behaviour and have always seen it as just the way she is. It always seemed to hard to say anything negative about her behaviour because she'd make such a drama about it and it just didn't feel worth it. I have a 1 year old and am not going to put up with it all anymore for his sake. She goes against my wishes constantly and does the opposite of what she's been asked. This includes (but definitely isn't limited to) giving him food I've asked her not to give him, sharing photos of him with my brother who has a serious drug issue (I had no contact with him, hadn't told him I was pregnant and her explanation of why she did it without asking me was "you would've said no") and touching his head where his skull hasn't fused, even though I have asked her not to on multiple occasions.

My childhood was quite unstable. My parents split twice. My mother attempted suicide twice (I don't believe she had any intention of it succeeding as she contacted people while doing it) and apart from all that it was just a very unstable environment centred around my parents and what they needed and were feeling.

I finally got sick of it and sent her a list of things that she has done that are the opposite of what I asked. I also brought up things from my childhood and her response was basically that she disagrees with the things I've raised about my son so my concerns don't matter. In relation to my childhood her message was "I can't change the past. It sounds to me like you're resentful and angry about the part and only you can deal with that, just like I'm dealing with my past. There was no selfishness involved, it's much more complicated than that. I'm sorry you feel that way. I love you and wish you didn't have so much anger in you."

She has never taken responsibility for anything in her life from big things like the attempted suicides in my childhood to the smallest things like spilling milk on the floor. If something doesn't fit her narrative then she just lies about it, even if you witnessed it.

I know this is all part of her mental health issues but I'm really struggling with it as I know I can't get her to change or understand how I feel but it makes me so sad that she possibly won't be in my sons life.

[white knight]

Hi, welcome

So, as I read it there is two major issues here- how she goes against your directions and breaches boundaries with care for your son and- her mental illness issues that include a raft of subjects.

with your son you are totally correct with your rules and as a grandparent she should sit back, abide by the rules then simply enjoy her grandchild. That can be done with a teamwork mentality or, an attitude that her way or the highway. For this reason alone I would restrict her access to my child. The rule is- listen, abide and enjoy. If you choose not to listen and abide by the rules them I’m sorry you have forfeited your right of access to my child.

Be clear, be firm but not need to argue.

The other issue is her mental health. I disagree here in one mention- having had 2 suicides in my family and 2 attempt, one by me, I would never put blame or responsibility onto a person for s suicide attempt. Any such attempt is very sad and an act that displays sheer desperation and total depression. Responsibilities for other things and not owning it is s different thing. Please separate the two. Try to feel some empathy for her suicide attempt, it is a reflection of how deeply sad she was.

I have a suggestion. You can inform your mother that you have decided to meet with her at s cafe for coffee. At that meeting you tell her that meeting her there once s fortnight/month is possible but your child won’t be present. You can discuss your rules and how she breaks them, then weigh up if there is any regrets or change of attitude. She will likely accuse you of keeping her grandchild away from her- agree with her on that because she breaks the rules.

I hope that helps. It’s probably too early to discard her entirely, sometimes things can be fixed.

TonyWK

[ElectricBlue]

Hi TonyWK,

Thanks so much for the response.

In regards to the suicide attempts I should put a little more context in... I do understand that she was in a dark place both times, however I believe both of these situations to have been a call for help rather than an actual attempt as she contacted people both times during the attempts.

As horrible as it sounds, given her past behaviour I do believe that both times it was for attention more so than any real attempt at suicide.

I have never really spoken to her about it in regards to how it affected me. She does not ever want to talk about it or anything other negative thing that has happened in the past unless it's about how she feels about it or how it has affected her. I have tried to raise issues about how it has affected me but she has always turned the conversation around to being about herself again so I just stopped trying.

[Happyatlast]

Hello EB...as the ex partner of a narcissist my view is to get right away...if possible... there is no way you will ever be able to explain their behaviour to your child and she will never treat you as you should be treated...save yourself

[ElectricBlue]

Hi Happyatlast,

At this point in time I think removing myself from the relationship is the best thing for me and my family. That may change in the future but she has shown no remorse or anything since our argument (in fact her, my dad & brother have all gone on holidays for a week) so I think this is a very one-sided relationship and I'm feeling pretty done with it all.

[white knight]

Hi again,

thankyou for the context. What will be interesting here is how your father and brother will react when you break free from your mother.

We all have choices in life and the power of your mother over them is a pet subject of mine as my mother had her greatest weapon, my beautiful father in her corner at her will.

Can you google-

queen witch hermit waif

You might see some interesting traits in their that match your mum. It isn’t conclusive but can open up possibilities that can help you make up your mind.

Repost anytime. I’m here

TonyWK

[ElectricBlue]

My father displays very narcissistic personality traits as well, just different from mums (he is very obviously self-centred, thinks he is smarter than everyone and above every one else, uses negative comments to keep people down, bullying but is happy to use people if he gets some benefit out of it). I think he enjoys the drama that my mother creates just as much as she but also puts up with her being quite horrible to him for some reason unfortunately so I really don't get any help from him.

My brother has just starting cleaning himself up from being a very intense drug addict so has quite a dependency on my parents right now to help him financially.

As to the different personality traits, she is mostly the waif as she mainly plays the victim but also has traits from the 3 others depending on who she's with and what the situation is. She can be very cruel, especially to my dad (witch), doesn't take responsibility for anything and expects people to always agree with her (queen), she can't take any criticism and has always been "betrayed" by people (hermit).

I could list a million things about all 4 personality traits that she has but yes, definitely the waif is the most dominant of all 4.

[white knight]

I’m glad you got value from that reference. Our biggest challenge is indentifying the problem.

Your options are few. Some family members can exist at a distance, others like me cannot.

I can recall turning 21yo. I’d spent 3 years away in the Air Force and was coming home to live. I believed I’d be treated as an adult but wasn’t. Her need for control returned along with emotional blackmail.

At 27yo I was dating a nice girl. My mother didn’t like her. Eventually she said “if you don’t break off with her I’ll go away on holiday for several weeks”, my answer ? “ I’ll help you pack your suitcase”

My sister and I lasted 2 decades after that before we made the decision to live our lives in freedom without this drama

TonyWK

[ElectricBlue]

So since our argument we've exchanged very few messages but they've been nice enough so I thought everything was starting to calm down but my mum was posting some passive aggressive things on facebook (obviously targeted at me) so I haven't been initiating any contact. After sending me messages about how she loves me unconditionally (I said I love you too) etc. she randomly messages me last night saying that I've cut all contact she has with my son (she has not tried to call or anything once since the argument) & what has she done for me to hurt her so badly. She then went on to say that my husband is the reason we argued (obviously as a narcissist she can do no wrong). I've told her that she has not tried to make contact with my son & that our argument has nothing to do with my husband. She got all nice again but I can just tell this is just going to go on & on & on. She wants to be the victim in this & keeps trying any way she can to play that card. First she got angry, then she gave me the silent treatment, then she tried passive aggressive, then she was nice & now she's back to being angry. I'm so over it.

[white knight]

What these type of people do is maintain instability in our lives. They know no other way Unfortunately. I know this because as an ex serviceman in the RAAF I lived with many men that had emotional stability and I recognised my instability.

At the end of the day, the call is your, to remove yourself from her life, remain in it or somewhere in between. It is your tolerance level that will determine your future journey with her. If you can tolerate her say one meal a month and allow her to play with your child then that is good however if you allow her contact with him then your rules must be obeyed, not ignored.

I hope that helps

TonyWK