topic Destructive MIL in Relationship and family issues

Destructive MIL

Ariel_84 — Mon, 21 Mar 2016 09:46:42 GMT

My MIL is a manipulative & destructive woman. She told my 4 year old to eat nuts when she suffers anaphylaxis, MIL & FIL took her without asking while on a family picnic & abused me for telling her it's unacceptable pointing her finger in my face & she was going to wash her hands of me, while I was pregnant suffering hyperemisis in & out of hospital she turned husband against me & my family & also told my daughter to listen to nan & not mummy because nan is right, during my whole pregnancy she was relentless. The more ill I was the worse she became.. she even tried telling my family & husband I was suffering from a mental illness. She refused to acknowledge I was suffering hyperemisis & was only pregnant. When bub was born she refused to even acknowledge me giving me dirty looks. It was horrible. My husband is an only child. MIL has a strong hold over him. MIL has told me she's ending my marriage, taking husband away & we'll never seem him again, said my daughters allergies & anaphylaxis are rubbish & lies about everything. My 4 year old is seeing a psychologist & has been traumatised by MIl. My six month old has been exposed to MIL's abuse. Husband is conflicted. This woman seems set on destroying me, my children, my marriage, my husband. Husband would tell me she treated her dog better then him, that she never read or sang to him. She would manipulate husband & turn him against FIL. My 4 year old is questioning her allergies, speech has been affected & suffering from anxiety. Husband said he would confront MIL when she caused problems but she refused to listen. Husband still defends & makes excuses for MIL. I have taken steps to protect the children & I from MIL. Husband is being pressured by his parents I think he is suffering from depression. He doesn't cope well with stress. I know he needs support. It's such a horrible situation.

Destructive MIL

Jacko777 — Tue, 22 Mar 2016 01:49:54 GMT

Hi Ariel84,

Cripes! What is wrong with her??

I have no advice but if it were me I would stay well away from her, as you are. All you can do is surround your family with love. I think your husband could benefit from professional advice do you think? Perhaps he can find some clarity about what is going on with his mother, find out why she acts the way she does and this might help him to have a better understanding to form a clear response. It would be so confusing and hurtful for him and all of you of course.

I know how frustrating it can be to try and get parents to change for the better, I wonder if anyone like FIL has talked to her about her mental health? I am no doctor but it does sound to me like she is suffering from a mental health issue do you think?

Perhaps it really is time for your family to have fresh plans for your mental health, ensure that you are doing all you can to recover from the past and develop a new outlook for the future. You could ring BB as a starting point or find a good counsellor if you can afford it. Talk here any time, your hubby is welcome here too of course, much love to all of you.

Jack

Destructive MIL

pipsy — Tue, 22 Mar 2016 02:27:53 GMT

Dear Ariel. Hi, hope we can be of some help or support for you. It sounds as though your MIL has some major jealousy problems accepting her son with a family of his own. Her son (your hubby) is in a no-win situation here. On one hand he has a mother who wants to be in total control of everything and everyone. On the other hand he has a family of his own that he's trying to do his best for. He's bending over backwards trying to please everyone and the poor thing is probably extremely miserable, just wants to disappear completely. MIL's so p*** off with him for marrying and daring to have a child, you're equally p*** off because MIL's trying to control you and child. Doesn't matter what hubby (son) does, he can't get a break from the situation. Your hubby is 100% depressed with the pressure he's under. You're going to have to be strong and a bit hard here. You're going to have to make the decision hubby is unable to make. I would suggest you tell hubby, spend time with parents if you like (his decision, there, either way), meantime you set the boundaries with m/d as far as contact with children. I would say maybe an hour tops g'parents have contact with children (with you if you like, or not). That's your call to make. No giving children eats, make sure they have something before they go. If they want a drink, water only, unless you give them something to take. It is pointless getting Dr's notes re: the anaphylaxis your daughter has, MIL wouldn't acknowledge it. If MIL ignores ruling on eats or drinks, no more contact. Tell hubby and MIL straight, your choice, my rules, take it or leave it. Also tell them this is their one chance to either play by your rules or no contact. As I said, you're going to have to be extremely strong and a bit hard. I realize it's a hard decision and only you can make it. Basically, your way or the highway. I've had to sever all contact with my ex and his family because of his b*** of a mother. My ex was too emotionally weak to walk away from her destructive nature, so I did. If we'd had kids, I would've done what I've just suggested. I've had to learn to be a bit hard through my own destructive family.

