topic Emotional affair? in Relationship and family issues

Emotional affair?

Guest_598 — Tue, 23 Jan 2018 02:07:40 GMT

Hi All,

Last year,my husband and I went through a rough patch because his female colleague was quite sexually explicit and he didn't like my response to hearing things - potentially out of context. At the time,it caused me huge trust issues especially because he was criticising me and society for being so stringent about only having one partner once you marry etc. He later confirmed that he didn't mean what he said and that he just blurted things out while being emotional. But the damage to me self-confidence was done,especially because he is still in touch with that woman. She left the company but now,instead of moving interstate, separated from her husband with whom she has had issues for some time. We have had many conversations about my trouble to deal with my insecurities since then and I believe fully that there is nothing physical between them. I also believe that he truly loves me. But despite how often he tells me,I cannot shake my concern that he may build an emotional bond with her. Back when it was heated,I asked him to remove her from facebook which he did. I was never a jealous woman but since then I am worried about everything and feel I cannot get back to trusting him. Especially because he lied to me back then and said he was not talking to her, but then I saw the comments. Now I found out that he has her added on Google Hangouts. I did not know Hangouts existed but casually asked him whether he knew it. He said yes but when I asked whether he was using it,he said no. Then I saw that he had been checking it at 11 pm the night before. Afterwards he googled what to do when your wife doesn't want kids but you do which is something that has come up recently. So I'm scared that he has created that secret bond with this other woman who has a little son he likes.

Today,I told him that I am concerned that he is building an emotional connection with her and he said that that's definitely not the case and that he just likes the professional exchange with her. But why would he create an account in google hangouts just for one contact,her?doesn't that mean there is a bit more of a special desire to stay in touch even if it's non-physical. I told him I don't like all the secrecy because if she is like any other friend,why can't we talk openly? He says he is now so afraid of my negative reaction when we talk about her that he doesn't feel comfortable mentioning her. I tried to explain that honesty and transparency would remove the problem

Emotional affair?

JessF — Tue, 23 Jan 2018 02:31:13 GMT

Hello AussieGal81, when trust starts to go in a relationship it can be corrosive, because it can cause us to act in ways that worsen the problem. While your actions in monitoring your husband's computer activities is understandable given your anxieties and earlier conversations you've had, the effect from your husband's perspective is more likely that he is being spied on. In my experience, the more insecure one appears in a relationship, the less attractive one seems.

I won't speculate on what might be going on between your husband and this woman, because like you, I don't know. But I do think that the heart of what's going on is revealed in the first few lines of your post, and towards the end. Your husband's thoughts on monogamy sound like they touched a nerve, and that conversation was never fully resolved. Conflicting thoughts on having children are also very profound.

While I understand that your husband's friendship with this woman is really playing on your mind, I honestly think there are some bigger issues underneath the surface that you really need to have a heart to heart on. She is the symptom, not the problem.

Emotional affair?

quirkywords — Tue, 23 Jan 2018 02:38:04 GMT

AussieGal81,

Welcome to the forum and thanks for sharing your story. This is a friendly, caring, and supportive place.

Trust in a relationship can be so easily broken but takes a very long time to rebuild.

It is hard for you to rebuild that trust when you feel your husband is not being open and honest.

He seems to feel he can't be open and honest as he feels you don't trust him.

My experience is different but when I first started my relationship with my partner I had good male friend- just platonic and I was open and honest as the friendship had been going for nearly 2 years.

My new partner was very jealous even though I reassured him and was very open- gave him my email password etc.

So I decided that it was not worth my partner being upset and I cut off all contact with my friend. I did the right thing

As I said that was my experience and is different to yours.

I can see how upset this is making you and sometimes we have to make a choice.

Thanks for sharing your story.

Quirky

Emotional affair?

