topic Should I stay or should I go? in Relationship and family issues

Should I stay or should I go?

Gigi1981 — Sat, 22 Jul 2017 04:20:19 GMT

Hello Everyone,

my husband is clearly suffering from depression and shows all the key symptoms. It comes in peaks and troughs and I am not sure what triggers it. I assume that this time, it was a selection of work stress, discussions we had and his sudden thoughts of potentially wanting children. We discussed children at length before our wedding several years ago and I was always open about not wanting children. He did not want any at the time, too, but now says that he is not sure anymore and that the thought of children "hurts" him. Is is confused and unsure but believes we are diverging. He is tired all the time and recently has become very withdrawn, to the point of telling me he wants to be alone and misses his single life. Then again, he tells me he loves me a lot and the thought of losing me hurts him to the point of crying. But when I ask him whether we should split up, the first reason he gives me why he doesn't want to is that the administration of a separation would be too much work. When I told him that that is not a good reason to stay together and that I believe we should separate because i cannot live with these annually upcoming existential doubts and questions he has, he said that he cannot imagine living without me. I believe depression has left him completely confused but I am also at a point where I wonder whether he has these depressive bouts again and again because he is not happy with the relationship and does not see a future anymore. I wish I could find out whether that is the case but when I ask him, he says he does not know and gets all withdrawn again. He thinks that i am better off without him but in the same sentence, he tells me hurtful and mean things about me, like him missing to be by himself and living his life without having to fake excitement for the things I like. We have a beautiful holiday booked for the end of the year and after seeming genuinely excited for so long, he now tells me that it all just seems like a big chore and effort to him. Even the relaxing part of the holiday which he actually craved is now all of a sudden "too long". I don't know what to do anymore. I have gone through these same things every year since we got together eight years ago. I can't help but feel that he is just not happy in the relationship but for some reason does not find a way out. Or is it the depression that it appears his family has a tendency for? I don't know anymore. Most of all, should I leave for my own sake & happiness?

Should I stay or should I go?

Croix — Sat, 22 Jul 2017 11:57:16 GMT

Dear Gigi1981~

I'm sorry to here of this ongoing situation and can well understand your doubts about either staying or going.

Let's leave the issue of kids to one side for the moment.

The problem is basically that any satisfactory long term relationsip takes two people that love and care for each other and support each other reliably. In other words you have to be able to count on your partner.

Your words do not paint such a picture, in fact your relationship is full of doubt, changing feelings and inconsistence.

When I had my most severe encounters wiht depression I was confused, withdrawn and did not feel love, or even feel capable of love. I often needed to be alone.That was the illness taking over.

It may very well be your husband is suffering from an illness like that. The obvious thing to do is for him to see a doctor, get diagnosed and treated. Most mental illnesses of this sort do respond - often very well - to professional treatment.

Have a look at The Facts menu above for background information.

Trying to maintain a relationship without hope of such improvment would be very difficult indeed, with the supporting partner in danger of falling ill too, or at the very least building up a great deal of lonliness and resentment.

So I would stongly encorage your husband to seek medical help, you can't make him, he has to do it, but you may be able to steer him in that direction.

You are going though a very difficult time, do you have your own support? A family member or friend you can talk frankly to, who cares and will want to help? I've found talking to another sympathetic person has made a great difference.

I'd be very pleased if you returned and talked more.

Croix

Should I stay or should I go?

Apollo_Black — Sat, 22 Jul 2017 12:00:11 GMT

Hi Gigi

Firstly, I'm really sorry about what you're going through.

My focus would be to make sure he's being adequately managed for depression. If he is, then I would be getting some marriage counselling. When depression is involved it complicates things so much, and I can see the pain in your dilemma. That's why I would make sure he was getting treated properly, first and foremost - then counselling. Your decision to stay or leave the marriage is of course your decision alone. Let's just hope he's not pushing you to make that decision...