Sorry if I sound harsh, hope I haven't upset you.

Destructive MIL

Ariel_84 — Tue, 22 Mar 2016 04:20:36 GMT

Hi Pipsy, I agree there are some jealousy issues. I'm a family person & have gone out of my way to involve MIL & FIL. It feels like MIL is only out to sabotage hubbys happiness. MIL has caused problems which have caused a divide between my parents & sisters with hubby. They were all very close they were family. MIL was very jealous of my mum there was no reason for it. Hubby was happy until MIL involved herself & then everything in our lives started to fall apart. Now that its affecting my children I've put my foot down & there's no contact. Thankfully inlaws live 3 hours ago! FIL phoned me threatened I would lose my husband, my home & the kids would lose their inheritance.. for me my childrens mind is more important then those things.. MIL doesn't listen to anyone.. before I was with hubby I would see her.manipulate hubby & turn him against his father for something he refused to buy her or something she wanted done.. I always said to hubby to speak to his dad about it.. instead hubby & MIL would gang up on FIL & refuse to speak to him for weeks or be short with him.. the poor guy had no idea.. The day he phoned me & threatened me I told him this.. he didn't say anything. I think MIL has always been this way & wont ever change. I feel sorry for my kids they're innocent in this. I think if hubby stays with inlaws he will only return more confused & angry. I think at least with the children he can enjoy himself. I really wish he would see her for what she is..

Destructive MIL

Jacko777 — Tue, 22 Mar 2016 04:27:33 GMT

That's why I think it would help for your hubby to get some counselling, so he can see her for what she is. Would he a see a counsellor to discuss this?

Jack

Destructive MIL

Ariel_84 — Tue, 22 Mar 2016 04:44:43 GMT

Earlier today I suggested he make an appointment to see a counselor which he dismissed.. he sent me a text telling me to lodge child support.. One day he's saying things like this other days he's being supportive. He can have 5 different personalities in a day. It's confusing to me & the kids. I suspect this may be depression?

Destructive MIL

pipsy — Tue, 22 Mar 2016 05:13:34 GMT

Hi Ariel. It sounds to me as though MIL is ordering him to tell you to lodge a claim for child support. As I said earlier, the poor guy doesn't know whether he's coming or going. He could be quite scared of his mum too. She must have an incredibly strong personality to have this much say. I hate to say this, but I wondering if she's using emotional blackmail on him. You know what I mean: someday I'll be dead and you won't have me any more and it'll be your fault. If that is the case (not saying for a moment, it is), but, if it is, she definitely knows what buttons to push. She's very insecure and lonely too actually. If she was secure and happy with a full life, none of what's happening, would be happening. People who are jealous usually are very insecure and lonely and want to ruin everyone around them to make them as miserable as they are. There's an old saying: misery loves company. Your hubby needs help, but until he asks for it, there's not a lot you can do. You mentioned hubby is the only child (and a son), she completely idolizes him and needs him to make her happy. You may have to let him go, sorry to say, but I don't see how you and him can have any sort of life, while MIL calls the shots as far as he's concerned. He may want the situation to change, but if she's using emotional blackmail, and he's not that strong, what other recall do you have. I realize you probably still love him, I think underneath he loves you too, but he's just not emotionally powerful enough to take a stand. He's her 'baby' and always will be.

Destructive MIL

white knight — Tue, 22 Mar 2016 05:33:50 GMT

For clarity of what your MILmight have re illness google "queen witch hermit waif"

Seems classic narcissist. Your FIL is a speaker for her, under her spell. Son won't ever find the courage to stand up to her till much older.

