topic Psychologist Misunderstanding Adoption Concepts in Treatments, health professionals and therapies

Psychologist Misunderstanding Adoption Concepts

Marcsa — Sat, 14 May 2016 00:10:14 GMT

Hi, I've stuck my toe in and out of the forums for the last couple of months, sometimes finding bits that are relevant to my situation. Lately I've come to realize that in the treatment of my depression and anxiety, the gulf between my psychologist and myself is widening. I just don't think she 'gets' it. I feel really frustrated because i have invested quite some time in coming to this point. I am a late discovery Adoptee, which means I didn't find out that I was an Adopted Person until the age of 41. My Adoptive Mother died before I found out and the relationship between us was never great. I certainly feel betrayed and cheated by her. My Adoptive Father was the one who told me, but said it was not a topic he particularly wanted to discuss - so we never did. He died two years later and we had become progressively distant both after my Adoptive Mother had died and because of his relationship with another lady. Not only did my parents not tell me my entire life, just about everyone around me - of my parents generation and older - knew I was adopted. My Grandparents, my Godmother, parents friends. When I spoke to my Godmother , she said "We thought you knew". How can I talk and show i know about something when I never knew about it ?!

Anyhow, I feel as if the above is relevant to my current issues with my son and the relationship between us. I feel as if (and my psychologist has pointed this out to me ) how I was parented, is how I have learned to parent my son. I guess I am shifting some of the blame, but I just think that there is something to be said for a child who was taken/removed/given up by their biological mother and given to parents who do not reflect back the same and anticipated nurturing of the biological mother. There are a lot of issues that come out of Adoption and i really think that my psychologist doesn't give them a place in our sessions. So ultimately , do I give up on this psychologist? Do I keep pushing this perspective, which I have (in a feeble way) ? If I find a new psychologist, will I start over, from the beginning, once again taking years to maybe get to this same point?

Two of my girlfriends have suggested that I find a new psychologist, but I am reluctant. Because it's change, because it is another failure added to all the others strewn through my life. Thoughts appreciated.

Psychologist Misunderstanding Adoption Concepts

pipsy — Sat, 14 May 2016 01:04:03 GMT

Hi Marcsa. It's so sad you don't 'connect' with your psych over your feelings of betrayal and being cheated out of knowing your biological mother. Do you know any of the circumstances surrounding the reasons you were given up. Since your dad has passed, is there someone you could ask who might fill in the 'missing' pieces. There could be 1000 reasons you were adopted out, not necessarily because your mother didn't love you. It's also sad you didn't 'connect' with your adoptive parents. Changing psych's might make you feel better. However, I suggest you have a talk with your Dr about this. Tell him how you feel about the anger you're dealing with in connection to being adopted. I can sense a lot of anger because you don't know why you were adopted. There are avenues you could explore to trace your parentage (particularly your mum). There was a program on t.v recently called 'long, lost family'. Have you thought about contacting them and asking them to help you. There's also Red Cross who sometimes can help with finding families. It's possible your psych can't help you deal with your anger re: adoption, because it's out of her scope of knowledge. If you can get another psych, all you would need help with, is dealing with the adoption issue. If that's your main issue. Have a talk with your Dr, tell him what your issues are and he can then advise you who you need to talk to.

Lynda.

Psychologist Misunderstanding Adoption Concepts

Marcsa — Sat, 14 May 2016 02:01:12 GMT

Hi Lynda, I have met my biological mother who lives in another state. She gave me up because she 'wasn't strong enough', what ever that means. I think she felt rather dominated by her parents and her background; my biological father was unacceptable to her parents. ( I believe he was Italian and her background was second generation Australian/Scottish origins). My biological mother explained that she thought it was the best option for her at the time, because she knew a couple (local to her) who had adopted two children. My biological father i am not certain about at all. According to my biological mother 'he was not interested'.

As regards to my psychologist not being able to assist me with my anger re: adoption, why, if it is outside of her scope, would she not identify that? I mean it is a big part of who I am ? I don't know if she has any other clients who are Adopted . Not that that should matter, and just because I am Adopted it doesn't mean that Adopted is all that I am either. I am so torn about proceeding from here.

I think going back to my GP might be the way to at least start to go from here. I just still feel that it is a waste to let go of all the therapy I have gone through so far. I think my history certainly affects where I am going and affects my current relationships with family. I don't want to keep being in this depressed state with my son and my Adoptive affected parenting skills.