Should I stay or should I go?

geoff — Sat, 22 Jul 2017 17:46:23 GMT

hello Gigi, it's always distressing when the confusion between whether he is suffering from depression or whether he wants to move on by himself happens, however if he does have depression then the marriage can be saved.
The trouble with this illness is he may want to be by himself but he still wants you to be there for support, and that's why there is much doubt.
A holiday would not seem to be exciting for him if he has depression as it will reduce any thought of wanting anything, only to be by himself.
Before you make a decision it's important that he does have a diagnosis from his doctor, then your situation would be made much clearer, however I'm not sure that you want to go through all of this with him, that's a decision you will have to make yourself.
If he doesn't want to go on this holiday then perhaps you could take a g/friend with you, because unless he gets the help he may need then it won't be a happy one for you.
First thing to do is look after yourself that's your first priority. Geoff.

Should I stay or should I go?

Gigi1981 — Thu, 03 Aug 2017 02:19:55 GMT

Hi again,
as you can see above I have posted about my depressed husband and issues that have recently arisen lately. The last issue was that I asked him to remove a female colleague from facebook after I saw another sexually connotated comment in their conversation and him lying about the fact that he was talking to her when I asked him. He got very angry at me, blamed me for being controlling and said he needed a break. He moved into the guest bedroom and does not talk to me. The last few days, he has treated me with utter disdain and almost hatred. I had to fly away for work and he has not been in touch at all. Complete silence and I am not sure whether he is brooding in anger, planning our divorce, suicidal or just completely emotionless. He definitely does not have empathy with me. On the first day after the issue I told him that I would look for places to move out (because he had suggested that he do that but I do not want to live in our home alone where everything reminds me of him). He later came back in a text and said that if I want to move out, that's fine and he won't get in the road. I told him that I don't WANT to at all but that it appeared to me the only option after all the things he said to me (e.g. wanting a break, me being controlling, blaming me for everything, telling me he married a child and that I am high maintenance). He did not accept any responsibility where we could have built an even playing field for a reasonable conversation. So after I told him that I would much rather stay with him and try to get us both happy and that I am willing to contribute whatever it takes, he did not respond. So I thought I would leave him his space as he said he wanted. I only left him a little note saying I love you before I left for the airport yesterday. However, I have had absolutely no word for him. For me, the silence is very painful because I feel that somebody that, just a week ago, cried and told me he cannot imagine me not being in his life, gives me the cold shoulder and treats me like scum. I would not do that to somebody I love, I still respect the boundaries and most of all, their heart. I may have made mistakes but does't everyone? At least I tried to be fair and reasonable, trying to explain my feelings. Also, he has contributed a lot to my insecurities which led me to act the way I did and the suspicions I could not shake despite actually trusting him 100%.

Should I stay or should I go?

White_Rose — Thu, 03 Aug 2017 10:28:00 GMT

Dear Gigi

Welcome to the forum. What an unhappy life you are experiencing at the moment. So many issues to consider with not much direction.

It seems to me that you have some issues that hang off other issues. Meaning that once the major part has been settled the minor issues will fall into place. From what you have written it seems the most pressing action is to get your husband to a doctor to determine his mental health status, i.e. is he depressed and/or anxious. A great many of his actions seems to indicate he is depressed but you need and expert in this field to make the call.

If he is depressed he can then start the journey to health. It will be hard but there is a lot of help out there for both of you, and you will get support from BB as well. Additionally it will be a place to start repairing your marriage.

If he is not depressed and there seems to be no other reason for his actions, may need to rethink your marriage. I know this will be hard but it doesn't mean your marriage is over. You can start talking to a counsellor and work out your differences.

I know you feel hurt and sad about what is happening and it's not a good place to be. I have been there living with someone who refuses to speak and it really is horrible.

So I suggest you both work on finding what is wrong, and if it depression or something similar, encourage him to get help. I think it would be helpful for you to find a counsellor as well. You are clearly unhappy which stems from feeling unloved and uncertain about your marriage. This is something you both need to work on.

So, Step 1 Go with your husband to the doctor and tell him/her what is happening in your life. Listen to the advice and act on it.

Step 2 If husband has a mental illness help him to recover by being as supportive as possible. This means working together, not fighting each other.

Step 3 Take yourself to a counsellor. If money is an issue try Relationships Australia which I think will be your best bet under the circumstances. If there is not an office near enough try the Salvation Army or Anglicare. These are low cost or no cost counselling services and I think you will benefit from getting all concerns off your chest with someone who can guide you through the process.

Step 4 When you feel your lives are getting back into balance you can talk about your marriage. I rather suspect that by that time it will be obvious if your marriage is over or not, but you will both be in a better situation to deal with it.