Sad as it seems leaving hubby for a while would have a positive effect, that he has to realise where she is stepping over the line but remember... He'll have access and in-laws will have lots of access to your kids.

If you stick with hubby try asking him lots of questions eg why did your mum give me a dirty look? Why does she ignore my instructions with our children? What is her issues with me? Why isn't happiness possible within this family. ?

You husbands swinging is likely directly to do with his contact with his mum.

All this happened to me. I even had an intervention order against her so my 2nd wedding went uninterrupted. She ruined my 1st wedding. They stop at nothing to conquer (witch), to own you (the queen), to use others as a weapon(the waif) and blackmail to hurt you ( the hermit)

Tony wk

Destructive MIL

pipsy — Tue, 22 Mar 2016 06:00:39 GMT

Hi Tony. I must say I was thinking narcissistic MIL too, but didn't want to say. Ariel could try questioning MIL's 'dirty looks' to DIL, but I think that's going to put more of a strain on his already weak shoulders. Her hubby is totally unable to defend her against his mother. Anything she does to question his loyalty to his mother is going to cause him more problems than he can handle. Unfortunately, by the time m passes, too much damage might already have been done. My ex MIL/FIL still very much alive, still has ex running after them. He says he wants to be with me, too much damage done by them. I can't trust him.

We still don't live together, may never. Wish I could meet a man who doesn't have parents. Are there any? lol.

Destructive MIL

Ariel_84 — Tue, 22 Mar 2016 06:05:53 GMT

Hubby agrees that MIL has narcissistic tendencies. Hubby is close to 40.. I agree the swinging is due to contact from either MIL or FIL. In regards to asking questions I have done this is the past & husband has told me to just ignore her or he shakes his head.. other times he gets fired up but not sure if he confronts her.. he says he does but who knows.. I have seen FIL stand up to her & MIL has told him "enough xxxx" & shot him down & FIL says nothing. Fortunately I have an intervention order in place to protect the children & I.. MIL can't have any contact & that's a relief..

Destructive MIL

pipsy — Tue, 22 Mar 2016 07:03:31 GMT

Hi Ariel. I had the same thing with my ex, re: MIL. He would tell me to ignore her, how can you when she won't let up? My ex also claims he's confronted his mum, whether he does, like you, I have my doubts. My ex in-laws, have given my ex all sorts of advice re: our matrimonial situation i.e give her nothing, she chose to leave, it's her fault etc. I was also informed by my ex, that me and his mum were both as bad as each other, what a cop out. Can I ask the in-laws age, mine are late 80's. I have been told that when my ex looses his parents, he may want me for emotional support. He also told me recently that when they die, I won't be able to attend either funeral as I haven't been considered part of the family for a long time. When my mum died 21 years ago, I had to go to N.Z, ex didn't come, claimed he couldn't get leave, he was a prison officer at the time. Sorry, but what goes round, comes round, when he looses his m/d, he's on his own as I was. If that makes me a bad person, so be it. If he only wants me when he's alone, that's his problem. I have my own life now. Emotional support has to go both ways. If he can't support me when I need it, I can't be there for him.

Destructive MIL

Ariel_84 — Tue, 22 Mar 2016 07:33:55 GMT

MIL is about 65 & FIL is in early 70s. I spoke with hubby said he's copping it from his parents, his hearing things from me & also our 4 year old & he needs some professional advice I also gave him the beyond blue details he said nothing just walked away & went to sleep to escape from it all.. I'm a strong believer in karma & I know when it comes to the kids & I that it will be ok but for hubby it will be a different story. I have told him if I have to go through child support there's no going back. MIL has turned her back on him when he needed help in his life saying he's not my responsibility he's a grown man look after yourself.. it was me & my mother that said to her that's not right parents should show support no matter what age.. At a crucial time where husband was making admissions for substance use MIL made excuses saying it was a marriage issue. FIL stood up for hubby saying he needs help & he's asking for it so we need to help. MIL told FIL it's not their problem & to stay out of it. If husband chooses MIL I know it's not going to be all rosey between them. I think he forgets what life with her is really like. He forgets all the times she has broken his heart when all he wanted was support or encouragement. It's sad. If husband sacrifices the kids & I he will lose and he knows this.. All I want is for him to see his mum for what she is & to realise that her way isn't always the right way.. Hubby is a distant father.. & he thinks it's normal.. I overcompensate for him.. my daughter tells me I'm her mumma & daddy..

