topic Where to from here? in Supporting family and friends

Where to from here?

Xiomara — Wed, 16 Jan 2019 03:08:37 GMT

I’ll start with a confession. Yesterday I told my husband, who has depression, that I was done. No more. That’s it. Over. I told him he could go wallow in self pity without me.
We live with the long grey shadow that follows him everywhere, trying to drag me into its darkness.
He returned a week ago, from a trip to visit family. He went with our adult daughters to have some bonding time. I asked how the trip was, I got complete silence. Not much out of my daughters either, other than 'his mother, geeze!'. So obviously something went awry. He has had a fraught and complicated relationship with his mother and his siblings. There is abandonment, jail, suicides and death from cancer in the family history, all very painful. In the past few years, I have seen his desire to reconcile with them, so I gently encouraged it to help him on the road to heal the rift, before it is too late and there are regrets. Last night, I said that I knew something was up and I was there if he wanted to talk . Accusations flew out him that I called his family evil , that his problems were none of my business, they don’t affect me in any way, I was at fault for not going with him, I should butt out of his life I'd never asked him about his trip, he told me all he had to say in texts ( 2 texts in 2 weeks) and that he had nothing to tell me.
To my detriment, I can’t hold my tongue. Seriously, is everyone who cares for a person with depression wonderful all the time? Far out, I’m a really bad person if so.
I launched a tirade back, borne of deep hurt and years of living with this shadow in the room that I can’t see and can’t fight, but which wraps around him like an iron cape, stealing him away and leaving me far out in the cold.
So I said my terrible finale. I'm really shouting at the shadow, but it is him that gets hit with the words. I meant it and not meant it at the same time. I am done with the shadow. Well and truly. I am not done with the person beneath it. The problem, apparently, is I have to accept both, or neither and I’m so pissed off about that. It is NOT fair. There are three people in the marriage.Me, him and the shadow. The shadow gets all the attention. Last year was hard for me. I lost my mother and a close work colleague/friend. I had a hard time at work with a nasty boss. I need support too. None comes for me. I'm lonely and angry and sad. But most of all I am tired of the shadow.

What do I do now?

Where to from here?

james1 — Thu, 17 Jan 2019 09:49:01 GMT

Hello Xiomara,

I'm so sad to hear about how depression has affected your marriage and your own personal life too. And I am also very sad to hear you lost your mother and a close friend last year.

I understand how you feel really pushed out by the shadow - unfortunately, it can often feel like the people we support become our lives and demand more energy and attention than we can afford. Sadly, this is actually sometimes the case and we cannot do it alone. As you say, you need support too and there has been none for you.

I am not sure what will happen with your husband. I suppose there will be some difficult times ahead, whatever the outcome.

But the first thing is that you clearly need support and help yourself. Do you mind if I ask if you have ever seen a GP or other mental health doctor for your own needs?

James

Where to from here?

Xiomara — Fri, 18 Jan 2019 13:38:52 GMT

No, I've never seen anyone for myself. I would have no idea what to say. I wanted to go to marriage counselling, but he point blank refuses. He sees a counsellor for his depression though. James, honestly, I am near breaking point. At some point, very soon, I have to preserve what is left of me, before I disappear altogether. I feel completely crushed.

Where to from here?

geoff — Fri, 18 Jan 2019 16:00:43 GMT

Hello Xiomara, a warm welcome to you.

I absolutely understand how you are feeling, and no, you will never get the shadow to talk with you because it changes shape every moment of the day, so what you said yesterday will be forgotten by the new shape of this shadow, it's like a pain that can’t be identified in any particular part of the body.

It’s difficult to describe all of this in a way that someone who’s never experienced it can make sense, but once you've had it or been through it, then you can understand.

You need to look after yourself because the shadow is dragging you with it, and again no, not everyone who cares for a person with depression wonderful all the time, you may want to be, but you can't be, depression is too strong, so this is where you need help to deal with it.

One option you may consider is separating, have you thought about this.

Take care.

Geoff.

Where to from here?

therising — Fri, 18 Jan 2019 19:34:28 GMT

Hi Xiomara

I feel for you so much as you meet the challenges of losing your mother, your friend and your husband (to depression). Such challenges are energetically taxing when it comes all 3 facets of self - mind/body/spirit.

Depression is definitely a tough beast to deal with and it can have a tendency to present with a language of its own at times, creating a barrier between people. The way he or she experiencing depression may interpret words can be very different from how others interpret them.

'You look good today' may be interpreted as 'That person has low standards if they think I look good'.
'Everything will be okay' may be interpreted as 'You really don't care enough to actually help make everything okay'.
'Why can't you just smile and stop bringing everyone down' may be interpreted as 'I am the reason others aren't as happy as they could be'.