Mary

Should I stay or should I go?

Gigi1981 — Fri, 04 Aug 2017 05:49:59 GMT

Hi Mary,

thank you very much for your response. My husband shows a lot of depression symptoms and he has previously been diagnosed. Back then he did some therapy but then stopped. That was two years ago and every year he has those periods again. This year is probably the worst phase since I have known him, even worse than the one in 2014. We have also seen a marriage counsellor twice because of, what I believe, his depression and the way he seems to see me and our relationship in those down phases. That usually helped, however, not ongoingly. And every time he slips back into depression, anger and complete emotionless and coldhearted behaviour, he says that the counsellors were on my side and made him feel guilty and in the wrong. I believe strongly that he needs ongoing treatment, maybe even medication as I do not believe the therapy alone works. But given he does not want me anywhere near him and has completely shut down all communication, how can I possibly get through to him? The other question I have is whether there is actually any evidence out there that a marriage can successfully survive depression. I have read up on depression a lot but I cannot seem to find only one success story that shows a marriage or relationship can actually survive. Or at least not in a way where both partners are happy, even if they have to go through tough patches together. I would be more than happy to go through rough times with my husband but he treats me like the enemy every time it gets too bad. How can I reach him? I feel like this time is really the end, he has completely withdrawn, sleeps in the guest room and wants no interaction. It has never been so cruel and terrible before. I am thinking of moving out and will go to inspections tomorrow but I really don't want to. If I only knew whether there is a chance to be happy together despite one person suffering from this illness. If I knew that there is a chance, especially if he agreed to another GP visit, maybe medication, ongoing therapy and counselling for me. Would that at all change anything for the better? Or are the chances slim anyway? We have a lovely and very loving relationship when times are good and we tell each other that we love each other every day multiple times. But now, it is as if there is no love at all, just hatred and anger towards me. Is there a chance this could ever change if he agreed to proper ongoing treatment and I would support him as much as possible? I would give everything for him

Should I stay or should I go?

Croix — Fri, 04 Aug 2017 13:57:56 GMT

Dear Gigi~

You asked about a marriage success story, so I'll provide you with one, though as you will appreciate everyone is different and what happened with me does not mean it will happen with anyone else. Still maybe it will help. At the moment I'm sure everything looks unsure and confusing and there really is no guide as to what to do.

I was invalided out of my career with PTSD, anxiety and depression. This was a terrible period for my wife. I was totally withdrawn wrapped up in myself, very jumpy, bad tempered and controlling. I also has no idea if I loved anyone or even if I was capable of love. Among other things I wanted to be alone and thought my family would be better of without me - and of course at the same time I felt very guilty.

Lots of other stuff not worth going into here. Initially my wife thought all this was partly her doing, not being caring/sexy/understanding/etc enough. Rubbish of course, it was the illness doing my thinking for me.

I had left the major stressor - my job - and with my wife's encouragement eventually took a course of study, improved for a bit, relapsed, went into hospital and when I came out started to improve again, this time on a long term basis. Eventually getting back to being a loving partner. We were together for 25 years altogether before she passed away, and were still in love. I won't hide the fact there were still bad periods though.

All that sounds sort of OK on paper, however it was a very hard time for my wife who had to deal with me, run the household, look after our child and go to work (she was a nurse). I would not blame anyone for leaving under those circumstances.

So there is a happyish story. I guess one big difference from your husband is I was under continuous treatment and accepted it was necessary. And the other, to be blunt, is that under it all I really did love my wife and had no contact with other ladies. I have no idea how your husband feels. You did say at times you were happy and loving together.

Frankly I'm not sure how much I'm helping with my account, the circumstances, as I said, are not identical.

Croix

Should I stay or should I go?

geoff — Fri, 04 Aug 2017 21:53:06 GMT

hi Gigi, I remember your previous story, and to answer whether a marriage can survive when one person has depression can vary in the answer, but with me, no it ended in divorce, but it depends on how tolerate the other person is, but it doesn't mean that we can't talk to each other because we do many times.
I know that some marriages and/or r/ships have been able to keep going with many good points coming out of them.
I'm not sure but somehow I think this other lady is still behind the scenes and causing all of this trouble for you, he may still love you deep down but is mesmerised, captivated by her attention, but what happens when she may leave the scene, he will probably return to you unless someone else comes along.
I still love my ex but she only cares for me now, although our decisions are as if nothing has happened. Geoff.

