Depression - life

[randomxx]

Hi to all.

Some will know l've had my ups and downs for sure but l wanted to start this as a new and separate thread bc the old one wound up all about gf ex.

Just for the most that won't know though and happen to drop in, l got rid of of my place 6mths back and went caravaning 51/2 mths, just couldn't deal with another place at the time and just felt like a bloody good break and rest first.

Wasn't sure how l'd feel about it but it wasn't bad and at times really nice just being free for a bit but later 50s there were also the worries of what to do when l get back. Well back now is too my other place it's not really that l had two houses the second one is just a country block with a cabin in a tiny town that l just rent out, never lived there. Well the tenant moved out so that's where l've come back to, l need to fix it up and sell it toward my new place.

This little town this whole thing , not doing me any good at all in this stage of life. l did have to get out of my other place don't regret it it had to be done but it's just been such a huge last 10yrs or so. Divorce and all thenlater on just broken up with later new gf now ex just last yr and now all this and here l am in this place- and then l'll be somewhere else to where l'm thinking of moving to, maybe even building . lf so it'll only be small and minimalist buttt, ldk

Just feel like total bs it's all too much and it's like what in the hell am l even doing especially here right now and at this age but ldk how else l could've done things.l had to get out of my last place, l have to be here to fix up this one and it's somewhere at least to stay, it'll be  a few mths.

Been coming here 20yrs keeping this place up and all the same people are still here couples been together and still here all that time and still sitting in their homes watching tv and doing their lives together.

The total opposite lives to mine and now l;m even single and here doing this and then wherever later restarting again andddd, it's all just sooooo, words l can't use here.

rx

[therising]

Hi rx and Eagle Ray

Good parents make a positive difference, for sure. It's funny how, as kids, we don't necessarily see our parents as 'real people' because...well...they're our parents 😅. It's not 'til you get a little older that you realise they were individuals who met and tried to work together. They're real people, like you or I, and they came into it all (the marriage and parenting business) with their beliefs, their nature, their dreams and heartbreaks and the rest. Mine were and still are good people. My mother makes me smile when she questions those enormous houses you speak of, 'I bet there's just a couple who live in that house, with maybe one child. Why?!'.

The 'voice' hearing stuff truly fascinates me. Where that dialogue's coming from, who knows? Being imaginative creatures, we're free to imagine where it comes from and if what we imagine does no harm then, technically, our take on it is harmless. Agree that psychology can, more often than not, treat it as a concerning condition or disorder (which it can be at times of course). The more fascinated I became by it all, the more I researched. Three interesting areas

• A doco call 'Crazywise', which covers how traditional or tribal cultures regard voices and visions (and how they're guided through that) vs how psychology views it all. Should add that traditional cultures also acknowledge concerning mental health conditions in some cases
• An organisation known as 'Hearing Voices Network', which also covers voices and visions. Whether what comes to mind for people involves intrusive thoughts involved in depression, anxiety, OCD etc or it's psychic related or it involves the challenges of schizophrenia, all are welcomed into this organisation and supported while being encouraged to share their experiences
• A fascinating area of research was undertaken by a couple of researchers at Yale School of Medicine. While trying to better understand certain aspects of schizophrenia, they tried to find participants who didn't suffer from schizophrenia yet heard 'voices'. After much research and out of both curiosity and  desperation, they decided to eventually interview psychics (as no other 'voice hearers' were proving fruitful in their study). They made it clear that in no way were they interested in proving psychic phenomena was real, the sole purpose of this study involved researching how certain people we able to manage hearing voices. Part of their goal was to research whether voices can managed in schizophrenia without medication. They wanted to know how people who hear voices switch it off or tone it down at will, through certain strategies

Whether what we hear is the voice of intuition, the intuitive and logical parts of our brain battling it out at times or something else, it's all fascinating and can definitely hold the potential to provide a sense of healing and guidance at times. I personally would like to see more research being done in this area, for whatever it is that can convince us of how hopeless it all is while in the depths of depression should be researched and better understood. Life saving research.