Just a few examples. It may seem like we're walking on eggshells when we feel we have to watch what we say but it's important to make what we say as close to the undeniable truth as possible, so there's no misinterpretation. 1) Gee, that colour's fantastic, it suits you. 2) I will help you manage this situation/feeling, in order for you to get through it? 3) I understand it's hard for you to feel happy in this situation because of the way depression works. By the way, I could be wrong but it sounds like what your husband is saying (regarding his family) is 'I feel alone in this, therefor I am alone'. Such a thought in his head will create distance.

The disconnection/distance element of depression is an especially tough to deal with. When folk say that 2 people in love share chemistry, they're spot on. When the chemistry for love, happiness, motivation etc aren't at optimum levels in the brain, you'll witness this in a number of ways. 'Depression' is a word that basically defines the state a person's brain is in, on a whole variety of levels. Coming to better understand the way the brain ticks whilst it's in this state has given me a better understanding of what I went through myself during my years in depression, as well as giving me the ability to relate better to what a friend of mine is currently experiencing.

As james1 and Geoff mention, it's important you look after your own state of mind. Whilst someone experiencing depression can be led to question their own identity in a number of ways, depression can also have this impact on others who come in contact with it.

Take care Xiomara

Where to from here?

Xiomara — Sat, 19 Jan 2019 11:53:23 GMT

Thank you. You have given me much to think on. I will, I promise.

Where to from here?

Xiomara — Sat, 19 Jan 2019 11:56:09 GMT

Thank you for your reply Geoff, more to think on. Yes, I am very close to the stage of separation to be honest. I have been wrestling with this thought for quite some time, with all the associated feelings of failing my husband, guilt, self preservation and down right fear that go with it.

Where to from here?

geoff — Sat, 19 Jan 2019 19:06:32 GMT

Hi Xiomara, thanks for getting back to us.

There is a lot to digest and it looks like you have been thinking about this for a while, can I suggest that many people seem to hope things will improve and the longer they hang on to this feeling the worse the situation becomes.

Take care.

Best wishes.

Geoff.

Where to from here?

Happygoluckymiss — Sat, 19 Jan 2019 20:43:17 GMT

Hi xiomara,

firstly, thank you for sharing your story. I know the pain and depth you are going through as I have been through something very similar.

The relationship I had with my now ex husband was almost identical. And the way you describe 3 people in your relationship struck a big cord in me. You, him and the shadow.

I fought for 10 years in my relationship with very similar attributes as you describe. The shadow mistress was ever present and always there. He too had a history of depression, drug dependency etc - he did not work as he could not remain in employment.

After ten years, with a lot of courage and no children I decided that enough was enough and I could not go on any longer.

I did love my husband very much and all I ever wanted was to help and support him so he could be the best version of himself for him and in turn for us as a couple. But, I could not continue in a destructive relationship as I was starting to fall myself.

This is when I made the brave step to end the relationship. It was hard, I felt the most amazing amount of guilt as I said I am choosing a life for me. It took time, strength and medical assistance but three years later - for me and me only - the best decision I ever made.

Please know that whatever decision you make it will be the right one for you. This is only my story and my choices. I understand exactly where you are.

You are not alone, you are strong and resilient.

Sending you much love and kindness

- happygoluckymiss

Where to from here?

White_Rose — Sat, 19 Jan 2019 20:59:04 GMT

Dear Xiomara

Let me welcome you to this forum. We all understand your position because we have all been there in various ways. It is sad when a marriage breaks down however long or short the marriage. Remind yourself often that you are a good person and loved your husband very much when you married. I left my husband after 30 years and I still do not know how I managed it.

Depression is a beast sometimes called the black dog. It faithfully follows its owner around and defends him/her against changing or healing but will allow derogatory comments through. Without teaching the dog some manners the affected person will find the struggle to be well is very hard. It's good that you have recognised your husband's need for reconciliation with his mom. Unfortunate she did not make a move towards him.

How long has your husband been depressed and had counselling? How do you think it's going? I wonder if you can persuade him to get a mental health plan from his GP and see a psychologist. I take it his counsellor is not a psychologist. After years of depression I think he would be more self aware. However you cannot change anyone except yourself and it's good to remember that. Once you can accept this you can concentrate on your wellness. It's not selfish or bad, it's realistic and necessary.

Have you ever talked about your husband with your daughters? As they are now adults they should be able to hold a conversation on this topic. Have a chat about how you and your children can help him, what's the best way to get through to him, even if his counsellor is doing anything for him. He may be a good counsellor but all mental health professionals do not get on or understand all their clients. It needs to be a reasonable fit.

