topic Dealing with convert narcissists in Relationship and family issues

Dealing with convert narcissists

clownartist — Sat, 18 May 2019 03:03:45 GMT

I am interested in other peoples experience in dealing with convert narcissist and coping strategies .I have been surrounded by family and friends who I now realise have been disastrous for my mental health.My first mistake was choosing female friends that were like my mother.I suffer from repetition compulsion and suffer from low self esteem.It has been a huge learning curve .Should I just starve them out with no contact ?Any experience or advice in dealing with narcissists would be appreciated Cheers Clownartist

Dealing with convert narcissists

Soberlicious96 — Sat, 18 May 2019 09:19:52 GMT

HI Clownartist,

I worked for a woman, for two years, whom I think is quite the narcissist. It took me a long time to realise it, but in order for me to 'cope' with her, or even survive her antics, I needed as LITTLE engagement with her as possible. She was absolutely HORRIBLE to me; calling me names in front of customers, treating me as though I was 'new' to the business the whole time I worked there, never signing off on any of my training that I completed (and therefore denying me the pay rise and the recognition I had actually studied for), using my short term memory issues against me ...... ad infinitum. She was so horrible. And I've said many times that if I had've known her a bit better, I never would have worked for her.

Thankfully the lady who was the 2IC at the time, and this horrible boss had a falling out, and the horrible boss lady actually lost the battle, and I now have the lady that was the 2IC as my boss, and she is amazing!

I did have an anxiety attack a few months ago when the old boss came into work and I bolted out to the warehouse. I wish I could say I was stronger than that and could 'face up' to her without having anxiety, but that's not the case.

The best advice I can offer is to give any and all narcissistic people a very wide berth, family or not. I know that may seem harsh, and certainly easier said than done, but in my experience, it's a very hard battle to fight. The only reason my then 2IC won the battle with the horrible boss is because she left for a brief period, and then while she was gone, she dropped the (then) boss in a bucket of poo by dobbing her into the bigger bosses on how she'd been treating me, and how she'd been behaving when she thought nobody knew. Once upper management knew about what had been going on, they called the then 2IC and asked her to come back as boss!! So it's one to S..... (former 2IC, now boss lady) and none to N....... (horrible boss).

As a good and wise friend once said to me: "The best revenge is to live well."

So live well, and let them go, is my advice and experience. xo

Dealing with convert narcissists

white knight — Sat, 18 May 2019 12:59:12 GMT

Hi, welcome

Afyer dealing with narcissists in my family for 54 years (including my mum) in 2011 my sister and I cut ties with 3 of them. This resulted in us losing several more from their lies and manipulation of our relatives.

It was worth it for the peace, stability and love we have now.

Google

Beyondblue Topic narcissism

TonyWK

Dealing with convert narcissists

grt123 — Sat, 18 May 2019 19:04:52 GMT

The word 'narcissist' is overused. Just because someone is vain, self centred or simply an a'hole doesn't make them a narcissist. I had the misfortune of meeting a real narcissist - in fact I hired one. Id thought he'd be great but even in his first week I couldn't shake the feeling that something wasn't right. He was polite enough but insensitive, missed social cues and expected a level of 'service' from others that was out of step with a modern workplace - like directing co-workers to fill the photocopier or buy him coffee. Despite his arrogance he was incompetent - partially due to the fact he wouldn't listen to instructions or take on feedback. I never once heard him admit an error or apologise for a stuff up even though he made them all the time. When I tried to manage his performance it was like I'd cracked the top off a volcano. He turned on me in such a way I genuinely feared for my safety if not my sanity. And yet his actions were so insidious I wondered if I was imagining the threat. Real narcissists are good at playing the game. By the time his employment was terminated my workplace had put security in place to protect me and I felt validated - but wounded it took them so long. Even now, years later, that experience still haunts me.

Dealing with convert narcissists

Jb40 — Sat, 18 May 2019 20:13:46 GMT

Greetings Clownartist,

I could relate to your situation. In my experience I learnt to let it go and focus on my well being. I found worrying over it was not worth it and in the case of my brother-in-law it was to keep the peace for family gatherings. At family dinners I would start with the welcome pleasantaries then try and avoid him the rest of the time. He would ask about my job and hobby? Making small talks, however I would give him a maximum of 3 words answers. Even though I knew he wasn't genuinely interested and it was all for show. He is the most selfish, self-centred, lazy, arrogant and narcaccist human being I've ever met. If we met through friends I would have cut him out of my life.

