topic Re: Disowning relatives in Relationship and family issues

Disowning relatives

white knight — Tue, 19 Mar 2024 16:15:38 GMT

10 years ago I turned 58yo and forcibly retired from work due to MH issues. I needed to regroup, put myself, my daughter and my wife ahead of- everyone. Like many I had a toxic family that ranged from borderline PD to bipolar to anxiety and the dreaded narcissism. Having my own bipolar, anxiety and high functioning autism (recent revelation), I was not much different to my blood relatives except for the narcissism.

Ok, that said I decided to give some relatives one last chance which fed my need to not hold any guilt in the future by rash decisions.

There is the hard and the easy way to cope with rejecting relatives. With previous attempts when younger I'd crumble at the thought, then crumble again when I grieved for them, so I had become a boomerang family member. When I returned to my family the narcs were happy not to talk about what the issue was, to resolve so recurrence didnt happen, so again and again it repeated.

But something changed at 58yo. I decided a few things-

that blood relatives no longer automatically had my presence, that I had the right to reject them for a peaceful existence.
that seeking stability I needed to ensure I didnt have unstable people in my life, that I was to create my own "more" stable world
that my wife should no longer carry the burden of my family upsets when she had come from a stable upbringing
that 58 years was long enough and if I was lucky enough to last another 25 years that I could choose then to mould those years into happier times

The above decision making says it all and I've gradually found peace from family problems. Yes, the occasional relative I still have in my life will call and ask if they can mediate and I politely decline. Those calls are examples of the triangulation from rejected family members.

Do I miss them- oh, yes, but the cycle would return if I allowed them back in. My family ensured that guilt was a major weapon so I know my guilt especially that my 93yo mother is still alive, would eat at me. But alas, if I visited her after so many years I know the guilt would be her priority then she'd haunt me from her grave.

Troubled people have to build a world around themselves and only issue passes to those that either understand or have a level of loyalty that you feel safe with.

These are desperate situations, suicidal thoughts, attempts, suffering through rage and comments from despicable people. Being blood does not mean you are a punching bag.

If thats you then untie the rope, let that bag drop...

TonyWK

Re: Disowning relatives

Croix — Wed, 20 Mar 2024 11:26:04 GMT

Dear Tony~

It sounds like you have made some wise -if difficult - decisions.

My own family and I parted when they disinherited me over my choice of partner. It was only after I'd been away from them and gained perspective I realised how toxic and controlling they had been.

I was indeed better off without them and like in your circumstances my partner did not have to put up wiht all the slurs and unkindness she had been exposed to.

Mention of your mother reminded me. Very many years later she contacted my saying she was very ill. I debated for a while but decided duty did call, and in any case she might be a different person towards the end of her life. (And mybe the horse will sing🙂

Sadly that was not the case, she was just as toxic, attempted emotional blackmail and control, and made snide remarks about my second partner whom she had never met. It simply did not work. I persevered at a minimum level until she passed away, at which point I was relieved and glad.

Sadly sometimes one needs to view family wihtout being influenced by one's built-in emotion to form an accurate judgment, and act accordingly.

Croix

Re: Disowning relatives

randomxx — Wed, 20 Mar 2024 14:06:46 GMT

Thanks for the thread Tony l find the experience and stories of you guys and others so helpful and sure many others would to.

l don't think there's much more tormenting than the emotional manipulation some family can be .

Myself thankfully both mum and dad were incredible examples for us all in my family but for some reason it didn't quite rub of onto some. l often wonder how it turned out like that and did they even see the amazing qualities our parents had.

l have 6 sisters, yep, l don't think l could've ordered much more of a nightmare than that. And a lot of brothers to but although we aren't perfect mostly hassle with the brothers but some of the sisters, ldk. How l'm even dealing with it after being away so long and since still being 3hrs away anyway and at this age, later 50s now , is beyond me.

l can't even imagine why they'd even choose drama and toxic over peace and just happily living their lives instead. l mean what the hell even makes people want even more bs at these kind of ages, isn't life hard enough.? Two are younger than me ones older but 3 of the girls in particular .

l lived interstate a long time but since coming back to Vic lm still 3hrs away from most of them and l did choose it that way.

Unfortunately one of them did move up here and only 20mins away from me. That one, she's been calling me up wkly for 30yrs. l don't even know why l was married through most of that and with my family, we weren't even close anyway and talking to her was a nightmare anyway, l hated everyone of those damn calls. Well, about two yrs back l couldn't do it any more and told her l didn't want to ph any more.

She has the weirdest personality that one but she does sort of have a good heart so l felt really bad but her calls were just mad.