Should I stay or should I go?

Gigi1981 — Wed, 09 Aug 2017 22:58:53 GMT

Hi All,

Over the past weeks, I have written about the issues with my husband, especially during his phases of deep depression. Last week was so terrible and he was so cold and withdrawn yet again that something in me feels like it has broken. I have suffered through the same issues and emotional pain over the past eight years and although I love him with all my heart and soul, I am now really worried that if I do not walk away from this relationship, it will mean that my life will continue like this for the next 40 years. I cannot live each year believing we finally had a breakthrough and he is finally happy and content, and then during his phases, he questions everything, pulls everything down and we have to start building our happiness back up from zero. He wants to see a psychologist but does not believe that his depression is a key problem. He holds things against me for every year of our relationship and every year, there is more added. He says it is like emotional scars that he cannot get rid of even though he wants to. And it’s not big things, it is things like him having to do most bill payments when we first moved together (he doesn’t mean paying the money, he means the actual online transaction). Or that I do not like driving our car so much because I am scared of making a scratch in it. He believes, I am not his equal because of that even though I do most around the house these days (including bills) and I have a job that earns more than him. I am quite successful, well-liked and intelligent, but he holds on to the tiniest things and hence believes I am dependent on him. It is completely absurd.

Now I am at a point where I would wish nothing more than to live happily with him but I have lost the last bit of hope that was still there after eight years of recurring struggle whenever he questioned and doubted everything we have. I believe, it is best for both of us if we separate, but I am scared of making the wrong decision and I am scared of hurting him now that he feels better again. It is always the same, after a terrible episode with emotional agony, he is happy and loving again and it feels like a honeymoon phase. But I know now that this will not last, at least I do not believe anymore that it will ever get better.

I am confused. I thought we could just enjoy the probably last beautiful times together before I ask for separation. But I feel so guilty thinking about separation and he believes we are good again. What should I do?

Should I stay or should I go?

Croix — Thu, 10 Aug 2017 09:55:59 GMT

Dear GiGi~

You said

I am now really worried that if I do not walk away from this relationship, it
will mean that my life will continue like this for the next 40 years

Well if things continue as they are I would think there is a fair possibility of exactly that happening. If you remember in my case I improved and kept on improving (always with ups and downs I must admit) and problem episodes became sorter and less frequent. In addition I regarded my wife as an equal partner - and was dumbfounded she wanted to remain. There were never any old hostilities or feelings of superiority, even when at my worst.

If I understand apart from being diagnosed and an initial course of therapy you husband has not been under treatment. I guess Mary (White Rose) has probably put forward the best strategy if you think it feasible. Persuade your husband to be stabilized via medical treatment (most probably meds and therapy) and see how you feel.

Whatever you decide please come back and say how things are going

Croix

Should I stay or should I go?

White_Rose — Thu, 10 Aug 2017 11:08:10 GMT

Hello Gigi

Sorry to be out of touch with you for a while. Unfortunately I have been sick and told to go to bed, keep warm, drink lots of fluids, take my antibiotic. However I am much better and starting to write on BB again.

One thing I have been told constantly and basically I've said yeah, yeah, yeah, is that we are only responsible for ourselves. Lately I have started to see the truth of this in my life. You have a well paid job which you gained because of your skills, you manage running the household with all the tasks this involves, you make time to try and talk to your husband. and you are not falling apart in the process. It may feel like that at times because we all go through bad patches, but essentially you keep your act together.

I wonder how much of this frustrates and irritates your husband. You say, He believes, I am not his equal because of that even though I do most around the house these days (including bills) and I have a job that earns more than him. I am quite successful, well-liked and intelligent, but he holds on to the tiniest things and hence believes I am dependent on him. It is completely absurd. You know yourself and your capabilities. So why does your husband keep up digging up these silly events.

Many men are quite happy to support a stay-at-home wife, or a working wife who earns less then him. It really is a return to the man being being the head of the house, making all the rules and expecting obedience from everyone. Please excuse me if I am mistaken. To me it sounds like he is happy with your current lifestyle and all goes well. However he does have depression and when it rears its head he starts to see you in a different light.