[therising]

Hi rx and Eagle Ray

I'm wondering whether you have any strategies when it comes to developing self discipline. While you may wonder 'In what area of life?', my response would be 'Pretty much every area'. While I imagine if I was to pull out the disciplinarian in me and sit it opposite me, it would roll its eyes and smack its forehead in frustration while shaking its head from side to side (with a sense of utter disbelief). If given a voice, the disciplinarian in me would declare 'This woman frustrates the hell out of me. She just doesn't listen to a single thing I say' 😅. Stuff that comes to mind can be 

• You have got to start taking better care of your health and overall wellbeing
• You have got to start developing more interests that actually get you somewhere in life
• You have got to start being tougher on yourself, in highly constructive ways. You have got to start developing more discipline in your life

and the list goes on. Perhaps my inner disciplinarian is just to soft in its approach 😁

I've heard it said before that it's action that creates change, not simply thoughts (of change). Of course, this makes sense but the question is 'How to be consistent with certain actions, to the point where they become good habits?'.

Maybe some tips on

• How to manage or stick to what's not easy?
• How to create a vision that is so clear to the point where it creates forward momentum?
• How to use emotion or feelings in constructive ways, so that they they become the driving force?
• How to give yourself no choice but to stick with something

or anything else that may help. Being such thoughtful, feeling and imaginative folk, I believe you can offer some positive mind altering tips and strategies.

[randomxx]

Morng rising.

lt's about 1 degree this morning, central Vic, gonna have to find a heater for the van l think haha, it's much cooler over night than coastal , sunnier days though.

Discipline, hate that stuff, story of your life when you have a business 30yrs.

Get back to work, go on , keep goin, finish that job- get paid then you can rest, get through all the parts of it you don't like,push push push,  enjoy the good bits, keep goin, finish that bugger. Damn they work 9 to 5- they want it delivered on a Sunday, it's 3hrs away, l bloody hate working wkends- well, l'll have to do it, you can rest Mond , and on and on.

But eh, mind you, when the rest of the world is slogging away and clocking on everyday, l'd also be kicking back and doin whatever l wanted for a few mths after it was done. But you had to get it done first.

You don't have a boss, your your boss to keep you moving, damn , as gf ex would say, kick my bum. So l used money as my boss. Pay day. When you finish you get paid and not one second before.

But it helps when you enjoy most of your work, just have to slog and push through the shitty bits right.

That's life right , and all the things we do or wanna do . So although personally l've never had too many rules, hated rules from a kid, l did have to have some though, bugger.

So although l def needed better self discipline in lots of other areas in life and within myself, my work principle and training always helped.

You kinda think of it all as the pay day and so you don't get the reward until the job is done kinda thing. Or if your lucky you get at least bits of the reward along

the way too , but the main biggie is when the job is done.

But if you never had to have that discipline in your work , there's always lots of other big big things you had to get through in life too right. Family marriage kids bills struggle periods , parenting and on and on right.

For me personally though , although there's been lots of other struggles at different times to in life , my work thing is the one was like the real training.

Good luck.

rx

[Eagle Ray]

Hi the riding and rx,

Tried replying earlier but was too long. Will try and be more succinct. The rising, I may not be the best person to advise on discipline given I swing between hyper focus and scatteredness, but will try.

With health, for example, I think the incentive for me comes from the results. When I do eat well, get daily exercise, decent sleep etc and build up some strength and fitness, it just feels much better. I find a daily walk always helps with sleep and healthy meals keep my energy levels more sustained rather than erratic. That in turn helps with focus and attention. So everything feeds into everything else. At times I’ve had some real collapses in my health, so it’s been a wake up call. Then when I feel better I don’t want to go backwards.

With developing interests, I know you are someone so interested in how we work as people. I wonder if you could be a writer in some capacity? I am a very sensory aware/sensitive person and this has led me to sensory interests like music and photography. I get the sense you have a sensory focus too and wonder about what creative potential may lie there?

