topic Narcissistic Never-Endings in Relationship and family issues

Narcissistic Never-Endings

Cornstarch — Thu, 17 Nov 2016 01:26:20 GMT

V17 Post away, it seems you have some pondering to do.

Narcissistic Never-Endings

V17 — Thu, 17 Nov 2016 01:37:32 GMT

Oh my gosh. Forgive me but I cry. Thank you for holding my hand in this. Thank you. I will come back. V.

Narcissistic Never-Endings

Cornstarch — Thu, 17 Nov 2016 01:53:30 GMT

V17

I know it is early in your break-up, but if you can at all, try and avoid feeling sorry for him, that would be ideal. Not that anyone on here expects that you behave, live ideally 24/7. Be-gone that humanity!

Narcissists can indeed find their perfect partner that they will live happily ever after with. And do not assume that it is always someone like us, with a similar personal history of abuse that occurred prior to meeting them, and has a shaky sense of self. They can destroy anything.

The narcissist lays the ground work for their future battles in the first 2 years of marriage/relationship. This is when intimacy is at an all time high, their partner is in love and malleable, and cannot see clearly. Love is a drug right. If you have a prior history of abuse all of our familiar self loathing/questioning is triggered. It fits like a glove, they do not need to do much handy work.

If on the other hand you were lucky, and your folks were pretty damn awesome, and your early childhood development received all the positive feedback our nervous systems needs to flourish, this is the crucial time of moulding for the other semi-healthy partner. They are appalled by the tragedy that has befallen their beloved narcissist because it is so far from anything that they have ever experienced. Bingo! First snare. We all love tragedy.

If you're like me, the dealings with a selfish, self-absorbed narcissist will be so harrowingly similar to your childhood that you will wise up or burn out in time and bolt.

But their perfect partner is someone that loves to dual, is a bit of a perfectionist but competes anyway, is proud, hates failure and defeat, has a tendency towards impulsiveness and addiction themselves, but is happy to accept the abuse because the thrill of the chase, and chasing high's is just too exciting. They will start to dual together over years, the fights are the passion, dual with 3rd parties just to get back at one another (sincere affairs don't exist, it's just the two Gladiator's in the Colosseum) because Tit-For-Tat is the latest thung Sista.

Get on board, burnt out, or sit in the stands and watch the show!

Narcissistic Never-Endings

V17 — Thu, 17 Nov 2016 06:30:16 GMT

I really thought I was going crazy with this man. I kept telling myself if I loved then why did I feel so unsafe? Why did I give in; why did think he was evil; why was I suspicious? I had to leave to go and see my folks one day and I had a feeling he was going to hurt my bird whilst I gone - I hatched a swan from an egg and simply adore her - so I said to him to leave her in her night cage and I'll deal with her when I got back. When I returned she wasn't in her cage and I found her out on the front lawn. He had left the gate open. I just knew he did it on purpose but I didn't understand why he would hurt her because he tells me he loves me, so I thought of all the things what could have happened and I just burst into tears.
Now I see why he acted like he did; I slept with the egg in my sports bra for two days and when she hatched on the first night, I had her with me the entire night. He chose to sleep on the lounge - I get it now; he was jealous of the attention I gave to her and not him. Crazy.

He lacks any empathy and tried to make my hurts all about him. Everything was about him. He was jealous of my son and tried to put a wedge in between us - so much so my son had a break down. Even then I should have acted and left him, but I didn't. I've apologised to my son for that now and our relationship - since I left the ex -has done a complete 360. It's this that encourages me to keep going; to keep moving forward even when I felt I wanted the ex to call.

I spoke with my GP today, I call her wonder woman as she is psych, doctor - everything rolled into one; she explained the reasoning behind me wanting him to call. When I asked him to leave he wasn't the dramatic man I thought he would become, instead he was so calm even saying it was okay for me to do that. Almost like he gave me permission to. My GP said that a narcissist doesn't act like we expect other people to act in situations like this. Yep. However, she did say to not be surprised when he would try and work his way back in. Okay. So I'm trying not to pre-empt his behaviour but he will be coming back to pick up the rest of his stuff. This concerns me because I have such deep resentment towards the man I am scared he will say something that will act as a trigger to me to lash out at him. I don't want to do that. So, I will make myself scarce I think.

