topic Opiate withdrawal and stopping ADs in Treatments, health professionals and therapies

Opiate withdrawal and stopping ADs

Lost_Girl — Mon, 14 Nov 2016 04:53:59 GMT

Hi,

I have been on opiate medication for chronic tension headache for over a year and have just weaned off them. I am in week 2 of withdrawal. I am stopping the pain meds because my specialist believes the underlying root cause of my headache has been addressed and any residual pain is likely to be chronic daily headache caused by the opiates.

I was taking a low dose of ADs to manage my moods prior to stopping the opiates. As part of my withdrawal I am experiencing severe vomitting etc and have not been able to sustain taking the ADs. In addition I have had a severe chest infection that I am only just starting to get over. I have been having to go to my GP to get injections to stop the vomitting just so I can stomach the antibiotics.

My body is in a lot of pain with no relief other than sleep. In addition to the headache I also have back pain, chest pain from coughing and being sick, my stomach is constantly cramped and I have restless limb syndrome in my arms (all withdrawal symptoms).

What I am hoping for help with is ideas on how to improve my mood. I think I know all the answers having been on the forum for some time but I just need some guidance. Due to my physical limitations a number of options like getting out for a walk and even what I can eat (or keep down) are not viable right now. However, I am crying all the time again and most days I just don't want to wake up.

Please hit me with suggestions. I feel like I am losing hope again.

Opiate withdrawal and stopping ADs

SourceShield — Mon, 14 Nov 2016 05:31:30 GMT

Hi LostGirl.

You really do have a lot going on, and you're doing so well...considering.

Its important to remember that you are going through the 'withdrawal' phase - and that can be rather uncomfortable, as you're learning.

Stay hydrated and also alkalised - Lemon water, melon juice...will aid the body to keep the acidity down.

This in turn will keep the gut etc happy, and in turn cause less nausea.

Start watching as much comedy movies and t.v shows, as you can...may sound a bit kooky but getting in as much laughter will rewire the brain and release more of the naturally occurring feel-good opiates in the body.

We are all hooked on these opiates...we just didnt know that 10 years ago, but now we do.

Also, did you know that 20mins of smiling...has to be a big smile that meets the eyes, will also rewire the neural-pathways and release the natural opiates as well?.

Listen often to your favourite music...same deal, will release all the feel-goods into the body.

And, as best as you can, simply accepting that this time is all part of the healing process, will release a big natural dose of dopamine.

The happy chem that we produce when we make our mind up to do something.

There is a lot of ways that we can produce all the natural feel-goods, that heal the body from the inside out because thats what you need now.

Your external body must rest and recuperate but whilst its doing its thing, you can be helping it by producing these chems, that aid the body internally at this time, naturally.

If you need anymore ideas about this stuff...let me know.

Take Good Care Of You.

MuchLove

Opiate withdrawal and stopping ADs

Nikkir — Mon, 14 Nov 2016 05:51:22 GMT

Hi Lost Girl,

Thank you for your post. I am sorry to hear that you are not feeling well and thank you for reaching out and sharing:) I really feel for you, its awful to feel sick and then to feel sad as well. Maybe you could send a message to our DR KIM on this site, there is a special forum I think she might have some advice. Either way it doesn't sound good. If I were you I would see another DR, I am not sure what you were on but I am not sure that you should be feeling sad and vomitting from headache medication for so long. It almost sounds like a chemical imbalance of some sort. I know there would be some withdrawal but this seems to me extreme. Again, I am not a Doctor though. Yes, getting out in the fresh air in nature and eating natural foods and cut down on caffeine and alcohol if that applys. Maybe you could see a Naturopath. I wish you all the best and hope that you are feeling better soon. Best wishes Nikkir x

Opiate withdrawal and stopping ADs

Lost_Girl — Mon, 14 Nov 2016 06:31:15 GMT

Thanks for replying SourceShield,

You have some great suggestions there. I have been watching things to distract from the pain but not with the intent of releasing the feel good chemicals as you have mentioned. It makes sense, I shall give it a go as well as try to soak up some smiles from the kids when they get home.