Psychologist Misunderstanding Adoption Concepts

pipsy — Sat, 14 May 2016 02:34:28 GMT

Hi Marcsa. I think with regards to your biological mother not being strong enough, she might not have had the emotional strength to keep you. Your dad wasn't the 'right' one in her parents view. It sounds like, if she had kept you and remained with your dad, her parents would've disowned her. With everything seemingly against her, she had little choice. Nowadays, things possibly would be different. Your psych may not be able to deal with your anger, till you do. I feel, (I could be wrong here, if I am, my apologies), you have some unanswered questions your psych simply can't answer. Have you asked her why she doesn't seem to grasp your anger issues? I feel your anger isn't just because you were adopted, I feel there's more to it. Your dad wouldn't talk to you, everyone thought 'someone 'else had told you, no-one told you till you were 41. If you had known before, have you had any thoughts as to how you may have felt. I realize that's a hard question, but try looking back at your childhood, if you had known, would you have felt angry or would you have accepted that your adoptive parents 'chose' you because they loved you. There must have been something appealing about you that they chose you over other children. Being adopted doesn't change who you are, it simply means you are not their biological child. The adoption part simply means you were raised by people who could look after you better than your biological mum - at the time of your birth. Did your adoptive parents love you, were they cruel? You got to know your birth mother, that's a plus. You knew your dad, another plus. It's possible you weren't told also because you might have showed emotional issues regarding adoption had you known. I don't mean to disregard your feelings, I'm trying to help you understand some of the problems associated with telling some children they're adopted.

Lynda.

Psychologist Misunderstanding Adoption Concepts

White_Rose — Sat, 14 May 2016 06:00:27 GMT

Dear Marcsa

It is sad to find out you were adopted after 41 years of believing your adoptive parents were your biological parents. While I have not had this earth-shaking experience I can imagine how truly devastating it must have been for you. You have my admiration for wanting to make sure your son is not affected by this and for wanting to be the best parent possible.

Here are links to three threads on BB about adoption. It may help if you read these and see what other people have written and how they feel.

https://www.beyondblue.org.au/get-support/online-forums/permalink/qjBeEXHzvGGEbv8AAOnT_A

https://www.beyondblue.org.au/connect-with-others/online-forums/permalink/qdI6-nHzvGGEbv8AAOnT_A

https://www.beyondblue.org.au/get-support/online-forums/relationship-and-family-issues/adoption---abandonment-issues

I think you are telling us that you are very angry that you were adopted and also angry because no one told you. You have become depressed and feel, at least in part, this anger has much to do with your depression. You have been meeting with a psychologist for time, but unfortunately , the psych appears not to understand your point of view.

I understand you feel that to start work with another psych would waste all the time and effort (not to mention cost) you have invested with your current psych. Well I certainly get that having been in that position. So can I start there?

I have met with four psychs in my time. I started to describe my experience plus reasons but ran out of characters. If you are interested I will tell you later.

This all happened over 15 years so not moving from one to another in a short space of time. I took my history with me when I moved to each new person. Each psych had contributed to my knowledge of myself, even though I did not always realise it. Though I needed to re-tell my story, which also upset me, I was more able to manage the emotional upset it caused and highlight the bits that were yet unresolved. I didn't do this consciously but realised as I was speaking what was happening.T

The point is, there is often a great benefit in changing your therapist. Some can walk with you for part of your journey and others can join you later. What you have already learned/experienced/found will not be lost. After the introduction process you can start to build on your knowledge.

I am not telling you change but to consider the benefits. You will not lose on the deal IMO, and may gain much. Chat to your GP.

Mary

Psychologist Misunderstanding Adoption Concepts

Marcsa — Sun, 15 May 2016 00:08:13 GMT

Thanks Mary, and Lynda, I know I am angry and I have been for sometime. I am angry I can't get myself out of this rut and I remember being angry at myself for much of my life - but not knowing why. I think really and truly that a great deal of the anger and frustration at myself has to do with Adoption.Despite the fact I didn't know it at the time. Even though people at the time(1960s) thought they were doing the right thing. We know now that the secrecy that many Adoptees, Adoptive Parents and Biological parents were part of, has affected their lives. So when I've mentioned it as something relevant to me with my psychologist and that person doesn't see my suffering because of it - yeah, I'm angry. And it is this point where I can bring up rejection as a theme for Adoptees. As I see it, my psychologist kind of rejects the idea that it affects me and I reject the psychologist because (unconsciously) I am in pain and there is no view to finding the end of the suffering. Does that make any sense ?