Strangely, writing this down is helping. Even if in the early stages, I think I will be okay.
Thank you for 'listening' to me, I appreciate it.

Narcissistic Never-Endings

Cornstarch — Thu, 17 Nov 2016 06:50:22 GMT

It is just one of those things that 'until ya' experience it, you wouldn't believe it!' I suppose that's what domestic violence is with a narcissist.

I don't know how much you know about me, but my Mum has schizophrenia. My siblings and I always say, "I wonder what Mum's symptoms/life would have been like had she of met a caring and loving person?

Here's the revolting, disgusting extent of my own fathers narcissism and why I find this personality stay utterly revolting, deplorable and do not want anything to do with them;

my rapist was my father's best friend. With an impressionable, needy narcissist that showed off, that meant I was perfect prey. He attempted to molest my sister when she was 16. Do you know what my father said to me.

He said; "Its a terrible thing that _*(_ did, but what you have to understand is that he was my best mate".

My own father.

THEY ARE SICK

It's all about them

Narcissistic Never-Endings

pipsy — Sat, 19 Nov 2016 05:52:44 GMT

Dear Cornstarch. Hi I'm so sorry your father's so-called best mate abused you with your dad's permission. Most narcs believe they have the right to treat their family however because they are the parent/spouse. My dad was narc/alcoholic, he was so good at name-calling/abusing/belittling etc. My earliest memories are trying to escape him by hiding when I knew he was coming home. As a direct result of his abuse I suffer PTSD. My mum was in total denial as to his alcoholism and we were told, 'he is your dad, therefore you will behave'. While mum was not schizophrenic, she did have severe depression due to her fathers' alcoholism and his regrets there were no sons. Mum had 3 sisters, therefore she and one sister did a lot of hard manual labour, one sister was disabled, one left home real early. They were farmers, I'm talking about the 1920's. My parents were not affectionate at all, my mother was denied affection because my dad suffered a form of PTSD due to his being in the 2nd war. I have no dislike for my parents even though they were not good to my male sibling or me. I have learnt as a result of them to be a better, loving, caring person. My male sibling also abused me whenever he could. Mum knew but protected him as he was her favorite, dad was unaware of this abuse. It has taken years and much counseling to overcome the damage done by these toxic people. My ex and his parents also ill-treated me. Through a close male friend, I have been able to mentally walk away from this abuse and become someone I can be proud of. The PTSD I suffer is 'small potatoes' in contrast to the severity of the abuse. I can't sleep in an enclosed room, I need a nightlight, I often cry seemingly for nothing. If someone raises their voice or gesticulates, I instinctly cover my face with my hands to protect myself from attack. I am learning to protect myself and I'm also learning that it is okay to distance myself from dangerous situations. I am also a recovering alcoholic, I have been 'dry' for several months. As I stated earlier, much of my recovery is due to this person who stood by me. Everyone needs someone who can understand and empathize without judgement. These forums never judge and offer support, guidance and encouragement.

Lynda

Narcissistic Never-Endings

Cornstarch — Sat, 19 Nov 2016 06:14:51 GMT

Oh gosh thanks Lynda. I feel like until you've lived with a 'narc' as you say, it's hard to believe what they're capable of. It's sort of a waste of my breath. I feel like a fraud. People won't believe me, because I was raised in a very conservative middle class family, and people just turned the other way. How do you explain absolute madness. Ironically my beautiful mum suffers from a psychotic illness and yet my father was the nut! She just had terrible luck. My father idolised my rapist and as you can imagine that messed with a little girls head. In my immature self I felt like he was giving him permission to do what ever he wanted to, to his daughter. "Here mate, she's all yours", is how it felt.

I really feel for you with the sensitivity of your triggers. When trauma is interpersonal people are scary. I totally get your reactions.

I had a breakdown this year and I was hospitalised. It felt shit. Was one of my lowest points.

