topic Marriage breakup + kids in Relationship and family issues

Marriage breakup + kids

dl23 — Thu, 02 Jul 2020 14:40:45 GMT

So my wife and I met in high school and have been together for 24 years, married for 14 years. Over the past 8 years or so (after second child, now 😎 was born, we have had some ups and downs. I would just sometimes have a go at her about random stuff; money, clothes or food. Then she would try and talk to me and I was too pigheaded and wouldn't really listen.

Now the time has come where she has had enough and wants to sell our new and amazing house, separate into smaller houses/units and rent. We share the custody of our two kids. I am really scared about telling the kids and don't think I can be there for that process. They will be devastated.

I have been trying to say sorry to my wife via emails, text, chatting, video montages and poems but she tells me to stop and that she doesn't love me anymore. She said as I keep hassling her about getting back together, she doesn't even like me and the thought of talking to me or seeing me makes her physically ill. She also said that because I am making her angry, the shared custody will be so much harder.

I have been trying to show her over the past few weeks the new me. I have been calm, positive (as best I can in this situation) and more composed. I would sometimes shout at the kids for being silly but now I use a calm voice always (even when they test my patience).

I haven't been sleeping much and not eating hardly at all for 5 days (lost 4.5kg), due to being nauseous and anxious.

We have just communicated over email and she doesn't even want me to talk to her anymore or make dinner or hot drinks. I responded with I would like to keep doing it. I told her I still love her and apologise a lot for making her angry, when that is not my intention.

I am really scared of not being with her anymore and not living her. I love her so much, even when she verbally attacks me and says she doesn't love me anymore.

I can't rely on my parents as they are away and my wife and my parents never really got along. They kind of caused a lot of the tension and some of the reasons we fought.

How am I going to get through this?

Marriage breakup + kids

Sophie_M — Thu, 02 Jul 2020 14:57:05 GMT

Hi dl23,

Welcome to our friendly online forums. We are so grateful that you have reached out here tonight as we know it can be tough to do this for the first time. We are so sorry to hear about what has happened between you and your wife. It sounds like this must be feeling so overwhelming to cope with, as your wife has been such a big part of your life for such a long time. Please know that you do not have to go through this alone, many in our community have had similar experiences and will be able to understand what you're going through. Hopefully a few of them will pop by and offer you some words of kindness and advice.

If you'd like to talk these feelings through, please know that our Support Service is available 24/7 on 1300 22 4636 or you can get in touch through Webchat 3pm-12am AEST here: www.beyondblue.org.au/getsupport One of the friendly counsellors can offer you some support but also provide you with advice and referrals if this is something that you might find helpful.

You might also be interested in reaching out to our friends at MensLine Australia, which is a free 24/7 telephone and online counselling service for men to be able to talk about emotional health and relationship concerns. You can contact them anytime on 1300 78 99 78, or you can get in touch at https://mensline.org.au/

Please also feel free to keep us updated here on your thread whenever you feel up to it - we hope that you find this to be a safe and non-judgemental space.

Marriage breakup + kids

Mske85 — Thu, 02 Jul 2020 15:33:09 GMT

Hey dl23 it's a really hard situation I was with my partner for 10 years married for 6 and been separated for 7 months and have 2 kids and 3 step kids I did similar stuff at the start to try win her back but it wasn't what the relationship needed, truthfully I had to remind her why she was important as a person and a mother and not try be her partner but be her friend especially for the kids, we are still separated but are good friends unfortunately the kids would of seen the arguments and stuff whilst you were together and it's not healthy I grew up in that environment I would have 2 happy separated parents over a bad together family any day, basically need to work out if you would rather keep pushing her away or becoming her friend and having her in your life regardless of the title as a partner

Marriage breakup + kids

dl23 — Thu, 02 Jul 2020 15:43:19 GMT

Hi Mske85

Thank you very much for the reply and insight. This is all very scary for me. I have known my wife since I was 14. I love her so much and it hurts seeing her and not being able to do anything.

She is organising for the house to be put on the market. Fingers crossed it takes a while. Our house is pretty expensive for the area so it may be hard to sell.

I am really scared of living by myself and lonely when the kids aren't with me. I am scared for when the kids are told this. They are 8 and 12.

I also will have to come up with money for all new appliances and furniture.

I can't believe this is happening. I can't imagine not loving my wife, even if hypothetically she did something really bad to hurt me.