The next one, l've always liked her good side even as kids but she's also a two faced lying snake in the grass to. You can't trust her with anything or tell her anything or turn to her with anything even though she'll offer over and over to be there.

Made that mistake going through my divorce and 10 yrs later she's still throwing it in my face and twisting the whole thing. All that was about her too though her h had just left her but she claims to not even remember the hrs and hrs she spent crying to me about all that. l called her 2yrs ago and the bs she came out with was mind boggling. l tried to settle it and then l called her for last Christmas hoping things were ok and well, checking really, and she let go with even more of it. All total bs l don't even know how she dreamt it all up and it was hurtful stuff to and really through me at the time. lt was just a harmless good will Christmas call next minute l'm getting all this ugly mad crap thrown at me and the talks we'd had 10 yrs ago thrown in my face yet again to. For the 2nd time 2yrs apart.

lt all upset me for wks and ruined Christmas and where it even came from 2 yrs in a row to boot, l couldn't even imagine.

So l've since had to cut that one out to now, l can't see any other way. l went out of my way to try to sort her head out on whatever her problem was and got the lowest belt kicks in return any b could dish out- for no reason, both times.

l never would've even imagined 20 yrs ago we'd still deal with this crap at this age.

Re: Disowning relatives

white knight — Wed, 20 Mar 2024 20:17:55 GMT

Hi Croix,

Doing the "right thing" is an admirable endeavour with high risk. Fortunately I'm more aware than ever of my fragility and high cost of exercising any obligations built on guilt. Those roses have to many thorns.

I think the narcissistic element of my mother and sister is the core issue in that a perfect son would not be good enough.

TonyWK

Re: Disowning relatives

white knight — Wed, 20 Mar 2024 20:23:34 GMT

I think in your case, they feed off trauma, gossip and a lust to win. Sibling rivalry is never admitted, it boils under the surface.

Sometimes family can't share their lives and just because one shares blood doesn't justify our persistent attempts to glue it all together. And yes, visiting them only to be taunted for a past history, is reverse therapy.

TonyWK

Re: Disowning relatives

randomxx — Wed, 20 Mar 2024 21:29:48 GMT

Yeah gees ldk Tony , maybe that's what it is. l'll say one thing though l'm done working it out.

That was suppose to say my brothers are mostly hassle free btw , not hassle. But even so , can't really turn to any of them or sing out for a hand either, it's always been really disappointing.Out of all the brothers there's only two of us that have the kind of heart and loyalty mum and dad had. l've always wished at least the brothers could be real brothers, a call away to ea other anytime anywhere if ever needed, always have ea others back , but ha, some kind of fantasy l think.

Re: Disowning relatives

randomxx — Fri, 12 Apr 2024 22:02:33 GMT

Shame, l thought this thread might even become a main go to thread for people with family problems, bc it's a big topic and there's so many posts around about that sort of thing.

At any rate , God ldk.

Had a call yesterday from the one sister lives up here close to my place, now riddled with guilt bc it didn't end well. Of all the "real" things l have to worry about in life atm, l wind up with this rubbish.

For some reason she thinks we're close and get along well but l can tell you anyone around that l got along with in this way isn't around , bc l wouldn't even bother.

This is the sister l had to tell point blank 12mths back l didn't want any more calls from her,they're too much. But she still calls. l mostly don;t answer any more but l have grabbed one or two out of guilt. This one yesterday bc it was in the middle of the day, l actually thought it might be some family problem and so l answered.

Turned out it was nothing so 30mins later l'm still sitting there with her waffling on and on and on as usual, all the same old. You can't even talk back there's no gaps she's just of onto her own planet.

lt's still going so l had to cut in said l have to get of and go do some stuff l'll see ya later and hung up.Top it of l'd had a huge day te day before with work long long drive, long day l was as tired as. But that cutting in was probably only 1 of the only 2 or 3 quick sentences l managed to even get in that whole call, as usual.

Butttt, l end up l feeling bad it was abrupt kind of thing usually is with her but only bc it literally has to be bc there won't be a gap to even ease into a you've gotta get going line in any other way.

Trouble is, it leaves me guilt ridden later, it's happened a few times before. lt just gets to much though your sitting there wasting life with this rubbish just goin on and on and on it's like some twilight zone. lt's too much but she still has no clue and sooo, it's usually wound up ending like that.

Should l feel this guilt though ? You know, most of us have to be at least a little self aware but she just can't see it, can't see herself, doesn't stop , l get to the end of my tether and that's that. l mean she should at least have some sort of idea surely to God.