I'm trying to stay positive, but naturally I am scared for my future and sad for my past.

I'm just a girl in the suburbs people walk past. Maybe some days I pass as normal. Before I was hospitalised I disclosed my trauma to a close mate a few months before. What really made me sad was she said, " I always suspected you had a terrible bleak tale to tell because nothing added up".

That made me really sad. I guess evidence is more easily picked up on than I like to admit.

Thank you for your kind words. I hope some gentle peace comes your way.

xxxxxxx

Narcissistic Never-Endings

pipsy — Sat, 19 Nov 2016 07:28:02 GMT

Hi Cornstarch. Thank you for your kindness too. I always felt no-one would ever believe me either because, to the 'outside' world, my dad was the perfect uncle, father, son (to his mother). When my cousins or any visitors arrived, dad would play with us (me included), he would laugh, joke and you would never have believed his incredible cruelty when we were once again just 'four'. He was devoted to cricket and would spend hours coaching, umpiring etc. As far as the sexual abuse inflicted by my male sibling went, my dad went to his grave not knowing. Your father should have protected you, you were his daughter. Unfortunately, the 'narc' side of him would've stopped him because he possibly wouldn't have been able to choose between you and his friend. With narc's, they have to be 'in charge', this often prevents others from 'seeing' what is under their nose. If the narc cannot control outsiders, they instead turn nasty on their families because quite simply, it's easier to control immediate family than it is to have to choose. The family often has to 'put up' with unpleasant outside friends of the narc because he has to be seen to be 'perfect'. He will often choose people who will sympathize with his undying efforts to be seen to be the perfect, loving, caring devoted 'family orientated man'.

I actually sympathize both with narc's and their families because narcissistic personality disorder is a mental health disorder usually undiagnosed due to denial on the part of the narcissist themself. Getting away is a work of art, being believed is also a work of art. Because of my close male friend, I was listened to and believed. I believe you and wish you well in your journey of regrowth and harmony in your now life.

Lynda

Narcissistic Never-Endings

Cornstarch — Sat, 19 Nov 2016 10:43:30 GMT

Thanks Lynda,

Possibly you're a more highly evolved human being than me because I'm not at the stage yet where I can see the 'narcs' side just yet. Everyone is so different with their sex abuse. A close friend was raped by her cousin in her early childhood for years and she told me, "I have no anger and I think that's my problem". She has debilitating depression but yet cannot feel angry, she just feels numb. She's 51.

Yet me thrashes her limbs like a crazy person.

Grief has its natural course, and to be raped by a father figure, in front of his wife (a mother figure to me) and justified by my own father as 'mateship', is a fair bit to get my small head around.

As you can imagine I isolate myself at times, wander off in a dissociative day dream and can appear weird to the untrained eye. In the end I don't care how I look.

On a positive note 2016 has delivered me a great psychiatrist. Being a curiosity can attract curious minds. In terms of the types of conservative personalities that medicine sometimes allures he's a rebel. I love left of centre kinda people, they instil confidence in me that there are people out there that question norms and expected ways of viewing the world. Has our Prime Minister not preached 'innovative' thinking, or at least a spirit of questioning the done and the known.

Maybe I am my very own diagnosis.

What matters most is how I see myself.

Thanks for your white light here's some star dust xxx

Narcissistic Never-Endings

pipsy — Sat, 19 Nov 2016 11:01:22 GMT

Hi Cornstarch. My ability to 'forgive' those who hurt me has only come about in the last few years. I am 65 and for years was where you are now. As I mentioned my close male friend was a godsend in my darkest hours. Through his wisdom and constant caring and guidance, I was able to 'let go' of the destructive negative hurt as I realized I was hurting me more than those who abused me. The people who hurt me carried on with their life, leaving me with the feeling of 'not being good enough'. I was initially informed that everytime I cried or felt bad, it meant my abuser had 'won'. This is total crap. In any abuse there are no winners or losers. There are the abusers (who seldom change) and there are victims. Yes, you are grieving for the child who couldn't be protected, for the anger you feel for the betrayal. Allow yourself time to grieve allow yourself the right to be angry. Hopefully your psych has experience in this field. He will help you grieve and also help you 'love' you. You need to learn to love yourself and not be ashamed of loving yourself. Don't be afraid of being angry with your father. It's important to vent the anger where the hurt and betrayal started. Ask your psych to help you 'tell' your father what you feel.