Marriage breakup + kids

dl23 — Thu, 02 Jul 2020 15:46:03 GMT

Hi Mske85

Good to hear your situation is going well. Do you and your ex wife get together with the kids for special events or do you go to each others houses for family dinners or anything?

I don't think I could handle my wife with another partner in the future. It would devastate me.

Marriage breakup + kids

White_Rose — Thu, 02 Jul 2020 20:37:38 GMT

Hello di23

I'm not sure how much help I can give you. This is my experience of separation. You sound very much like my ex who I left 20 years ago. Yes he had lots of good points but liked to put me down especially in front of others. At first it was hard for me to cope on my own when I moved out and built a house. I always knew that if I went back I would never leave again as it was such a shattering experience. I also felt the situation would not improve and would likely get worse. That alone was enough to keep me separated.

I see him at family gatherings, grandchildren's birthday parties etc. It was very hard to start with and I tried not to speak to him. It's easier these days and we talk quite amicably about various things. He still tries to bully me but not as much as before and I think he has realised the rest of the family have seen through his ploys. I am not saying you deliberately bully your wife but this is how it may well come across. It's the same when you shout at the children. I can see you are trying to change your ways which is a great start.

I wanted to go to marriage counselling with him but he said no because there was nothing wrong with him. There are reasons why he behaved in this fashion, and continues to do, and I understand these. However I feel it's not an excuse to treat me in the way he did.

I suspect the more you try to persuade your wife to stay together the more irritated she will become. I expect she made her decision some time ago after much thought. Whether or not it was a good decision I cannot say as everyone is different. Have you moved out of your marital home?

Mske45 has made some good points about trying to help as a friend not trying to win her back as a spouse. You may well get together again but I think a great deal will have to change before that. You need to take responsibility as a parent and friend. Help your wife sell the house, make sure you are present when you both tell the children you are separating. I know it will be difficult for you but it will also be difficult for your wife. Letting her carry the load on her own does not demonstrate that you have changed. Text messages etc and protestations of love are not what is required at the moment. Try working together to separate and you may find that down the track a little way you can reunite.

I also suggest you try marriage counselling. Go to Relationships Australia and get some help there. At the very least it demonstrates willingness.

Mary

Marriage breakup + kids

dl23 — Thu, 02 Jul 2020 21:30:18 GMT

Hi Mary

Thanks for the support and information you provided. Oh and also providing your story. Yeah my wife said it was like I was beating her but it was with emotional abuse. I will talk to her this morning and tell her I want us to be good friends and I would rather talk to her than not talk to her. I will tell her I will always love her, support her and care for her no matter what. We are going to be renting close to each other due to kids school and sporting in similar area (I hope doesn't steal the houses I am looking at down the track - haha).
We are still under the same roof but we have been talking normally, until I approach and ask her if we can talk about 'it'. She shuts me down straight away. The house is being looked at by real estate agent today as we need to finish garden off. Such a shame it is brand newly built two storey house with a pool, grass and electric car gate and pedestrian gate. Now we are going to live in small little houses which we hated living in before (that's why we built this awesome house). That in it's self will be depressing.

Marriage breakup + kids

Guest909 — Thu, 02 Jul 2020 23:32:13 GMT

G'day dl23

I don't have a lot to add on the emotional issues that you are going through; but I can relate to the nausea, the anxiety and the sleep loss.

My wife of 30 years did the same to me; for no real reason that I can identify. When I tried to discuss the issues all I got was a bunch of excuses that did not make a lot of sense. It was as if she was talking about a completely different relationship; it was as if she was reading from a playbook - "How to Divorce you Husband and Win".

We both agreed to go to marriage counselling but that ended abruptly when my wife said the counsellor was "not doing it right". I can only guess that the marriage became too much of an inconvenience (commitment) after I retired.

In your posts, you mentioned a few things that started to ring alarm bell in my head.

1) "She also said that because I am making her angry, the shared custody will be so much harder."

2) "She is organising for the house to be put on the market."

3) "The house is being looked at by real estate agent today as we need to finish garden off"

I would suggest that you hold off on the sale of the house until, a property settlement and a parenting plan has been agreed too. Any informal arrangement about property and parenting will mean nothing once the law gets involved. At the very least, I would suggest that you get legal advice before selling the house.

You might want to separate amicably, but you wife may not. Her attitude would suggest the latter.

Just a few practical things to think about, if you have not already done so.