Acknowledging that a wife has more earning power, is not dependent on him for anything and is happy and confident in her life, gets him into a bad place. It's most certainly not your fault and quite probably not his fault. We do reflect the environment in which we were raised. My daughter's parents-in-law are an example of this. Once their first child was born she stopped working. He made all the decisions, including many that were bad for his wife, encouraged his sons to be the boss in their families and wondered why they would discuss matters with their wives.

I suggest something of this nature is happening for your husband and he probably does not realise it. Meanwhile he is making you responsible for anything he feels is wrong because he feels inferior. Tell me what you think about this.

Mary

Should I stay or should I go?

Apollo_Black — Sat, 12 Aug 2017 02:08:07 GMT

What does he believe the real problem is? You?

The only thing can really do is to continue to better yourself and hope he can step up to some degree. Seems to be he's trying to bring you down to his level. He feels inferior because that's exactly the position he is in, and only he can resurrect his mojo. Best not to take the bait and encourage him to see a psychologist. Have you had counselling together?

Does he know you're considering separation? If not he deserves to be aware this. Unfortunately it may come down to option A: seek help or option B: separation

Should I stay or should I go?

Gigi1981 — Wed, 23 Aug 2017 11:10:36 GMT

Hi All,

thank you so much for your advice and sorry it has taken me a while to respond. The past weeks have been really difficult, albeit not at home with my husband but rather within my head. It feels like my mind has built a wall or maybe I have played so much with the thought of leaving because I saw it as inevitable that now I don't know what to do anymore. My husband's behaviour has improved again and he makes many attempts to cheer me up. But I can hardly enjoy anything at the moment because I feel like I have lost the last bit of hope in our marriage. I know all too well that after his bad phases everything will look rosy again, just to come crashing down next year or in a few months. He has agreed to see a psychologist again and acknowledges that he has a lot of things to discuss. He says he wants to deal with his issues and get rid of them and he says he does not want me to go. I tried to explain to him that happy marriages don't usually have such all encompassing, fundamental issues like doubting everything, blaming, wanting out etc. He said he wants to speak to the psychologist about always having this flight reflex when he enters his phases although he actually doesn't want to us to break apart. I am happy that he tries to find help for him, but I cannot build up any hope that anything will improve for good anymore. I am now finding myself considering leaving regularly. I don't want to but it is as if I have built a self-protection mechanism that tells me I should save myself because I don't want to regret one day. I feel guilty for not being more loving with him because I do love him but at the moment, it is as if I feel nothing, as if I do not know what to feel, think and do. We have a beautiful trip coming up that I was so excited about. Now he is excited again and I don't know what to feel about it anymore. That makes me really sad. And I am constantly worried whether I should rather break everything off before the trip which builds up pressure. How can I get peace in my head. I don't know whether I can make the decision to separate right now and I don't know whether it would be the right choice. But I don't want to forget how terrible I have felt and that I need a plan B. I am going to see a psychologist this week, but I am scared they will advise to end it. I'm not ready although I currently believe there's no hope. But what if I'm wrong. What if it can change, even if I don't have hope. I just want to stop thinking in circles everyday.

Should I stay or should I go?

White_Rose — Thu, 24 Aug 2017 04:14:46 GMT

Hello Gigi

Well a lot has happened in the past couple of weeks. I am so proud of you going to see a psychologist for yourself. I would love to know how it turns out. I doubt any psych would make a suggestion you leave after only one session with him/her. What I think is more likely is the psych will get to know you better, get you to talk about your fears, needs and ambitions and move on to your relationship with your husband. That's my guess only, the psych may talk about completely different topics. So let down your guard and talk about everything.The psych is not allowed to tell anyone what you have talked about.

Your husband making attempts to cheer you up sounds very jolly. I think I would want him to sit down and talk with you about the best way to move forward. If he is going to see a psych then it must be in this 'good' period. Waiting until he falls over, so to speak, will make him resentful and angry putting you both back to square one. I think it is imperative that he returns to therapy immediately if your marriage is to be saved.

Wanting to run away from the family seems to be a common step with men who are depressed. You are the third wife who is in this situation that I have answered recently. All for different reasons but basically because they are depressed. The men say they are going for the good of the family, they are burden to the family, family would be better off without them, and off they go. It's the wife who has to pick up the pieces. Not biased in any way, just working from the posts we have received.