Destructive MIL

pipsy — Tue, 22 Mar 2016 07:54:51 GMT

Hi Ariel From what I've just read, MIL wants everything her way. She wants to control son, but won't accept her fault in his problems. Hubby knows your daughter has an allergy to nuts, why can't he at least defend her to precious mum? Was he 'using' before he met and married you, if so, why? I would say his substance abuse problem has been brought on by mothers inability to help him 'grow up'. When narcissistic mums try to control their children, the results are disastrous. Your hubby is a prime example of this. He's so confused between overbearing mum and wife trying to keep the peace, he can't think straight. Have you thought about possibly leaving the kids with your family for a bit of a break, just you and hubby? He needs to be able to sort out where his head is at. If he can be persuaded to get away and no contact with his parents for a week or weekend, that might help him. He needs to be in a peaceful place away from arguments. Maybe get some literature re: narcissistic personality disorder. Let him read it at his own pace. Learn something about it yourself, so if he asks questions, you can answer without mentioning names. Do you think he would be willing to go away, just the two of you? At this stage you have nothing to lose, and if it can save your marriage, what a coup for you. The most important thing, if he does agree, let him talk, don't criticize mum, don't apologize for her. If he say he loves her, grit your teeth, count to 200 (lol), say nothing. If he says he hates her, same thing, say nothing. Let him unload. He may say he has to ask m, if he does, fine, don't argue. Show him the adult in you that I know is there. Let m do the complaining, he may wake up if she does, no guarantees. Basically, I'm offering you a chance to 'make or break'.

Good luck, whatever happens.

Destructive MIL

white knight — Tue, 22 Mar 2016 10:34:14 GMT

Lets talk about hubby Ariel. Being under control of his mum as I had for 54 years isn't an easy place to be either. He risks losing his parents AND any other family members that she can take away from him. I lost many relatives to this day wont talk to me since my sister and I terminated our relationship with our mother in 2009.

My close cousin I call "bro" visited once recently. I was expecting his questions. "Is there any chance you could see your mothers good side...I mean if she was in hospital with no chance of survival ...you'd visit her right" ?

"Firstly, I don't interfere between your mother and you bro. I understand how my mothers power can manipulate you to this extent. Your brothers sisters, mother and many others no longer talk to me...such is her power. My mother has a nurturing side but its her evil that I cannot live with. And its her desire to control my life I have broken free from ...to rob her of such power. So let it rest my dear cousin".

He did and pledged he wouldn't mention her again. He realised.

Bare in mind that comments over the years my mother has thrown at me have ben lifelong scars. "he is my favourite and so is ...." (her nephew and grand daughter) - a common one "I'll cut you out of the will". "you always were no good as a son" (that breaks my heart just writing it)

But Ariel, you and your hubby are damned either way, whichever way you turn. If you and he ever got into her good books it wouldn't be for long. My mother had a cycle of around 9-10 weeks then it would come round to me again or my sister.

I cant find it now but there was a youtube video that went for 59 seconds, from a psychiatrist in New York. His advice when you have a narcissist in your family? - get away, for there is little chance to no chance of them seeking medical help and if they do it wouldn't be a permanent commitment. That's because "its everyone elses fault"...even the doctors.

Clarity in these things is a godsend. It tells us how deep the issues are and how far the arguments travel and hurt permanently. The power to manipulate others like plasticine is a cunny one. Taking their power away in terms of your absence is the only effective method....and it drives them to great frustration for only then do they realise they have ruined the relationships for good and they wont see their grandchildren grow.