Get some help letting the sunshine through. Sunshine means healing.

Lynda.

Narcissistic Never-Endings

V17 — Sat, 19 Nov 2016 11:10:51 GMT

Please forgive me Corny, I really didn't know how to respond to your post - I kinda froze. I'm sorry for that. Anger and I are like oil and water at the moment, we just can't mix it seems. I'm so glad Pipsy replied. V.

Narcissistic Never-Endings

Cornstarch — Sat, 19 Nov 2016 11:18:19 GMT

So true Lynda, thanks heaps.

I wish my anger flowed naturally but even organic reactions to a crime committed against me feel loaded at times.

Dad projected his own childhood Domestic Violence onto the next generation, he made me feel that anger = evil, therefore expressing it feels clunky and slightly absurd. There is nothing more terrifying for a DV victim than turning into the perpetrator themselves. That is annihilation in our world.

He used to call me evil in fact, a worthless piece of you know what and then the floggings you never forgot finished off the evening. Because I was raised in White Bread Middle Class Australia it took until I was 16 for the neighbors to call Docs. I'll never forget the feeling of answering the phone? I felt like saying "what took you so long!" I'm trying to remain positive with Rosie Batty's advocacy but the cynic in me wonders if it will ever change.

It never ceases to amaze me who turns a blind eye so as to 'not make a fuss or get involved'! Please.

Youve done amazing this year to pull in the drinking, My idea of numbness is an island. I have days that I call my Kingsford Smith days. As in the airport. Thats when I eye off my passport and think to myself where will I get a one way ticket to today? And NEVER come back

😜

Narcissistic Never-Endings

Cornstarch — Sat, 19 Nov 2016 11:23:49 GMT

Seriously V you never have to fret about replying on here.

You're in charge now.

You don't owe anyone anything. And if an imbecile makes out as though you do, just get rid them.

Plain and simple.

Boofs be gone

Narcissistic Never-Endings

pipsy — Sun, 20 Nov 2016 01:55:01 GMT

Hi Corny. Your dad must have been raised in a similar fashion to mine. My paternal g'father was a strict disciplinarian. I never really knew him, he died when I was about 6 or 7, I think. He was a firm believer in 'kids should be seen, but never heard'. I remember my aunts used to say they were terrified of him. My paternal g'mother was the sweetest, kindest, most gentle woman I have ever known. She used to make sure the kids were fed, and put to bed early so her and g'dad would not be interrupted. My dad had a identical twin brother who was killed in front of him. Dad was not allowed to mourn as this was considered 'weak and sissy' to his father. Even nana had to mourn privately. My dad also lost his first wife in childbirth (twins) who were stillborn, so between that, his own twins death (they were about 7, I believe). Then the war and he lost many mates. The fact that he had to 'box on' meant his grief was also 'boxed'. He became an alcoholic to escape the memories. The PTSD caused the anger, put downs, as he has been put down. For years growing up, I hated him for what he did to us. I managed to put a 'family tree' together and discovered more about dad. I actually sympathize with the 'lost soul' he became. I also totally understand the PTSD he suffered. Mine is as a result of his treatment, plus the sexual abuse I suffered, which I know for a fact, he was unaware of. I do have problems to this day with anyone yelling, or threatening violence. We have a worker who has anger issues, plus severe depression, also has violent tendencies. She is in total denial of this, however, she is extremely unstable and raises her voice frequently (which is already loud). I cannot be in the same room with her as I shake and become tongue-tied. My co-workers are aware of my PTSD and shield me from her. If PTSD is recognized and accepted as a real illness, people who have it wouldn't feel so isolated and alone. I don't feel quite so isolated now, but for years I suffered in silence due to lack of knowledge. These forums are so beneficial for anyone with mental health issues as we offer continuing support and no judgement.