At work a colleague who is also lazy, selfish etc etc makes me uncomfortable. I only speak to him about work and even walking pass him I don't bother with the pleasantries. I used to feel sick if I have to speak to him about work and another colleague told me to focus on, I'm doing this for work and I'm good at my job therefore I will deliver my Manager the most accurate report. Since then I pump myself beforehand and I have been able to move forward. Lately I've noticed that I've forgotten to pump myself, definitely a major improvement. When he sometimes delays, I let my Manager know and I won't be seen as incompetent.

They are the only two people that I have to deal with, not because I want to however it is so I can thrive in family and work environment. I believe in surrounding myself with good and loving people. The good things in my life outweighs the inconvenience of dealing with such awful people. They will never change, it's who they chose to become. My aim not to be like them, embrace each day as it comes, smile more and let it go.

Take care, Jb.

Dealing with convert narcissists

clownartist — Sun, 19 May 2019 03:01:50 GMT

Hi Soberlicious,

thanks for your reply sounds like you have done time as well.They really damage your self esteem.She has isolated me from friends and family,she gaslighted me.There was this constant need to control and I felt beholden to her.I felt like I was walking on eggshells and then the constant criticism.Only when I concluded the conversation I felt drained and anxious.I realised she was much like my mother.I am attracted to narcissist perhaps from my childhood.Friends should make you feel good about yourself.She entered my life at a vulnerable stage separation and property settlement.I felt perpetual appreciation for her assistance.She took control of my affairs and I was stupid enough to let it happen.I am a type A personality,tough on myself and empathetic and self love deficient.The final straw came when she helped herself to my posessions and where was my will .I was devastated but it made me reflect on her behaviour.It was a lightbulb moment it made me reflect on her behaviour and it scared the hellout of me .It was her character disorder that ended our relationship.I am recovering slowly she sabotaged my friends family and work..I have decided zero contact and need to forgive myself .My innocence is a good thing open and trusting .I have to heal myself and dont give them a reaction and walk away. Cheers Clownartist

Dealing with convert narcissists

clownartist — Sun, 19 May 2019 04:01:20 GMT

Hi grl123,

i did not use the term lightly narcissist.Your description of your colleague sounds exactly like my experience.She had an inability to work on a team, even volunteer work.I was constantly amazed at her calculated schemes involving exploitation,entitlement and the empathy impairment.She was a complete know it all and control freak.One huge red flag she was never at fault or to blame for anything it was always me ,never her.I t has been a massive learning curve good in some ways .They are predators,while they see themselves as white knights (apologies White Knight).They are so good at lying ,they love to slander and gossip especially about you.They are emotional vampires.I am so glad that I have seen the light,but I too am haunted by the pure evil and bizarrely feel guilty, the projection again Cheers Clownartist

Dealing with convert narcissists

clownartist — Sun, 19 May 2019 04:56:59 GMT

Hi White Knight,

Just re read your older post on narcissistic mothers.I felt I was reading my story.Wow the similarities were striking.She sabotaged my wedding ,her actions made no sense.She was an embarrassment with her manipulation in order to win.I endured lengthy separations from my mother ,the last 6 years before she died .One good friend said why do you keep going back?As with you I was excluded from the family will and from good relatives.The damage is so destructive I am still dealing with the venom!!The manipulation was palpable the penny dropped when my mother was being cruel to my son who was only 5 years old .He asked why is granny being mean to me!!WOW only children could see that Thanks mate Clownartist

Dealing with convert narcissists

grt123 — Sun, 19 May 2019 05:44:13 GMT

I'm sorry Clownartist - it's just that nothing prepares you for a real narcissist. I can relate to the lies. The way he salted in some truth to make it plausible but it was actually 90% fiction. And outrageous as if he had no fear at all of being found out. Also the blame and the excuses - nothing was ever his responsibility and to try to convince him otherwise just exhausted me and enraged him. Unlike you I don't see any positives from the experience. I lost some love for my fellow man and to this day I'll walk a mile to avoid a confrontation.