All they had to do was give love to the little ones and respect you as the parent.

Ton WK

Destructive MIL

pipsy — Tue, 22 Mar 2016 11:49:08 GMT

Hi Tony. After reading your post, I have to totally agree with you. If Ariel, can get her hubby to agree to a time away with her, his mum will go ballistic. He will never be accepted back into her life. She's wanting all or nothing. The best course of action is for them both to completely cut ties. Whether he is strong enough, only they know that. Even if Ariel's MIL did go to a Dr, she would still twist the truth to her satisfaction. I suggested time away because Ariel commented that if they could get away, she might be able to get her hubby to 'see the light'. From the sounds of things hubby knows mum is narc, but knowing, and being strong enough to break free are two different issues. My ex MIL is narc too, but my ex refuses to listen to anything about narc's, because he's not strong enough to break free. My ex FIL is chauvinistic, but manages to cover it by claiming everything he says is a 'joke'. Narcissistic MIL, chauvinistic FIL, how lucky was I? I go along with everything you've said, as I said earlier. Ariel does too, but re-programming her hubby is a long, slow process because his mum has him so confused. Narc's are fantastic at confusing people, they specialize in it and you really don't always know till it's too late. Hopefully Ariel can salvage her marriage, but hubby is going to have to cut that umbilical cord for them to have any chance.

Destructive MIL

Ariel_84 — Wed, 23 Mar 2016 02:03:00 GMT

Hubby is scared to lose his parents "they're the only family he has".. I remind him that the kids & I are his family too & are his future. His primary responsibility is father & husband & not son. Unfortunately he seems to get brainwashed "blood is thicker then water". He worries about his dads health but I remind him I was in hospital less then a month ago & still recovering from pneumonia & my immune system is low because of the stress imposed on me, having a six month old baby waking 4 times a night & helping my 4 year old understand things is so draining. God forbid anything could happen to anyone you don't have to have a bad heart - the fear dumped on him is horrible! Regarding drugs.. Hubby used marijuana - never really had friends growing up.. with me he stopped using and down the track after marrying he started using ice on and off.. he said he uses it because he's bored, or anxious or angry. He doesn't cope well with stress anyone that knows him knows this but his mother seems to be causing him problems non stop. I spoke with him earlier today and we are both quite stressed. MIL is challenging the intervention order & I'm doing what I need to do to keep it. Hubby is pressured. Hubby said he wasn't going to call beyond blue.. he said it was a suicide line & I explained to him that I'm getting support & it's giving me release & I'm receiving some great advice too! I told him there are men in his position & men who have experienced what he is going through. I think if he contacts beyond blue or joins the forum he will feel so much better within himself & may chose to cut ties for 3 months.. yes MIL will be put in her place by her son & he will feel better not having her pressure him. Hubby has a very close relationship with my dad.. a dad son relationship.. my dad is concerned for hubby.. he's happy to talk to him.. going away isn't an option.. I'm stilk recovering & financially things are a mess (primarily the result of MIL) but it's easter weekend & we'll have fun with the kids.. Hubby is an absolute wreck & we both need a break.. I can't believe how much control this woman has..

Destructive MIL

pipsy — Wed, 23 Mar 2016 02:25:16 GMT

Dear Ariel. You actually sound more positive, that's fantastic. The down side to hubby 'cutting' ties with MIL, is that she may explode, blame you etc...It's great though, that he is prepared to go that far. Try and stop him from using ice, that's a dreadful drug. Try and get some pamphlets re: ice, both for hubby and yourself. The consequences of using ice can be disastrous. You say you can't believe how much control MIL has, I can. In my experience narcissistic people exercise incredible control in such a clever, manipulative way. They may use any argument to get what they want. If you can get some literature re: narcissism, it might be helpful for hubby to read. It may hurt him emotionally, initially, because no-one wants to believe their parents are like that. Maybe it would help if your husband got more information about bb and how they can help too. Perhaps you could show him the bb website or encourage him to call the support service to get some advice, 1300 22 4636.