With a vision and using emotion, these two things often go together for me in relation to helping others in some way creatively. Yesterday I helped at my friend’s daughter’s playgroup and it felt so connecting and meaningful. I’m the kind of person who will then think of creative ideas for working with kids. I used to work as an education assistant and have thoughts of finding my way back to something similar in a creative way. I have a special interest with kids with non or minimally speaking autism. I just give that example because I think visions can grow in relation to our connections with others, where we can see we can make a difference. It becomes emotionally meaningful and rewarding.

But I think before embarking on anything, knowing yourself and your own needs is the first step. That’s something I’ve had to learn. It may be that you have a particular learning style that needs a certain approach. If you are a bit ADHD like me you may be able to get a lot done through hyper focus, where there is a strong drive to concentrate on something you’re super interested in.

Sometimes too as rx says it’s often a case of putting the head down and pushing through. Often with mundane tasks I can struggle with, I listen to a podcast on one of my special interests (of which there are many) which makes it a lot easier.

Think going to run over word count, but re: voices and visions I watched a talk by the maker of Crazywise and I’m keen to see the film.

Bye for now,

ER

[therising]

Hi rx and ER

The nights have definitely become a lot colder here in Vic. I feel for you and imagine a comfortable super warm blanket I wish I could magically send your way, in the blink of an eye 🙂. Like a little child with no parent, I choose what's easy outside of work these days (the path of least resistance). I see it as a break from the more challenging times in life. I find myself choosing what's easier more and more and I know it's going to come back to bite me in the long run. I should be banking the efforts that come from a much healthier lifestyle, banking the efforts that come from spending less and banking the efforts that come with other stuff in life. Then, in some weeks time or some months or years, the payoff will be a longer and much healthier life, more opportunities and probably more than I can possibly imagine. There's not a lot of 'banking' going on at the moment. Instant gratification instead. Your response has inspired me to flip it all and not see it as deprivation or going without but banking instead. Thank you so much for sharing your experience and wisdom. So very much appreciated and positively mind altering.

ER, I can relate to what you say in regard to everything feeding into everything else. If I follow the perfect recipe for lots of energy, including the right

1. chemical energy in food
2. chemical energy that comes from good quality sleep
3. chemical energy that's generated through exercising it
4. the right chemical energy that comes with good cell hydration

etc, the kind of energy generated by all of that stuff isn't just chemically related it's damn right inspiring (good for the soul). It is the feeling of life running through us. As you'd know, it can feel so hard to start the recipe when there's next to no energy. The key ingredient for me would be quality sleep, to begin with. No choice but to prepare for bed at a set time each night, like when I was a little kid 😁, as opposed to falling asleep watching tv without having put my sleep apnea appliance in.

I can also relate to a sense of purpose creating a drive. Like yourself, making a positive difference to others is a large part of what drives me. My mother, more than anyone, has been pushing me for a long time to put my passion for writing to good use and have it serve others. There's an internet platform called 'Medium', where people write articles about a whole stack of different topics. I have that little voice in my head (intuition) telling me to submit to that platform. Of course, I choose what's easier and I don't do it. I used to be a highly creative person and I occasionally ask 'What the hell happened?'. I think detours or distractions can take us off track at times and we find we never quite get back on the path entirely. Close to it but not on it.

I smile when you mention the ADHD factor. My 22yo daughter who was diagnosed last year occasionally says to me 'Mum, you know you're so ADHD' 😁. While there are some natural traits that tick certain boxes, how I've not nurtured my brain over the years lead some other boxes to being ticked. I've just started reading a book written my Daniel Amen (a leading specialist and pioneer for decades in the field of ADHD) called 'Feel Better Fast and Make It Last'. It's truly fascinating. Executive function, personal experiences (including trauma), diet, exercise (including good blood circulation for the brain) and so much more all play parts in our achievements and our struggles. Btw, 'Crazywise' is definitely a real eye and mind opener.