I think I better invest in a juicer too. People have mentioned a few times about it. I am going to do that too. I haven't tried melon juice but had been eating it as I read it could help with withdrawal.

Thank you so much.

Opiate withdrawal and stopping ADs

SourceShield — Mon, 14 Nov 2016 06:35:19 GMT

You're very welcome!

Take Good Care Of You Now.

MuchLove

p.s. Melon juice is great for the gut, and really refreshing too!

Opiate withdrawal and stopping ADs

Lost_Girl — Mon, 14 Nov 2016 06:39:33 GMT

Hi Nikkir,

Thanks for replying. The vomitting etc seems in line with what I have read about withdrawal. Depression is often associated with this as well from what I have read. My GP is away at the moment on leave and it is hard to catch other GPs up on my history. I think they would likely say to start ADs again. I am not completely ruling that out as an option but I am very keen to try and get through this without any medication. It is in the interest of being able to best diagnose where my body is at with my pain (after withdrawal) that I am choosing this.

I just need some better ways to try and lift myself out of this place while my brain rewires the neural pathways as SourceShield mentioned.

I will keep in mind about Dr Kim. Thanks for reminding me of her availability.

I have naturopath as my next in line person to see too along with doing functional medicine testing. The big problem I have there is getting myself anywhere at the moment and after a year of hubby taking 2 days a week out of work to shuffle me around, I can't bear to ask for more.

Thanks for listening.

Opiate withdrawal and stopping ADs

Kazzl — Mon, 14 Nov 2016 07:46:06 GMT

Hi Carol hun - wow, you are really under the pump. But it's good you're getting off the medication. I just wanted to put in a gentle reminder that stopping antidepressants suddenly can take people right down, very quickly. You're on a low dose so hopefully you'll be OK but ideally you should be cutting back gradually. I'm sure you know this stuff but I just wanted to remind you in case you plummet. If you do go down take your ADs again and do all you can to keep them in you. If it gets too bad and you can't see your doc call the hospital for advice.

As for ways to keep your mood up, I'd add to the ones you've got try to find something absorbing - whether a book, a project, music - just something that really engages your mind and lets you lose yourself. Maybe set yourself the task of learning about something you've always wanted to know about and get into it as deep as you can. Another possibility is to write (I know you write well). Whatever it is, it has to be enjoyable, not a task.

Hope that helps, and please keep a watch on your mood, maybe enlist hubby's help there. I know the focus is the pain medication but don't underestimate the power of even low doses of ADs.

Cheers hun

Kaz

Opiate withdrawal and stopping ADs

SourceShield — Mon, 14 Nov 2016 07:56:12 GMT

Great advice Kaz!

Opiate withdrawal and stopping ADs

Nikkir — Mon, 14 Nov 2016 09:25:59 GMT

Hi Lost Girl,

Thanks for your reply:) It sounds like you know what you want and have done your research and have a plan so that is good. Yes I would ask DR Kim or contact your GP and you are right as SourceShield mentioned AD does change the chemicals and structure of your brain through the receptors so it is no wonder you feel sick and have headaches depending on what you were on and how much. Personally I don't find medication a problem if its the right does and works for your life but it doesn't sound like this was the case for you. My daughter has had similar experiences except she is shocking with weaning she will be on a high does of Seroquel ( antipsychotic) very strong and then she will say " no more " and just stop, its really hard to watch as her brain and body tries to adapt. Best Wishes it looks like you have some good advice from all xxx

Opiate withdrawal and stopping ADs

wantalife — Mon, 14 Nov 2016 09:59:55 GMT

Lost Girl

First and fore most keep your specialist well informed of everything your feeling.

Unfortunately due to acute pancreatitis, due to trying to drink my depressive state away was pretty much a position of self administered morphine drip line over a period of weeks. X 3 about 3 months a bit self destructive then but return to home had no idea of the detox factor.

Everything hurt in my body could not sleep AD's (Cant comment) relaxant not pain killer or sleep aid. but.... just go with your Doc on this.