And don't get me wrong , l have beautiful regular ph convos with the people l do ph with, normal ph calls, normal mutual convo, really enjoyable. But this thing with her, i just can't sit through it and tbh, l don't see why l should l mean she's a woman in her 50s not a teenager, and she's a teacher no less, wake the hell up is the way l see it.

Re: Disowning relatives

white knight — Sat, 13 Apr 2024 06:45:33 GMT

Hi RX

I know the rabbitting on effect very well. However from my research it could be an indication of autism, ADHD, bipolar, personality disorders and so on.

The real problem is trying to maintain a relationship when you cant tolerate the talking. I'm lost on this issue but maybe you can begin asking her to text you instead, that way if she does a lengthy text you can speed read. Many people dont answer the phone and quickly reply "text me instead- thanks"

She doesnt need to know why. You could be in the doctors surgery, dentist or library looking up what to do with compulsive talkers.

TonyWK

Re: Disowning relatives

randomxx — Sat, 13 Apr 2024 11:15:11 GMT

Thanks for that Tony ,appreciated.

But you know what and l know you've been there, but that's exactly it.

Your spot on it's the talking involved if we do cross paths as you say, to vaguely, politely l suppose, maintain some sort of at least civil relationship even if it is only in passing.

She just has a real talent at just saying things, that can just piss you of 1 minute into bumping into her anywhere. A couple of brothers have all the same problems with her. She's not a nasty person it's just all about her personality - which l can not stand, they aren't jabs and pokes, it's her.

l mean l have beautiful relationships and convo with the women in my life but this one, honestly, l'd rather not ever even bother talking with her again.

Do you use the text thing to do you ? l've been trying to train her into that a few yrs now since she moved up here, but she'll still try to call.

Her texts is almost as bad actually tbh, she still has that same knack, but eh it is better than phones and l can keep it very short.

Re: Disowning relatives

randomxx — Sat, 13 Apr 2024 11:33:36 GMT

Actually l'm moving away later in the yr, matter of fact l just picked up my caravan on Thurs Tony, so pleased- topic for another thread l spose buttt, really stoked.

But this thing , her so close now, is one of the reasons and so hopefully it;ll get back to a 10min thing here and there at the odd Christmas every now and then after that, and that - will be that.

l've just gotta get through this yr here with her as pain free as poss now.

Re: Disowning relatives

white knight — Sat, 13 Apr 2024 12:30:47 GMT

In that case just survive it but if she hasn't grappled yhe text thing who's responsibility is it, not yours. This is why she rings you, you're a sounding board, a soft touch in her eyes.

TonyWK

Re: Disowning relatives

randomxx — Sat, 13 Apr 2024 22:25:15 GMT

Yeah ah, thing is l've shut her down and out quite a few times over the yrs she's well aware of at least one thing, that l'm pretty prickly with her but then l feel guilty later on bc she really hasn't done anything wrong and can't get why, it's just her v bloody irritating personality.

Anyway yep , text only from here on , no ifs or buts.

Re: Disowning relatives

David35 — Wed, 24 Apr 2024 01:53:05 GMT

I have a narcissist brother and sister-in-law. I've recently learnt to distance myself from them as they have done during mum's cancer treatment. I got sick of the relationship all being about what we could provide them rather than any sort of mutual respect (give and take). With them it's all take and no give and it's emotionally and spiritually exhausting. I no longer miss his guilt-tripping, his criticisms, his personal attacks and the deep hurt he has caused both mum and I by being so selfish. I miss his kids, but I've realised that one day they'll grow up and make their choices as to whether they want to know their uncle.

Re: Disowning relatives

white knight — Wed, 24 Apr 2024 11:36:08 GMT

I have 2 neices 32 and 30yo that decided to take their mothers side in a dispute. They have their choices. My sister gambled that losing all 3 of them would cause me to buckle. I will never buckle to triangulation. It's wrong and it's cruel.

TonyWK

Re: Disowning relatives

David35 — Thu, 25 Apr 2024 10:28:32 GMT

I think that's what has happened to us. My brother and his wife emotionally blackmailed us with the love of their kids. Unless mum helped finance their bills, expenses, even part of their mortgage, they would cut off themselves off. They knew how much it meant to mum. We said no. Consequently we rarely see them or hear from them. So basically mum and I have been punished for refusing to be used like an ATM. Every day mum cries her eyes out for how she's been treated. I've never experienced cruelty quite like it. They have completely excluded us from their lives, except when they want something of course.

Re: Disowning relatives

Croix — Thu, 25 Apr 2024 14:01:53 GMT

Dear David35~

They really are self-centered and unscrupulous, something you talked about elswhere, particularly as they have two good incomes but just waste the money. I think you are showing great strenght and fortitude in not being a soft touch, though as you say you and you mum have to suffer as a result.