Thank you both so much for giving me what feel like clear individual pieces of a puzzle that have been brought together to create a much sharper vision to focus on. Before, it all just looked like an overall blur with zero clarity. You've both been positively inspiring and energising. ❤️

[randomxx]

Morng tr and er , and an rx thrown into the mix, lot of R's round here right, someone look up what R significance is, could be good luck.

Dunno if l mentioned it but l found a " Golden " ace of diamonds in the sand the other day. Ace of Diamonds is the highest money card you see so l figure a golden one has to be one special ace of Diamonds.  We see huh, ha ha. Maybe l trip over a suitcase full of money, or a gold nugget, or something nice.

Thanks for those lovely cuddly blankets too tr, v appreciated .

But yeah , l suppose for me tr , so l could say l use the rewards as my discipline. In my business ofc that was a monetary thing l guess but it was also the satisfaction in getting the job done and to enjoying the good bits as well along the way.

And so with life in general, they can be anything right, love, rest, sunshine, appreciation from another, the enjoyment or whatever the end game is l guess.

You know though tr, when you talk about the easier ways and things, tbh, l think that's a wisdom that comes with age in a big part. l do things in a lot the same ways these days too but that works out far better than earlier yrs . l always seemed to choose harder more complicated than things had to be in younger days, usually just giving myself grief for nothing.

Ex w always said you can take the gravel road or the bitumen road ha ha, one of the most logical things l ever heard really. And these days l find the bitumen does do all the same jobs but in much nicer ways and ride along the way so to speak.

But eh , sometimes those gravel paths can lead to beautiful places too right so it still ain't in stone buttttt.

Take care guys hey.

rx

[Eagle Ray]

Hi tr and rx,

I just thought I’d say I feel rx is onto something with there being wisdom in the path with least resistance. It is not necessarily a bad thing. Sometimes it is, as you say tr, about giving yourself a break at a certain time in life. I’ve certainly pushed myself through so many things which looking back were not necessary and added stress to my life. Often it’s what I thought I “should” be doing. I’m wondering if there is a way to reframe things away from the disciplinarian perspective towards a more self-nurturing one? How can you nurture yourself forward to some goals you’d like to achieve?

One thing you could try is reflect on certain options - feel into them. See how your body responds. If you feel a lightness and a flow of energy it’s probably a good sign. If you feel a heaviness and that energy becomes stuck within you then it may be a sign that the pathway being reflected on isn’t right for you. Or a sign there’s some kind of obstacle to work on first before embarking on that path.

I have read articles on Medium before and can imagine you writing for something like that tr. You could at least have a go at writing some articles just to see how it feels and whether it engages and inspires you. If you feel really happy with something you’ve written you could try sending it to somewhere you feel you might like it to be published. I’m not an expert on freelance writing, but I imagine there’s some websites that deal with the ins and outs of it.

Rx, the bitumen and gravel road analogy is quite helpful. It’s quite a good metaphor because often the bitumen is the easier and quicker route, but in some instances the gravel road is more interesting, takes you off the beaten path and slows you down to see the scenery more. So it’s not always a straightforward answer which one to follow but, again, something to feel into to sense a way forward.

It’s interesting the ADHD thing. I know my brain fits it but I’ve hesitated to be diagnosed. Apart from the expense in diagnosis, it’s like I want to optimise the benefits of it and learn to minimise the challenges. There are so many perspectives. My optometrist has been diagnosed and said that really helped her. My naturopath thinks it’s over-diagnosed and very often down to natural variation rather than a pathology. I’m sort of thankful for my hyperfocus capacity though wish I felt more balanced and less scattered at times. But I’m also learning better self-regulation which is starting to help me handle challenges better. A lot of it links with patterns of dissociation that are so ingrained in me. I feel like I’m becoming more conscious without losing the benefits of my dissociative imagination capacity which often leads to lateral insights that would otherwise remain unrealised.

I hope you are both having a good day,

er

[randomxx]

Hi there er.