There is nothing for you to feel guilty about. You cannot make him depressed or stop it happening. You can support him while he learns to live with depression but it's difficult when he pushes you away. I think you love him very much to put up with this for eight years without him looking for and getting help. Also continuing to go until he can manage by himself.

Look after your own mental health as you will not be able to support him if you are crushed. Also look after yourself because you have a long lifetime and it should not be spent living with this will I/won't I stuff.

Mary

Should I stay or should I go?

Gigi1981 — Mon, 04 Sep 2017 08:41:00 GMT

Hello All,

I hope you are all well and happy. I just wanted to share my past weeks since seeing the psychologist and also to maybe get a bit more advice. By the way, thank you, I really appreciate it.

I went to the psychologist and it felt like such a relief. I had been waiting for weeks to get in and was about to go mad. The psychologist gave me what I needed, i.e. a way to see that I can give our relationship a chance while at the same time keeping track of what I want from life. My key need that I explained to her was that I did not want to lose myself in false hope and that I wanted to continue planning my future, even if that meant doing it alone. She gave me a strategy to give the marriage a chance but set times for myself at which I will look at it and re-evaluate. So I will do that. I have also started a journal to write my thoughts, plans, goals and feelings down. It is helping. After the psychologist, I felt great for a little while but then the concerns and fears that I will end up in the same cycle year after year crept back in. I am trying my best to fight them because I realise that there are only two ways at the moment. Either, I leave (which I think I am not ready or willing to yet) or I stay and give it a chance. However, I realise that if I choose the latter, I should probably do it wholeheartedly. Otherwise, what's the point? It is difficult for me to do that wholeheartedly because in me, a fear has formed that says "if you commit 100% again, you will be hurt again". But I also read a lot online, especially about the fact that worrying about something that may or may not happen, just makes your present life worse and draws the possible pain out longer. If it then, in the end, does not occur, you made your life difficult for no reason. This makes complete sense to me, but inside I am still scared that if I commit again and try to be my old self (which I am no longer), I will fall back into a pattern and be hurt again. Or maybe my real fear is that my husband will not see anymore how much I am in pain and uncertainty. So how can I get out of that cycle of thinking and commit without making the mistake of creating false hope. Then again, maybe there is hope. I am massively on a self-protection path at the moment. But my husband had his first session and it appears that the psych is quite good. But it is still too fresh to believe that long-term change will happen. So how do I give it time and fully commit until it's time to re-evaluate?

Should I stay or should I go?

Apollo_Black — Mon, 04 Sep 2017 11:28:55 GMT

Awesome work! You are sounding level headed and you have a plan. Don't worry about the negative thoughts creeping in, that's totally normal. Keep reminding yourself your are concentrating on moving forward and trying your best. As long as things are stable and safe at home then there's is no reason you can't give it your best shot to repair your marriage. The stay plan is the same as the go plan. Ultimately you are making positive changes to yourself which will hopefully improve your relationship. If it doesn't then you'll be in a better position to separate and get on with a better life. So if you are safe, free from abuse or anything like that, then you can continue to knuckle down and keep moving forward. You can take the focus away from worrying about leaving, particularly if you're not ready for anything like that. I don't comment a lot lately, but I can see that you have gained strength which is good to see. Keep it up and if you feel like you need a pep talk come back and we can help

Should I stay or should I go?

Gigi1981 — Mon, 04 Sep 2017 21:09:22 GMT

Thank you so much Apollo and Everyone else! I really cherish all your advice, thoughts and most of all, the time you take for a stranger's problems. It means a lot and has carried me through the last couple of weeks of emotional mayhem! Please let me know if I can return the favour any time, what goes around, comes around. Have a lovely week and here's to hope, faith in ourselves and the beauty in even the hardest things in life!

Should I stay or should I go?

White_Rose — Mon, 04 Sep 2017 21:16:41 GMT

Hello Gigi

I will certainly raise a glass to that toast.

Are you continuing to see the psychologist? I hope so as it will give you someone who will listen to you and help you sort out the truth from the imagined stuff. Sometimes we need another person to help us challenge our thoughts.

I am pleased that you feel you have a plan. That helps as you do not need to think about what to do next. It's already decided.

I hope you will continue to write in here to keep us up to date. Or simply to dump your feelings if you have a bad.

Mary