Marriage breakup + kids

dl23 — Fri, 03 Jul 2020 00:30:01 GMT

Hi Mr Paul

Thanks for the advice and sorry to hear about your situation. We might make no profit or very little. She said everything will be halved and she will give me the bank details for any outstanding personal loans. Also have to pay for half of private school fees which is fine. We won't need a lawyer. It will be fair. Custody will be shared. I will have them for school holidays and do school pickups as well as do sports on weekend. There is no issue with our kids. I will talk to her about the legal advice and lawyers to settle it. We should be able to do it equally. I will get stuck with paying for new furniture, bedding, appliances and my car loan that we did share cost for. We payed her car off last year but said it's now my car only when house sells (she wants her name taken off the loan).

Marriage breakup + kids

Guest909 — Fri, 03 Jul 2020 01:36:02 GMT

"We won't need a lawyer".

If you can come an agreement about property, child maintenance, a parenting plan, and spousal maintenance (if necessary) this is the best way of doing it; kudos to you and your wife; that is the best approach by far.

That being said, the agreement(s) that you reach should be formalised by a legal document - for that, you will need a lawyer. I say this because any informal agreement you reach will mean nothing if the lawyers get involved years down the track.

There are many dangers to an informal settlement; this is why you should seek legal advice before selling the house.

Here is a link that you might find helpful. Many lives have be turned upside down by a legal challenge to property settlement 10 to 20 years "out of time".

https://www.streeterlawfirm.com.au/dangers-of-delaying-property-settlement/

I know that this is something that you don't want to think about; especially if you think the separation will be amicable.

Many family law specialists will give you a free 30-60 minute first consultation. I will cost nothing to get some good advice.

All the best on your long journey.

Marriage breakup + kids

dl23 — Fri, 03 Jul 2020 08:20:49 GMT

So just got home to find my wife had cleaned the house spotless and had made notes on finishing touches (lights, fittings) needed before it goes on the market. Part of me thought it was like a bluff but it's really happening. She wants to sell our awesome new house that took a lot of frustration with the builder and trades (taking trades to court).

I am so depressed.

She must really hate me to want to give the house up and move to a tiny house/unit/townhouse that is old.

I thought there might be some breathing time to see how the relationship goes but I guess when she says 'she doesn't love me anymore, she doesn't even like me and the thought of talking to me or seeing me makes her physically ill.', she is very serious.

I can't believe this is happening. My life is over.

Marriage breakup + kids

dl23 — Fri, 03 Jul 2020 08:22:23 GMT

Hi Mary

I mentioned marriage counselling but she said I need to fix myself so I can be a good dad. She doesn't even want to try.

Marriage breakup + kids

Sophie_M — Fri, 03 Jul 2020 08:31:46 GMT

Hey dl23, its Sophie from the moderation team here. Just wanted to check-in with you and see how you're coping. It sounds like it was a really stressful and upsetting day for you and we're so sorry to hear this. It must be devastating to have your wife wanting to sell the house you both built together while also trying to process the state of your relationship with her. Please know that our community is here to support through this difficult time and please keep updating us on how things progress.

We want you to know that there is always help available to you. We would recommend that you get in touch with an organisation called Relationships Australia on 1300 364 277. They provide relationship support services for individuals, families and communities and aim to support all people in Australia to achieve positive relationships. Please do feel free to contact the Beyond Blue Support Service anytime on 1300 22 4636 or get in touch with us on Webchat 3pm-12am AEST here: www.beyondblue.org.au/getsupport. One of the friendly counsellors can offer you some support but also provide you with advice and referrals for seeing a counsellor in a more ongoing way if this is something you feel would be beneficial.

Marriage breakup + kids

dl23 — Fri, 03 Jul 2020 08:38:52 GMT

Thank you Sophie. I will call them on Monday when my wife goes back to work.

Marriage breakup + kids

Guest909 — Fri, 03 Jul 2020 09:19:14 GMT

It hurts, I know; that is how I felt.

If things are moving too fast; you have the right to slow things down. I assume the house is in joint names. If that is the case, she will need your agreement (signature) to sell. Don't let her pressure you into doing anything you are unhappy about. If you need more time, then take the time you need. You have a lot to discuss and a number of legally issues to sort out before the house is sold.

In some ways my separation was similar to your current situation. My wife didn't want to try and save the marriage; she had me convinced that I was the problem. Everything that she accused me of doing were the things that she had done. Somehow her bad behavior was redirected and projected back onto me. It took me a good while to realise that I was not the problem.