Guest_598 — Tue, 23 Jan 2018 07:30:31 GMT

Hi again,

thank you so much for your fast and valuable advice. I agree with you both, there are other issues at hand and have been over the past. My husband often suffered from depressive periods and that has caused a lot of trauma for both of us over the years. But we are usually very loving with each other outside of these big explosions once a year. However, the one last year was different because it caused me so much grief and I felt so undesirable. I know it may have been a chain of activities causing a problem that never existed but the problem is that moving on from it now is difficult. I agree that looking behind every corner is the wrong thing to do and I hate that I do that at the moment. I never ever in my life did that and never felt jealous or distrusting, but last year was too much for me. I also agree that my constant insecurity and probing causes a lot of difficulty for us. I believe that my husband really loves me and wants us to have a happy relationship but I just cannot understand why he lies to me. He holds against me that I asked him to remove the woman from his facebook but now that I know he actually has her added on Hangouts, how can he hold it against me? He obviously found another way to stay in touch with her and I don't understand why he would go to such lengths for a friend he had not known for very long. What makes her so much more important than other acquaintances. I know you cannot speculate but rather than wondering only whether he is on the verge of an emotional affair, I wonder what it means that he is lying to my face. I asked him again this afternoon whether he was using Hangouts because I was testing it to use with my parents, and he repeatedly said no. Given I know that is not true, what do I make of my husband lying to me? Is it just because he is so afraid of my reaction or is there more? And if he lies to me about that, what else would he lie about if the requirement ever came up? I do not want to spy on him but I have lost so much trust in him because of his little lies.

He came up to me and said he just wants us to be good and he was really sad when he said it. I really want that, too but how can I just let go of all this and move on? I'm scared of being hurt further down the track but my biggest wish at the moment is just to let go and move on. There are more important things to deal with, I just want to trust the man I married. Is it possible to just make a cut and force oneself to forget somehow?

Emotional affair?

bindi-QLD — Tue, 23 Jan 2018 20:33:34 GMT

Dear AussieGal81,

I am so sorry you are going through this. I feel that you are a very perceptive woman, doing your best to deal with a complicated and painful situation. Like you, I believe trust is the foundation of long term relationships, and yours had been shaken. I believe your feelings are very natural, given the situation.

To paraphrase some of what I've learned from personal experience and reading studies written on this topic , most of the pain and worry comes from knowing that affairs (and relationship abandonment) don't start with two people hopping into bed. They start out with a spark of attraction, that progresses in increments. A single person might naturally follow up on this attraction, because they are single. But a person already in a committed relationship would protect their marriage by having a lot of boundaries instead. Its seems simple doesn't it? Single=follow up on an attraction. Married/committed relationship= protect you relationship.I believe following this simple rule is how couples successfully build trust and mutually satisfying relationships together, that last.

When a partner follows up on an attraction with flirtation, time spent alone with that person, secrecy, then increasing emotional involvement , there is good cause for the spouse to be concerned. The `unfaithful' partner is acting like a single person, progressing a relationship with someone they are attracted to, to see where it leads. Frustratingly for the other partner, the unfaithful partner is often in denial about this.

Pursuing an attraction may lead nowhere, but the process damages the relationship significantly. The unfaithful partner progressively `detaches' from their partner, which means they no longer care as much about their partner's feelings. And if the partner discovers any of this, it results in significant feelings of worthlessness , betrayal and pain.

Couples can avoid this pain by making a conscious agreement about boundaries with the opposite sex, and honoring those agreements. They may include being more selective about friends in general, having a lot of transparency in communication with the opposite sex, choosing to keep some opposite sex acquaintances at arms length, and discouraging invitations to flirt. Most importantly. each of us needs to be honest with ourselves about who presses our buttons. There's lot of emotionally beautiful and special people in the world. But our job in our relationships is to protect our partner.

Emotional affair?

bindi-QLD — Tue, 23 Jan 2018 20:50:15 GMT

dear Dear AussieGal81,

Sorry I ran out of room there. I hope some of what I wrote helps validate your feelings and intuition. I really believe your feelings are spot on and normal, not irrational.

I believe your partner probably is in a little bit of denial right now, and that is hard to deal with. But you could still approach him to talk about what you need to feel safe in your relationship. If building trust is something you still both care about and value, then you need to make each other feel safe, through actions, not just hope.

I suggest that you try to start a discussion about both of you having boundaries with the opposite sex. He might come back to you with `I don't care what you do', if his detachment has progressed. See it as a sign of detachment, try not to get mad. Just tell him you think he's become detached, and why. And then try again to ask him what is fair, what will build trust between you.

The reason I value trust so much myself, is its very hard to properly commit to someone, and risk losing half of everything you accomplish, if there isn't trust. I mean why try at all if your partner is just going to leave and ruin your life? I want my partner and I to create a life together that we both value so highly, that we want to protect it. I want my relationship to be somewhere I can give my best and be my best. But I can't do any of that if there isn't trust.