Narcissistic Never-Endings

Cornstarch — Sun, 20 Nov 2016 02:49:04 GMT

Oh gosh Lynda, you have certainly got 'complex PTSD' through and through. I start shaking when people raise their voices and yell too, and cannot cope with angry volatility. You're not a freak, you're nervous system was built on quick sand. It is horrible, I totally get the ghosts of domestic violence rearing their ugly head years and years after. And yes! completely agree with what you said that it is not recognised as a legitimate diagnosis in a civilian population. If you Google it or do many types of searches it will always refer to war or emergency services, not just ordinary women in the suburbs.

You're family has gone through SO much my goodness you could write the book and it would sell! For me when trauma is interpersonal it makes even the most everyday interactions such as work so much more difficult. People are our trigger. Not bombs, not back firing cars not tsunami's, but people. People label us weak, but I think it's a miracle we're still here! My anxiety is through the roof today because of a human being. A women from my past that really hurt me has become visible again. I was so proud of myself with how I dealt with it in the end because as you know, child abuse victims are lousy with boundaries and we give too much of ourselves. We had an intense physical connection when she was on a break with her psychopath partner that I thought was going in the direction that intense connections generally go. But no, she ran back to the money and the pretty house. It freaked her out. Down the track she told me that it made her realise that she was not satisfied and what was missing in her relationship. I was so proud when she came crawling back again and then finally again once they broke up and I gave her the bird and said, "how dare you toy with my feelings. You can't just take me down off the shelf when it suits your mood, get out of my life and never contact me again". So she didn't. I blocked and deleted everything. But my email address is easy and hasn't changed.

It is just a constant test of juggling trauma in human relationships.

I am so happy your co-workes are sympathetic and shield you Lynda. That is really cool. Not all work places are sympathetic. I was on a non-ongoing contract at work, there were redundancies and massive budget cuts so I am out of work. I am really anxious about navigating it again after my nervous breakdown. I was stronger back when I was applying for work. I don't feel strong right now xx

Narcissistic Never-Endings

Cornstarch — Sun, 20 Nov 2016 03:47:01 GMT

I replied to you V but alas no.

Seriously girl, do not worry.

There is no pressure here.

You have all the pressure in the world out there, and more some.

I've made it this far!

It is just terrifying how this personality style is rife.

You have every right to be angry V, unfortunately anger is a natural part of loss. It isn't easy to navigate though. I hope you and your son are OK x

Narcissistic Never-Endings

V17 — Sun, 20 Nov 2016 08:53:02 GMT

Cornstarch said:
It is just terrifying how this personality style is rife.

This is just exactly it! Oh my gosh, you hit the nail on the head!

Now that I have identified with it, I see it in my family even a particular close friend. It feels so stifling.

I've chosen to go back to AA. I reached out yesterday - glad, but a little apprehensive.

I'm really struggling today.

Narcissistic Never-Endings

Cornstarch — Sun, 20 Nov 2016 09:12:36 GMT

You're doing so great V going back to AA.

It would be so easy to drink yourself into oblivion with being on the anxiety spectrum. Try and not shame yourself. I know it's easy for me to say that.

I'm not holier than thou the only reason that I have a pretty good hand break with that is because my father drank himself into oblivion for the last 9 months of his life. He'd never been an alcoholic before that. Ever. I have only found this out recently from Mum. But look what happened to him. Gives a daughter a pretty drastic example of where I will end up.

The problem with drinking and trauma is that the bodily feeling is so great and such a temporary reprieve from anxiety. It's not so much a mental or emotional release but how it actually feels to be intoxicated is what people like. There is a quote in Bessel van der Kolk's book about that, I can't remember now, but it pretty much says that the problem with addiction or dependency is that people enjoy how it feels in their bodies. Hyper-arousal be gone for a few hours we say, but for me I pay the next day! Boy do I pay!

I remember being wasted by the fire in the cold of winter in the first year after he'd passed, thinking to myself, man, this could so easily become an every night thing and that would hurt my family yet again.

I'm not better than you. I'm just responding to personal tragedy.

Good luck. And no matter what happens you are doing great, no judgment here xxx