Did slowly though frustrating seem to all balance again.

We do things, the body adjusts - we think things- the mind adjusts - we change this, there is a lag within our body and mind to catch up. Patience is the KEY

Opiate withdrawal and stopping ADs

Lost_Girl — Mon, 14 Nov 2016 12:23:13 GMT

Thanks Kaz,

I knew you guys would help me. I should know that the drop is a long way but I am not thinking very clearly. I have been in a bad way today. I told hubby that I've been crying all day so he knows and will keep an eye on me.

I will look at trying to do something tomorrow. It's strange but I feel like everything is a chore at the moment. Things that I know would normally cheer me don't appeal. I will try and push myself tomorrow. I might try writing.

I think I need to get out of the house but doing that means more time off work for hubby. I don't see it as a problem for him to take a day out to help me while I am like this but he doesn't see taking me out somewhere as a reason to take time off. He has had a lot of time away from work this year so it is a bit much asking for more.

Thanks Kaz, I needed the reminder. Sometimes I feel like all the common sense and knowledge I have is in a fog, just out of reach. The harder I try to reach it, the thicker the fog gets until I forget it is even there.

I hope things are going along ok for you too Kaz, it has been a while since we have spoken. Always lovely to see your beautiful smile.

Opiate withdrawal and stopping ADs

Kazzl — Mon, 14 Nov 2016 12:45:40 GMT

Awww thanks lovely lady. You're right, it's been too long! xx

Now then, crying all day, feeling everything is a chore and losing interest in things sounds very much to me like a response to the lack of ADs. That's how it goes for me if I forget to take mine. So, caution urged hun. I don't know if you've been through this before, so sorry if I'm harping on what you already know, BUT withdrawal can be vicious - I've had to do it a couple of times.

So, doctor if it gets worse! Hang in there hun, you're an incredible fighter, I know that much.

Big hugs.

Kaz

Opiate withdrawal and stopping ADs

Lost_Girl — Tue, 15 Nov 2016 12:31:47 GMT

Thanks Wantalife,

It is funny how much my mind is playing tricks on me. After reading your post it occurs to me that yes, of course this sadness will pass. I just have to wait it out through the withdrawal. I am trying to fight it instead of accept it.

I will see my GP in a few days on her return. I find my specialist in this very hard to get hold of.

When you say we think things the mind adjusts, this is true of the neural pathways. I will try positive thoughts.

I started to do one of my hobbies today. I got a little done. It is a start.

Thank you all

Opiate withdrawal and stopping ADs

Dr_Kim — Wed, 16 Nov 2016 04:39:09 GMT

Hi Lost girl , you have got a lot of great advise from people and I see that you are also good at listening and trying things which is a great skill.

From a medical perspective, you are doing the right thing in breaking the cycle of dependance on opioids for pain relief. The theory is that we can develop a need for the opioid that initially relieved our pain, but then without it ,the pain is triggered.. a cruel twist indeed. So we become stuck in cycle.

To break the cycle is REALLY HARD ! Some people even need hospitalisation to do this. So the fact that you are doing it at home is amazing. Mostly the way to get through is with symptom control as much as you can, distraction, support and patience.

Symptom control means things like anti nausea medications - if you can’t hold down pills, get the wafers. Or take regular Ibuprofen for muscle pains..

Distraction means things like your hobbies or movies or writing or these posts!

Support means allowing your friends and family to care for you and take the load.

Patience means being kind to your self whilst you heal and allow your brain to get used to the “new normal“ . I’m not sure what your doctors told you .. but I’m thinking that the first 2 weeks are really rough, followed by another 6 weeks of kind of rough, followed by another 6 weeks of just ok … so its a big ask on your system ..

Restarting your antidepressant may very well be a good idea as they do not have the same issues of dependance and addiction that opioids have. However getting on and off them does have to be managed to minimise side effects so it is important to get clear instructions from your GP how to restart them.

Opiate withdrawal and stopping ADs

Lost_Girl — Wed, 16 Nov 2016 06:18:39 GMT

Hi Dr Kim,

Thanks very much for taking the time to visit here and provide a response, it is really appreciated.