How do you feel about trust yourself? Do you think your partner feels the same way?

Anyway hugs to you, I am hoping the best for you.

Emotional affair?

Guest_598 — Thu, 25 Jan 2018 20:47:00 GMT

Hi All,

thank you so much for you help and thoughts, I really appreciate it. I have spoken to my husband again about the matter. It was not particularly pretty and I think he did not take it so well but at the same time, I was able to clarify a few things that would have otherwise become monsters in my mind. We will see how it continues, I want to try and ease off a bit given the new information I have and the impact I see my insecurities can have. I am still not happy about how he manages this friendship but I understand better why this all came about.

I also realised that this issue last year (which has dragged on until now) was probably the last straw in a long saga of self-confidence diminishing events. Over years, my husband told me painful things every time he entered one of his depressive phases. Every time he questioned our relationship etc. and for a while threw divorce in my face every time we had a difficult conversation. Then, when he was better, he took it all back and told me I was the best and he wanted to be with me forever. But these days, I don't know anymore whether he feels like that and whether depression just got him to say negative things, or whether he feels negative things about the marriage which then causes depression. At the end of the day I have to trust him when he tells me that he wants this marriage to work. And the weird thing is that we are very loving with each other, but we always create so many problems for each other. I don't understand why we do this. Shouldn't we just be happy and a team? Maybe we both feel that this is lacking something substantial but we don't have the guts to give up because the heart wants it so much, no matter what the circumstances. What do I do in that case? Since last year when everything was extremely painful, I am not sure anymore that I would not look back at life in 20 years and regret having stayed. But at the same time, for some reason, I cannot go. I want to move overseas, closer to my friends and family. I have been away for ten years and if everything here went better, I would not rush it. But my parents are getting older and I realised that when things are bad, I don't have anyone here to support me. And given things bad usually includes my husband, I cannot lean on him for support either. So, after all the issues last year, I decided to go ahead with our original plan of moving overseas at the end of this year or early next year. Originally, he wanted to come. To be continued...

Emotional affair?

Guest_598 — Thu, 25 Jan 2018 20:47:42 GMT

Hi All,
thank you so much for you help and thoughts, I really appreciate it. I have spoken to my husband again about the matter. It was not particularly pretty and I think he did not take it so well but at the same time, I was able to clarify a few things that would have otherwise become monsters in my mind. We will see how it continues, I want to try and ease off a bit given the new information I have and the impact I see my insecurities can have. I am still not happy about how he manages this friendship but I understand better why this all came about.
I also realised that this issue last year (which has dragged on until now) was probably the last straw in a long saga of self-confidence diminishing events. Over years, my husband told me painful things every time he entered one of his depressive phases. Every time he questioned our relationship etc. and for a while threw divorce in my face every time we had a difficult conversation. Then, when he was better, he took it all back and told me I was the best and he wanted to be with me forever. But these days, I don't know anymore whether he feels like that and whether depression just got him to say negative things, or whether he feels negative things about the marriage which then causes depression. At the end of the day I have to trust him when he tells me that he wants this marriage to work. And the weird thing is that we are very loving with each other, but we always create so many problems for each other. I don't understand why we do this. Shouldn't we just be happy and a team? Maybe we both feel that this is lacking something substantial but we don't have the guts to give up because the heart wants it so much, no matter what the circumstances. What do I do in that case? Since last year when everything was extremely painful, I am not sure anymore that I would not look back at life in 20 years and regret having stayed. But at the same time, for some reason, I cannot go. I want to move overseas, closer to my friends and family. I have been away for ten years and if everything here went better, I would not rush it. But my parents are getting older and I realised that when things are bad, I don't have anyone here to support me. And given things bad usually includes my husband, I cannot lean on him for support either. So, after all the issues last year, I decided to go ahead with our original plan of moving overseas at the end of this year or early next year. To be continued-

Emotional affair?