While you may have a realistic picture, does the same apply to your mum? It is terribly upsetting to feel used by one's son and be blackmailed over the grand-kids . Frankly from what you have said before I don't think giving in would do any good, simply encourage more of the same.

It would be natural - though misplaced - for your mum to wonder what she had done wrong to have a son who is so greedy and heart-less. Sadly it is one of the unfair things in life that no matter how hard a parent tried and no matte how much they give love some offspring do not turn out well.

I don't envy you trying to comfort your mum, it must be very hard

Croix

Re: Disowning relatives

white knight — Fri, 26 Apr 2024 09:13:34 GMT

Yes, emotional blackmail is cruel and works best on kind loving fragile people especially grandparents.

The older I get the more clearer the line between right and wrong appears. My last post where my sister used her daughter as weapons was a clear breach of attitude, cruel to me and indeed cruel to place her daughters in a decision situation that they should have been protected from.

David, as hard as this situation is, it is wrong and cruel on your brother and sister in laws part. Yes he's your brother and he has choices how to treat you, and you have choices if you want to tolerate it. By tolerating their behaviour you are endorsing it.

Classic example of this is my 30yo second daughter. She chose to come into my life 6 times in 12 years, remain exchanging messages then 7 to 10 days later block me from our only source of contact- Facebook. She refused to give her address or phone number. My eldest daughter brought up a good point- "as long as you are there for her she won't ever stop her behaviour". After much thought I finally blocked her!. I simply decided not to be treated with disrespect.

How do I cope? By respecting my own rights and protecting my boundaries. If I didn't I'd torture myself... now it does still hurt but it isn't torture.

"I told my youngest once "if I could not pay to fly to London to help you I'd swim there". Now I add "...if respect still exists"

TonyWK

Re: Disowning relatives

randomxx — Sat, 08 Jun 2024 23:03:09 GMT

Hi there David and all.

l agree with the others David , what else can you do . lt just boggles my mind of how some even brothers sisters can be with their own family,just blows my mind but l'd be doing the same thing you are now, l couldn't allow that kind of manipulation.

lt is sad with the kids though l know. l have 6 sisters and another one of mine l've had to cut of completely now. l couldn't even believe the last two phone calls with her, the second one was a more chance thing , but there won't be anymore now. Things she'd said and thrown in my face, invented, twisted, dragged up from decades ago and the aggressiveness, it was mind blowing, out of nowhere.

Sadly though, love her kids but she's probably poisoned them about me now, l won't really know until l see them at a Christmas or somewhere next time.

Ho there Tony and so sorry to hear about your 2nd daughter relationship. Whatever happened back when to make her that way in the first place ? Bc your close to your son and other daughter, she feels left out, your ex poisoned things, or what ?

Mind you l imagine you might prefer not to go into it and no problem if not.

Had a call from the other sister last wk , the irritating one . Third time she's called in the last 5 or 6 wks. l haven't answered the first few but out of shear guilt did answer the last one. said how ya goin M , what's up. She says ah at last l get the man and not the machine and just launched straight of into another one of her 20mins totally out there rambles before l even got another word in.

Harmless enough it's not that, but man. l have real relationships to worry about deal with and to enjoy to, real life, real communication and l'm just thinking , not again, can't do it. Said ok m well l'm starving l've gotta go have tea and got off.

l've been training her to text but she still keeps trying these surprise attack calls to even after l've told her point blank, l mean no ifs no buts l don't wanna call anymore and why.

Anyway, as she's not really a bad person pretty good hearted actually, she's only trying to fix whatever she thinks is broken but she still just has no idea what that actually is and l have "real" relationships very important and very special ones. Real things going on and very very special people to worry about so l'm not about to start teaching her wth the problem is and so her very bloody irritating personality and way lives on.

So re'reading again here just now , l'll still go with your earlier tips l think Tony and just ride out the rest of the yr here, keep it down to text only with her and then l'll be leaving the area anyway and hopefully that'll be that.

Best to all

Re: Disowning relatives

randomxx — Tue, 15 Oct 2024 09:19:35 GMT

Hi there Tony.

Just wanted to ask you a few things about caravaning as l've left and am on the road now.

Not sure if you have a thread somewhere obviously more suitable but this one was all l could find right now.lf you happen to pop in maybe you can put me to a better one so that l can ask you a few things.

Cheers

Re: Disowning relatives

white knight — Tue, 15 Oct 2024 13:19:35 GMT

Yes Rx, post in this one. See you there

https://forums.beyondblue.org.au/t5/staying-well/inexpensive-recovery-idea-camping/td-p/66887