Best wishes for a pleasant Easter break.

Destructive MIL

white knight — Wed, 23 Mar 2016 07:05:07 GMT

Hi Ariel

You would have noticed Pipsy and I have agreed totally on every topic, every corner of this discussion. It isn't because we are obliged to, its because we have experienced the trauma a narc can do.

That google- 'witch hermit queen waif' covers all the 4 likely characters of the narc mother. Perhaps you could ask him to read the many write ups on site in google? If he doesn't have an opened mind then you are at a loss. If you could ask him to read this thread?

The cunny of a narc person is extraordinary. These traits and abilities come from a desire to develop weapons against people. The weapons against the mind of another is a really effective one. I can pick a narc person the moment I meet them now!!

With a narc person its all about them. Say hypothetically you and hubby went away for Easter for say 7 days and no one told MIL where or when you would return. If MIl was my mother as soon as I rang her she'd be either in tears or yelling. "I didn't know where you were", I've been worried sick, I've been ill and I couldn't contact you, a good son would have told me where you were going, you dont tell me where you go BUT you make sure SHE (DIL) knows everything" and so on.

Nothing would make me happier to find out you and hubby have found the answers. But the issues lie with him and if he can treat you like the princess he married.

I hope I'm helping with being direct.

Tony WK

Destructive MIL

Ariel_84 — Thu, 24 Mar 2016 00:53:00 GMT

Thank you both for your responses I really appreciate it! I think hubby needs a break from it. It's really overwhelming him. I think he's opening his mind & starting to realise that he has sacrificed alot for his mother. He has lost my extended family with the exception of my dad, he's relationship with our 4 year old isn't very strong, he has missed out on bonding with our 6 month old who has just started saying dadda, we're all feeling run down & we're all sad.. our 4 year old was crying uncontrollably because she feels so sad inside it was heartbreaking to see the affect this woman has had.. especially on my daughter.. I wish I had picked up on the signs.. I saw them but thought once I married things would change.. I remember my FIL had a heart attack & I received a call from my fiance telling me what happened & saying mum has asked if could feed the dogs & clean the vomit on the floor which I was happy to do.. but when I called hubby & said I'm coming to the hospital MIL said I'm not family.. only family can visit.. mind you I had been with hubby for about 8 years.. on another note I've just been to the docs & they had some beyond blue pamphlets which I'll pass onto hubby..

Destructive MIL

Ariel_84 — Thu, 24 Mar 2016 01:23:50 GMT

Tony I read your post "Children of mothers with Borderline Personality Disorder" My MIL is all 4 characters, the "witch", the"queen" the "hermit" and the "waif". My MIL is all 4. I have never heard MIL say a nice thing about anyone she's so negative & she rarely cracks a smile she admits she's broody & says hubby is just like her and is broody.. she says he's broody .. I say he's unhappy.. MIL is a jealous lady.. so much so she told hubby to not buy me anything for valentines days because her hubby never bought her anything & that I expect too much.. When I was pregnant she said infront of hubby she never wanted a boy.. & a month before baby was due said infront of FIL never wanted him & never loved him..I remember comments like these clearly.. hubby doesn't say much about them.. a son should never say his mum treats the dog better then him.. I am honestly the most selfless person.. for my family I would do anything.. I am happy to tell my daughter I love her 100 times a day and she's the same with me.. she also says I love you mummy but I love me too because you have to love yourself to love others.. hubby doesn't say I love you nearly as much as me but I encourage him.. his mother doesn't have an ounce of empathy.. she's one unhappy woman.. MIL & I are polar opposites. I dont understand how she can treat people the way she does.. is this something you're born with or does it develop over time? However it happens I want to do everything in my power to minimize my children being narcissists. My daughter told me a few days ago she sees daddy grumpy but wanted to take a photo of me with a grumpy face because she's never seen me grumpy & she made me smile.. I think I'm doing something right!