Guest_598 — Thu, 25 Jan 2018 21:00:27 GMT

We had always spoken about moving overseas one day because I am a bit of a nomad and he thought it would be good for his career. But over the years, I could fade his desire away slightly and now, he is quite settled in his home and studies and I think, he doesn't really want to go. Plus, he is no longer sure whether he wants kids, another thing we talked about extensively about before we got married. Because for me, it was always clear that I did not want to have children and I told him that if he had the slightest wish for them, we should not get married because that was a compromise I could not take for him. I fully understand that life's wishes change and I do not hold a grudge against him for it. It pains me to think that there is something he would like to do with me (i.e. have kids) and I cannot give him that. And it pains me to see that there might be something he actually wants, but because he does not want to be with anyone other than me, he cannot get his wish fulfilled. He says he is not sure about the kids question but I think deep inside he feels what he wants. So, at the end of the day, I decided to move overseas even if that means us breaking up. I actually did that because I could no longer see hope that we could move past all the things that were said in the past and all the problems that come up every year. And that despite the fact that we love each other a lot and are loving with each other. We spend a lot of time together, not always actively but in each other's company. We have date nights, watch movies cuddling on the couch, all these things that would tell you that we still want each other in our lives. But we make it so difficult for each other at least once every year so that in the end, half the year is spent wondering about the success of the marriage. Why are we doing that if there is not an underlying feeling inside that we are not right for each other? Or is there a way to finally make it work? I think the fact that I want to go overseas and he doesn't is seen as a deal breaker. He says he might follow me a little later but I know he wouldn't. We are clinging to straws that make the thought of separation less painful while we actually both know it is going to end. Or can that end be stopped without me giving up my dreams and him being happy, too?

Emotional affair?

quirkywords — Thu, 25 Jan 2018 21:03:31 GMT

Aussiegal,

Thanks for replying and updating. Your situation is quite complex.

Depression does affect each individual in different ways and some people do push others away as they themselves feel so worthless so they don't want to be a burden. I used to behave like that and I know it is confusing to loved ones.

How does your husband feel about moving overseas within a year?

You may have mentioned this so I apologise if I am repeating myself, but have you been to counselling together.?

Sometimes having a neutral person who listens to you both can make matters clearer.

You have insight and some understanding of your husband's behaviour but I feel sometimes his unpredictable

behaviour unsettles you.

I can understand how you want to move back to your parents and feel support and give support to your family.

Thanks for keeping in touch .

Quirky

Emotional affair?

Guest_598 — Thu, 25 Jan 2018 21:11:22 GMT

I don't know what to do. I need to plan my overseas start because I feel that if I don't, I once again give myself up for something that I may regret in years to come. But how can I live with my husband at the same time knowing I'm actually planning our separation? Should I move out now and separate so that we do not have to go through this painful process of constantly telling each other we love each other, while in the back of our heads thinking "well, this will be over by the end of this year". How can you live like that?

I want to give my 100% into this marriage to make it better and keep the beautiful things alive. But at the same time I look at what I want to do with my life and that does not match. How can I make my marriage work and plan to move away? It is two extremes on opposite sides of the spectrum. But if I don't move, I will probably be in the same situation again next year. Doubting whether I will regret giving up my wishes just to make something work that may make me miserable in the end because I would feel like I have lost myself by throwing everything into one project while he might have gotten everything without the same effort. DOn't get me wrong, it is not about equality of effort and input - although I don't think that is an unreasonable wish to have in a marriage - it is about the fundamentals of doing what is good for you and right in your life. And although my marriage is massively important in my life, I am not sure it is right for me and I am scared that one day I would resent it and my husband for what it did to my life and happiness. Sometimes I think it would be best to separate, just so that we take the emotional hardship off each other that this hypothetical thoughts bring. But I am scared of the pain and the loss. We are so familiar and have so many little quirky things we love about our relationship. I cannot imagine not having them in my life but at the same time, I have not been truly happy for years because I constantly see problems. I will speak to a psychologist about better strategies to boost my self-confidence and help with my negative thinking. But the negative thinking was never me - I was an endless optimist. I feel this relationship has eroded my optimism and confidence and so I wonder... should I fight for it or will the fight destroy us both? All I want is for us both to be truly and lastingly happy. Not all the time but more consistently. Is that at all possible? What shall I do, I just can't see it.

Emotional affair?

bindi-QLD — Thu, 25 Jan 2018 22:45:47 GMT

Hi AussieGal,

I'm sorry that you have so many painful decisions to make, that cause you to feel stress and uncertainty about your future. Its possible that you are both feeling the lack of a foundation of commitment. It could explain the fights, the `exit plans', and general insecurity you both feel.