Dealing with convert narcissists

clownartist — Sun, 19 May 2019 06:17:52 GMT

No need to be sorry grl123. I too cannot believe the salting process ,slight amount of truth thrown in to confound you.I dont know how they sleep at night well I do they have no morals.My positive is knowledge is power ,i myself have lost a lot of respect for fellow man .I am on guard the whole time and have few friends .It is a sad state of affairs but I am tired of being damaged.Incidentally most of my narcissists encounters were females .What i have learnt is some warning signs.First trust your gut instincts and first impressions,dont confuse kindness with weakness,always a power struggle they often wrong never in doubt,emotionally illiterate,free loaders ,gossipers,passive aggressive and liars.My greatest fear is getting involved with another narcissist which is probably why I will remain single the rest of my life.So much for religion /fellow man Good luck everybody Clownartist

Dealing with convert narcissists

white knight — Sun, 19 May 2019 08:56:45 GMT

seeking answers is therapeutic

Google

Queen witch hermit waif

Regards TonyWK

Dealing with convert narcissists

clownartist — Sun, 19 May 2019 10:15:13 GMT

Hi White Knight,I am seeking answers and believe it is therapeutic.Read the posts they are excellent.I am concerned though that perhaps I am ruminating too much.I.Is there a danger in that i cant change the past but also must learn from it I said to a friend i am a slow thinker he replied no you just process slowly .I am afraid I am like Paul Keating with an inability to put the past behind him and move on .Thoughts anyone appreciated .Clownartist

Dealing with convert narcissists

white knight — Sun, 19 May 2019 13:28:04 GMT

Good question.

Dwelling can be part of your makeup. My mother was a dwelling thinker and us kids inherited it. But at 24yo I embraced motivation and learned to plan my future. I'm now 63 but I still dwell. A lot of it is guilt.

Google (just read the first post)

Beyondblue Topic 30 minutes can change your life

Beyondblue Topic guilt the tormentor

Beyondblue Topic worry worry worry

In 1987 my first therapist said "Tony, when are you going to stop saving the world"? That led me to realise anxiety from guilt and worry were serious issues.

At the emd of the day we have to embark on acceptance- of who we are, of the limits in how we can change, in our nature.

Beyondblue Topic the frog and the scorpion

Beyondblue Topic the best praise you'll ever get

Regards

TonyWK

Dealing with convert narcissists

Definitely_Otherwise — Sun, 19 May 2019 20:54:08 GMT

It’s a term of phrase that gets thrown around a lot but if you’ve been on the receiving end it is not a light matter. When my therapist introduced me to this she suggested reading material & Youtube videos, I went back and said that there was some helpful info in there but the problem I have is that it is often written by an ex-partner of someone with NPD. She agreed and she said the best place to chat about it is in therapy, she can share anecdotal stories to make me feel less alone. For eg they talk about NPD lies but my therapist said they’re actually closer to delusions, that are wilfully constructed, lies so huge that you wouldn’t think someone could lie about that, such as cancer, the passing of a child or partner, degrees from prestigious uni’s, having served the country in a war, CSA/DV. People laugh about it and think it’s funny but the maintenance of those lies take more lies and the NPD’s anxiety goes up and then becomes rage because they fear exposure. They often have a partner that reinforces the narcissism by being obsessed with them and puts them on a pedestal, they refuse to engage with doctors because they know that they may see through it and put together that they’re suspiciously high functioning for someone who says they’ve been through something like that. This is where their partner comes in, and tells them how amazing they are, when really, their partner has been taken for the ride of their life and doesn't want to see it. Their friendships fall away because no one dotes on them like their spouse and this irritates them. They struggle with monogamy because it reduces their sources of validation. They can even lie about being gay to secure money and a partner with high status, the problem with that tho is they eventually have to go to bed, and that’s when it’s all exposed. You may think that is funny and that doesn’t happen very much, but you would be surprised. They then try to cover it up with some other story of inner conflict that actually doesn’t exist, especially if they don’t have a better offer. They can mimic other people’s personal history, make it their own & even other people’s diagnosis. As my therapist said, they become the untouchables because the maintenance of their false identity becomes so taxing that they withdraw and take it all out on their partner, even doctors are walled off because they bag them out too & claim they're incompetent or that they are simply untrustworthy. I would go to therapy and not online.