I had to smile when you said, To my detriment, I can’t hold my tongue. Ah how well I know that. It's got me into heaps of trouble and the lessons have been hard but I am slowly thinking before I open my mouth. I launched a tirade back, borne of deep hurt and years of living with this shadow in the room that I can’t see. Well that's understandable, it's called being human. The other side is that your husband was not speaking, it was his shadow which did not care how you were hurt so long as it can remain. When someone refuses help, tells you it's not your business it is often out of their own guilt for not being a better person. Sadly their idea of a better person is usually unrealistic because they mean perfect. If only...

Mary

Where to from here?

Xiomara — Sun, 20 Jan 2019 14:02:04 GMT

Thank you Mary, your words mean a great deal, especially as we also have been married 30 years. I am terrified of the financial implications of leaving, being really scared of that horrifying new statistic that women in their 50s are ending up divorced and homeless at greater rate than anyone other demographic. The first 20 years were fantastic. We never argued, hardly even disagreed. He was ( and still is) a great and involved parent. He works hard. The decline started about 10 years ago, coming and going and settling in full time around 5 years ago, with the onset of age related health problems. I believe it is a psychologist that he sees, he originally did the 6 sessions thru Medicare, I think, I don't actually know, because I have never received a straight answer to my question. I have spoken with the girls, as they are adults and they are supportive, but one lives overseas and one lives interstate, so it is tricky. I have become adept at recognising when the shadow ( black dog) is talking and when it is my husband,the tone is completely different. I don't believe that he has fully recognised yet that he has depression. I suppose the hard thing is that the person they are talking to, is always just me. I am so utterly conflicted and confused and scared. My head is saying: run, get out, leave, go talk to a lawyer, pack your bags, sell the house, have a chance at happiness. My heart it going: 30 years, holy shit I've spent more than half my life with this man, he is not a bad man, he does not shout ( he barely talks most of the time there is just silence, but not the companionable kind) this man has never ever done anything untoward to me, this man I promised to be beside in sickness and in health and I'm just going to admit defeat and failure and walk out, what the? I can't sleep properly, I must be boring my two besties to death with it and I just cannot encourage him to talk. and I know that badgering is useless so I am not doing that either. I am staring at a brick wall right now and I am freaking out.

Where to from here?

geoff — Sun, 20 Jan 2019 15:18:08 GMT

Hello Xiomara, perhaps I'll briefly explain my situation, our marriage lasted 25 years, and the last year or two was the worse, I was the person who had depression and self-medicating using alcohol, 2 adult sons who had left home and moved a couple of hours away, mother in law was staying with us and she was never a problem.

We had an adventurous life as couples do, but with one major consequence that happened to me, but as time progressed I had a breakdown, no one could talk to my shadow, so my wife moved out with her mum, and then eventually divorced me.

I can't blame her for doing this, but we still talk and see each other at various times and looking back at it now, no matter how much I wanted to stay married to her and live in a house we had gutted and redecorated, there was no other option.

I'm happy and that's what you need to do, enjoy the many years ahead of you.

Best wishes.

Geoff.

Where to from here?

White_Rose — Sun, 20 Jan 2019 21:48:34 GMT

Dear Xiomara

Thank you for your lovely reply. Yesterday was my birthday and I had a party with my family and friends. My daughters basically took over the food and drinks while my grandchildren enjoyed taking food platters around. My sons-in-law, my son and my ex did the heavy lifting like putting up the shade cover, mending the big umbrella so that I can use it again. My daughter-in-law to be and my eldest daughter installed the printer the family gave me for my birthday and all the washing up was done although most of it was disposable. They even emptied the bin.

Such a lovely time. The girls told me to go and talk to my guests so I did. Even though my husband and me separated 18 years ago I have grown accustomed to him being at family gatherings and he was on his best behaviour. I think one or other of my daughters had put the hard word on him. So how is this helping you? Well there is life after divorce and I was able to build a house. My children had all left home by then. Supporting myself was a worry but fortunately I had a good job. I was so pleased I rejoined the workforce when all my children (4) had started school. I think without that lifeline I would have been in a pickle.

Sorry to rabbit on about myself. I still feel so blessed to have my family and know they love me. Even when I do not see them often enough I know they are there for me and I lean on them if necessary. You do not need someone living with you to give you support. Try phoning your daughters. I know some of the phone companies offer cheap rates to nominated overseas phones. Why not look around and see if you can get a deal like this. My 'packager' includes interstate calls as well as local all with no extra charge. Alternatively get Skype and talk that way. It only costs if you use Skype to make phone calls. Perhaps your daughters can install Skype on their computers and you can see each other when chatting. I have found it comfortable to chat to my family, both boys as well as the girls. How does that sound?

I see James suggested getting some help for yourself and you sounded surprised. I believe you are in a grief and loss situation. The man you married has been absorbed into the shadow much of the time and this is so painful for you, particularly as you have such happy memories. Can you have a chat to your GP? Basically tell him/her what you have said here. Copy your posts print it to show the doctor. It will help him/her to understand why you are seeing him.

Mary