I agree with Quirky, that some counselling together would be better for your marriage , and for your mental health. I believe you are right, its very stressful and depressing living as married, when you have no intention of staying together. It would be difficult to resolve any of the other problems, until you have decided whether you are committed to one another or not.

Have you ever had a look for a therapist or a counselor before? Your GP may be able to help you there.

Emotional affair?

kittyklanke — Tue, 30 Jan 2018 09:16:36 GMT

hi everyone, I have found this conversation incredibly useful as I read several similarities to my own situation.

I've recently found out my husband is "on a different page" than me in terms of what we want from our marriage and future lives (ie. I will do anything to have another child, he doesn't care), I found couples counselling incredibly useful to help us have those difficult conversations without defensiveness/distraction or anger.. We've been seeing a Psychologist, and I also have one-on-one appopintment swith her too - this has been crucial to me maintaining my sanity plus helps hubby and I have those hard conversations in a productive way. Psychologists ask great questions, and they can pick things apart (they'll get to the bottom of your trust concerns etc).

I would highly recommend you giving couples & individual counselling a try before you decide on ending your marriage. It might be hard to get hubby interested in couples counselling (a lot of men dont like to talk about their feelings) but once he knows that you're mmarriage is at risk, that should make him realise the seriousness of the situation.

One of the hardest things after a break-up is the regret of thinking "did i try everything to keep us together? Was there anything more i could have done?"

Emotional affair?

kittyklanke — Tue, 30 Jan 2018 09:20:38 GMT

Thanks for your comments here Bindi.. Your coments here have been very helpful to m, especially in relation to detaching/infaithful partners and the resulting feelings to their partners 😞 :)cccv

Emotional affair?

bindi-QLD — Tue, 30 Jan 2018 21:09:13 GMT

Hi Kitty,

Thank you so much for saying so , hon:) I'm glad you found that helpful.

Most of what I wrote is paraphrased from scientific studies in the area.

This is the name of one of the major studies I liked - Norton, A. M., & Baptist, J. Couple boundaries for social networking in middle adulthood

Emotional affair?

bindi-QLD — Tue, 30 Jan 2018 21:16:15 GMT

Hi Kitty,

I'm glad your couples counselling has gone well so far, I can see what you mean about the benefit of keeping conversations productive. I like that you've identified the deeper source of conflict in your relationship, and are addressing it the best you can. Its not so easy to rise above feelings of betrayal, and do that. I admire you for it 🙂

I really hope things go well for your family, and you can decide about your second child too X

Emotional affair?

Guest_598 — Mon, 12 Mar 2018 20:10:05 GMT

Hi All,

sorry I have been out of the loop for a bit and thank you for all you have contributed so far.

as you know, I am currently going through a rough patch with my husband, usually we had one big crisis a year ever since we got together, but we usually pulled through fairly quickly. We have had so many conversations about the same issue this time that in the end, I arranged for counselling as a last option recently. We tried it in the past and it worked for some years but it has become clear to me that the issue at hand is only one of many underlying topics I would like to talk through with him. He is not particularly keen to go to counselling because he is the sweep-under-the-rug kind of person but he is willing to come along, which is a start, I guess. What do you think?

Counselling will start in two weeks and I look forward to it as it is my last hope that we can actually "hear" each other properly and share our feelings. I want to talk through a lot of things, especially the needs we have and his apparent indecisiveness about what he wants in life, including whether he actually really wants this marriage, because every time we hit a rough patch, he just throws the "divorce" word around. Once I am at a point where I think he is serious and I believe it may be best to go, he pulls me back in getting scared that I might actually go. It's a merry-go-round of sadness. I have always been the fighter and I believe I have given more to this marriage. I know it cannot always be equal effort, but I feel I have not much more to give. Hence why this is my last resort option before I have to possibly make a decision on behalf of us both and leave. But I love him and I need to try this one last chance.
But while I feel like this, I wonder whether counselling will actually offer that chance. Is it at all possible to turn out positive if he doesn't really want to be there and I just, once again, drag him through life? Is there a chance we can really productively talk and figure improvements out?
In the past, when he got angry, he said a lot of nasty things , lately that believes he has done nothing wrong and that it is all my paranoia, anxiety and control freak behaviour. He deflects any responsibility for bad times in our marriage although he triggers them often - is constructive counselling with somebody that doesn't believe he contributes to negative outcomes at all possible? I accept my failures but what if I am the only one?