Getting to the point, you may not be the bad person that you think you are. You may in fact be a good father.

Just a few thoughts to get you thinking!

Marriage breakup + kids

dl23 — Fri, 03 Jul 2020 09:40:15 GMT

Hi Mr Paul

That was a very kind post. I have said sorry probably 100 times over the past few weeks via different communications. I have been sworn at (I said I love you as she was leaving and she turned around and said '__ off'), been called a mofo, been told the sight of me or talking to me made her physically ill. She hasn't said sorry but I think she has every right to say these things after I didn't treat her properly all those years. I am being a new person and not becoming angry and aggressive. I even show very good patience with my youngest child who can be very challenging at times. I just deep breaths.

I don't know if I can tell my wife to slow down on the house sale. She basically hates me but we did agree if the price isn't right, we won't sell it. It is a buyers market at the moment and house prices are lower. Plus our house stands out in the area (way above median house prices in the area). Maybe that will slow down the sale. Hopefully our house has gone up in value as well.

I don't want to lose my wife completely, as a friend, and having to share custody. Is it a safe or very risky move to ask her to slow down the house situation?

Marriage breakup + kids

dl23 — Fri, 03 Jul 2020 09:40:57 GMT

Sorry forgot to mention the house is in joint names.

Marriage breakup + kids

Guest_7403 — Fri, 03 Jul 2020 10:29:38 GMT

This is fairly typical response for when one person wants to leave the relationship.

You don't need to ask your wifes permission to slow down the house sale, it is in both your names.

You simply tell her you're not ready for this step, and you won't be agreeing to list the house at this time.

Let her chuck a hissy fit, shes already left you and treated you poorly after making her decision.

Marriage breakup + kids

dl23 — Fri, 03 Jul 2020 10:39:05 GMT

Yeah she would get more angry. Definitely. I was going to say to her when she brings up about the real estate agent coming around, is it really a bad idea us still living with each other if we talk nicely to each other like we have been (before my last attempt at salvage)? I would say 'you look nice today' and she would say thanks or I would say 'have a nice day' and she would say the same. I mean whats the alternative if we sell:

1. Tell the kids who will be devastated
2. Live in an awesome house instead of renting something over half the size and not as nice (swim in the pool in spring if we're still here). Might show her how happy the kids are as a selling point.
3. Time heals all wounds. Maybe something might shift eg.

Marriage breakup + kids

ecomama — Fri, 03 Jul 2020 12:29:00 GMT

Dear dl23

I'm so sorry you find yourself in this situation. You have so many concerns which are valid concerns.... to you.

Clearly your wife has made up her mind and has the right to separation and divorce. Nowadays neither spouse need give reasons for why they want to separate or divorce but she has. And you've listened. That's really good that you've heard her now, but she does seem determined to follow through.

This is something out of your control.

Echoing Mr Paul's advice, I urge you to at least hear a lawyer's perspective on this. IT'S VERY IMPORTANT you get legal advice. The last thing you want is her coming back in 5y for any further assets or Supers you accumulated - it happens. It needs to be a DONE DEAL.

The big new house is not nearly as important to your wife as it is to you because she is keen to sell asap.

If you both DO share care for the children in a 50/50 fashion then all assets would be divided down the middle including Supers, I understand of Family Law.

It's wise NOT to continue living in the same home if 1 spouse is trying to move on and the other is trying to hold on. Tempers can flare so easily as you've already seen.

If I were you, I would be pleasant to her. Be kind to the children (I can see you're working on this very well!).

Read "the 180" which is a set of amazing actions designed to help get yourself "together" in preparation for your new life (be it apart or together).

The Gray Rock technique is also an excellent set of tools to help YOU by putting up some respectful boundaries.

I would also book Counselling for myself only. AFTER the first session if you decide to continue with this Counsellor, you can leave a short note telling your wife you are in Counselling, if you want to.
Seeking Counselling is very important for your own support moving forward.
You do not have to disclose the name of your Counsellor. OR that you've spoken to a lawyer.

IMHO I would DO exactly what "separation" looks like now. Decide on every 2nd weekend and do EVERYTHING with the kids on "your" weekend. Go out with your friends on YOUR week off.
You can Register your separation date with Centrelink and receive 50% Parenting Payments if you guys qualify, even whilst living in the same house.

Whitegoods, furniture etc? 50%.

It's time for a change of "tactics".

I wish you well.