Yeah for me it is as simple as that. l've gotten older smarter about choices and ways of doing things and have the experience now to know far better in all sorts of ways really.

The way l do anything these days is 3x easier, simpler, smarter, than paths l would've chosen back in the day, one good thing about getting older l guess right.

Still mess up though but eh , still in training too ha ha , some say we are our whole lives right, probably about it l reckon too.

Have a nice wkend eh.

How's the place been going?

rx

[Eagle Ray]

Hi rx,

I totally agree that it’s like we’re always in training, but learning along the way so we make it easier for ourselves. Even many of the things I used to spend energy worrying about I find just don’t matter to me now. There’s definitely still some things that can worry me, but I’m learning to move through them with more pro-active solutions rather than feeling painfully stuck.

I’m not in my place tonight. I’ve been up in the city and stopped in a caravan park on the way home. It has donga-style single room accommodation which is the cheapest option apart from camping or bringing your own van. The second last time I was here I met a homeless man staying here and tonight there’s women with kids who also appear to be homeless. They can’t fit all their stuff in the small rooms so prams, teddy bears, bags of belongings etc are stacked outside. It’s so evident many are in crisis.

As far as my place goes, I’ve become more philosophical about the maintenance issues. I will progressively get through things. I can feel I’m going in the right direction even if slow at it. I’m just grateful to have a home and know I’m lucky. Just coming back from the city I can feel that it’s full on there in some ways and I do appreciate the peace of my small town. But I also miss some things the city offers. But starting to think living out of the city but visiting it when I can may be the best option.

How are you going with everything? Are you still exploring at the moment?

er

[therising]

Greetings, wise ones 😊

Rx, in considering self-discipline to be linked to reward +, Eagle Ray, considering reframing self-discipline while incorporating how something feels becomes the perfect equation. I should add, something said to me 'Look up the origin of the word 'reward', so I did. It relates to 'warder', as in 'to guard'. Put a 're' in front of warder and 'reward' is 'to guard again'. What you both say equals (in my mind) 'To feel yourself stand guard (again and again) over that which is of value, brings with it a sense of strength, pride, satisfaction and a sense of payoff'. To stand guard against poor nutrition, what we put into our mouths, protects good health. To stand guard against overspending protects savings. To stand guard against depressing inner dialogue not only promotes more conscious and more positive inner dialogue, it helps protect mental health. And so on. As guards who feel a duty of care toward ourself, we are allowed to have some well earned time out from being protectors of our own best interests. What all guards have in common is not only a sense of duty of care but self-discipline as well.

Er, with ADHD, I've found it to be a fascinating area of study. The reasons as to why Dr Daniel Amen fascinates and impresses me are many. While being regarded as one of the world's leading specialists in ADHD, his attitude and passion for improving lives is inspiring. He mentions how it occurred to him earlier in his career as a psychiatrist, that while he was treating a variety of people with mental health challenges, a psychiatrist's specialty is not the human brain. That would be a neurologist's specialty. So, he began studying the human brain extensively and, in doing so, ADHD issues began to make a lot more sense. While he noted that an ADHD brain can be formed through a combination of certain influences which can include poor upbringing or poor discipline, poor diet, poor circulation/exercise, poor chemistry, poor emotional regulation, toxins and toxic people, trauma etc, his greatest passion of all involves re-forming it toward a lack of 'disorder'. In other words, creating a sense of order or balance (something you speak of). Of course, the area of permanent and irreversible brain damage is a different area when it comes to certain causes of ADHD. Like yourself, Amen acknowledges the many incredible abilities that come with a neurodivergent brain and nature. Fine tuning those abilities is also part of the overall goal of greater order.

We can definitely spend a life time mastering ourself. Coming to know ourself has never been easier in a sense, with access to so much knowledge at our fingertips. Praise the internet. From a mental perspective, a physical perspective and even a natural or soulful perspective, we remain enthusiastic (and occasionally confused 😁) apprentices or students of self and life.