Thanks for explaining the possible time frame too. I didn't have that explained to me. My pain management specialist changed me from tablets to stronger patches for 5 weeks. Then halved the patches for 2 weeks then stopped altogether. He said I could expect an increase in my headache initially (when reducing to half) then it should "even out" over the next few weeks. That was it, no mention of other changes.

When I started having other withdrawal symptoms such as fever, sweats, anger, insomnia etc I saw my GP (not knowing they were withdrawal). My GP advised it was withdrawal and told me to stick it out and that it would be a few weeks. The rest I read up about myself. It helps to know even roughly how this might work in terms of time.

Some days I feel like my rational mind is out of service. Coming here is a godsend. Having the reminders about keeping distracted and the acceptance of the situation have helped motivate me.

My GP is back in a few days so I will check in around the ADs. I tend to have significant side effects on them even at low doses so I hope to try and manage without. However, I will start weekly check ins again with my GP and let her assess.

Thanks so much for your time.

Opiate withdrawal and stopping ADs

blondguy — Wed, 16 Nov 2016 14:22:01 GMT

Hey Carol, I know Im out of my depth here on your topic and as you know I am not well versed on the pain you are and have had to go through.

I do know that beneath the fog the strong resilient Carol is still there.

She is a kind & beautiful person that has always been there for everyone else....

here for you....

Paulx

Opiate withdrawal and stopping ADs

james1 — Wed, 16 Nov 2016 23:41:48 GMT

Hey Carol,

That sounds really rough 😞 I'm sorry I don't really have many good suggestions and it sounds like this will be tough for a while, but in the meantime perhaps a little bit of structure, not overbearingly so, could also help. You could set time to do the hobbies you mentioned, if you feel like it. And just make sure you continue to let hubby know how you're feeling, and us too if you feel like it.

Big hugs from me

James

Opiate withdrawal and stopping ADs

Lost_Girl — Thu, 17 Nov 2016 02:11:03 GMT

Thanks so much Paul and James.

Sometimes it is hard to feel resilient.

James, I have started doing that. I am trying to do a little each day so that I have something physical to show for my day and it is starting to help. I lack the motivation to do it but by forcing myself I do feel like my day is less of a waste.

Routine is key to my improvement but my body is so wracked by this withdrawal that I really struggle to get up. I wake only to start purging and my head feels like it has been hit with a sledge hammer. It is super hard to "wake up" but I am.

The last few days are super tough too. Today would have been my Dad's 92nd Birthday and 2 days ago marks 20 years since I lost him to cancer. Just bad timing.

On the upside, I officially started dating my hubby 20 years ago last Sunday too when he rescued me from my grief with Dad.

It is hard to tell hubby how I am feeling each day because it results in sorrow and helplessness in his eyes. Neither of us can do much. However, he has taken to smiling at me in a ridiculous way for 20mins a day hahaha, bless him.

Thankyou all for being here xx

Opiate withdrawal and stopping ADs

wantalife — Fri, 18 Nov 2016 12:49:07 GMT

Very well said.... Neural pathways are re-enforced or gradually dissolved CTGA expression via RNA communication is an amazing thing but as a species we are amazing..... I say what is generally not acceptable because I live in the real world so I'll not comment on pharmaceutical spin such how great current Anti-Depressants work and accuracy of the target related neurons as release, block re-uptake etc can only say time is a great healer and the less the better (Within consultation) Autonomic neural fire can never be compromised however., It annoys me lots but cool forums such as this do not leave us alone regardless of our belief. We Stick Together!!!!!

Opiate withdrawal and stopping ADs

blondguy — Fri, 18 Nov 2016 13:00:05 GMT

Dear Carol and Mr WAL

Being resilient is a difficult goal to achieve. I am still failing on that one....The trying is the hard part. You are a legend on the forums Carol and always will be.

Hey WAL......I have two words for you and they are not happy birthday :-).........You Rock!

(Hugs)

Paul