Def

Dealing with convert narcissists

clownartist — Sun, 19 May 2019 23:37:35 GMT

Hi Def and White Knight,

White Knight childhood memories of Aesops fables Scorpion and Frog .They are completely underrated in their social messages.I loved the comment saving the world my problem as well.Another is acceptance you are what you are and you aint what you aint!! Def I must say that the youtube vidoes as well this site helped me realise I am not alone.I agree you need a therapist to talk to. These NPD do some damage,they have a stable of victims,they need a source of energy.They move onto new prey,leaving the damage behind,the mimicing,the lies were palpable and the false identity.They are like a cyclone going through you life cheers Clownartist

Dealing with convert narcissists

white knight — Mon, 20 May 2019 00:49:08 GMT

Hi CA,

Our problem is not only narcissistic people or toxic people.

Our problem is ourselves, our lack of defensive ability. If we the vulnerable were hardened non sensitive types, we wouldnt be on this forum.

How do we overcome this sensitivity? We dont. Sensitivity is hard wired into us. Once that is realised we have to seek purely defensive means to find a place of safety.

In my threads - google

Beyondblue Topic fortress of survival

And

Beyondblue Topic fortress of survival part 2

Both threads go through the natural defense proceedures that most people develop in their childhood. A screening process. Most times this automatic process saves them from hurt.

We vulnerable, stupidly honest types, are blind to the evil in some.

As an example of this hard wired side we lack, some 40 years ago following 3 years in the RAAF I joined a large prison as a warder. You'd think that the things I endured in that toxic environment would toughen me up and make me more wary of nastiness in some people. Not so. Then professions like ranger, security, crowd control and investigations would have me aware of manipulating, cruel people- nope.

My approach, auto mode, is to trust first, get hurt then forgive and get hurt again several times before breaking contact. The dwell about it for years.

So, the "fortress of survival " came into play, a method of departmentalising new people in my life. Rejecting disruptive people cant be taken lightly but once done life gets better and better, calm and order comes as we surround ourselves with love, kindness and stability.

Once our new happy lives continue for some times we then begin to identify disruptive people more easily.

But I still use my fortress of survival!

TonyWK

Dealing with convert narcissists

clownartist — Mon, 20 May 2019 01:47:38 GMT

Hi WK, Our problem is ourselves,I concur.We are sensitive and vulnerable.What fascinates me is how they target their victims.once they have identified a victim they zero in full throttle ,they are sneaky conniving and always watching you ,they study their victims.I have noticed one interesting observation ,when you first meet a NPD if they are overly friendly and familar,you should start building your fortress wall .Any thoughts ,better start bricklaying CK

Dealing with convert narcissists

white knight — Mon, 20 May 2019 03:54:20 GMT

Hi,

We should remember there should be a probiso in our thinking.

Those that suffer NPD, BPD etc of a chronic nature, do in fact have an illness.

Having said that my proviso is, if they are seeking treatment of a serious level, my heart goes out to them in every way.

If they are in denial and dont take the hint there could be issues, I preserve myself.

So such people need to enjoy the opportunity to get treatment just like the rest of us. None of us are to blame for our mental disorders only not being proactive on its repair.

TonyWK

Dealing with convert narcissists

MummaPetal — Tue, 04 Jun 2019 08:35:33 GMT

Hey Clownartist,

I know too well what you are going through. I have been dealing with 2 of them over the past few years. When one of them caused an issue, it was always somehow my fault. I really dislike confrontation but that was used against me. They were nice to my face but bullies to me behind my back. I went through a lot of counselling and was advised to keep as much distance as possible. I was experiencing high anxiety which lead to a racing heart and heart palpitations. Enough was enough. I started to meditate every night before bed. I repeat affirmations daily that I am good enough.

I somehow stumbled a fantastic book called Dodging Energy Vampires by Dr Christiane Northrup. It's been amazing. She talks about the signs of an energy vampire and how they behave. She also discussed the biological reasons behind their behaviour and basically says it's all about them and not you. You can't change them. My anxiety has now gone.

Dealing with convert narcissists

clownartist — Fri, 14 Jun 2019 04:29:45 GMT

Hi Mummapetal.,

Sorry for delayed response,just managed to read some of your recommendation Dodging Energy Vampires,Absolutely excellent kept reading oh my God this is me amazing insight .Thanks for recommendation CK