Psychologist Misunderstanding Adoption Concepts

White_Rose — Sun, 15 May 2016 02:05:50 GMT

Hello Marcsa

Yes, it was considered back then that telling children they were adopted would be the best thing. That way they would not try to find their biological parents or have doubts that their adoptive parents loved them. Unfortunately so many of our trials and tribulations come from others withholding the truth about some facet of our lives. As I said above, I was not adopted but I have experienced the situation where others knew hugely important facts about my life but refuse to 'tell'.

It seems to me that you have every right to be angry, not just with your adoptive parents but also with the other members of your family who kept you in the dark. If any are still around can you ask them for more details?

The more you explain about your psych the more inclined I am to urge you to find another. I think, like most people, your psych has her blind spots and unfortunately it appears that issues around adoption is one of them. It's sad but not a complete waste of time. You have learned a great deal so far, that you feel strongly your that many issues relating to your anger also relate to the feeling of abandonment relating to your adoption. You have also learned that no psych has all the answers which is good.

Many people enter a therapeutic relationship expecting to have all their problems solved by the psych. Many of these folk do not expect to have to work on these problems themselves because the psych will do it for them. Clearly this is not the case and whatever your expectations at the beginning of the therapy, you know now that psychs are human and fallible, but usually have a good track record of assistance.

How long have you being seeing this psych? When we are in pain the most important thing is to ease that pain. If it's a headache it's usually quite easy, but some pains take longer. However, when we get no relief at all it's time to find another way. Try to see your time with this psych as positive and perhaps you can write down all the good things that have happened in this therapy. I hope you will move on with positive thoughts about this psych and into a new therapeutic relationship with equally positive thoughts.

If you concentrate on the unsatisfying aspects of your therapy I suspect you will keep on bringing this up with a new psych. Now that really will be a waste of time. Been there, done that. It robs you of the chance to move on quickly and easily and focus on the real objectives of your therapy. Let the past go.

Mary

Psychologist Misunderstanding Adoption Concepts

Greyhound123 — Fri, 20 May 2016 07:07:33 GMT

Hi Marcia,

i am at work at the moment and will write another post soon when I get a chance. But your expirence and feelings are very similar to my wife and I think you are not alone in the way you feel, she too is angry and resentful about it. I deeply sympathise with you because although I cannot ever fully understand I see the impact it had on one of the people I care about most in my life.

hope that makes you feel a little less alone about it And i think that the fact that you are willing to talk about it, even on an anonymous forum is a great step forward

Psychologist Misunderstanding Adoption Concepts

Greyhound123 — Fri, 20 May 2016 11:58:43 GMT

Just to add now that I am home and have a few minutes. I am very hesitant to talk about my wife's story Too much as she is deeply private about it I know this is anonymous but I feel bad talking about her and have a fear she would be angry if she knew.

But I think in relation to the dislike of your birth mother sometimes it is perspective. In my wife's eyes her birth mother left her for dead and abandoned her, even though in reality she actually risked her life multiple times and was beaten for trying to see my wife. As my wife also had no clue this was happening. To me I don't see her as a heartless monstor but as someone I feel very sorry for, in my opinion as she lives in poverty, had two children already and no way to care for a third and clearly has mental health issues possibly untreated, as heartbreaking as it is she couldn't care for my wife and the best thing she could do was give her to a family who she thought could. To my wife this is all nonsense. But I really wish she would answer her birth mothers efforts to speak to her.

So it may help, and I know I don't understand fully and I respect that, but it may be disarming to try and see it from a 3rd party. I am not saying your situation is in any way similar so please don't think I am being patronising.

Psychologist Misunderstanding Adoption Concepts

Marcsa — Fri, 20 May 2016 12:38:56 GMT

Hi Greyhound123,

I just tried to write a reply and the computer suddenly made it vanish ! Ugh.

i am sorry your wife find it difficult to come to terms with her Adoption. Every Adoption situation and Adoptee is slightly different. There are a myriad of factors which come into play. Within myself even, I swing from anger to resignation at my biological mother , my Adoptive parents..... Why was I even born ? It's like my life is being stirred in some giant cauldron.

All I can say is to be a supportive partner to your wife. I am sure that is the case. Maybe with patience, your wife will one day choose to be more willing to be in contact with her birthmother. One of my primary reasons for going to meet my Biological mother was that she was not getting any younger and perhaps one day I would regret not meeting her, seeing her for myself , seeing what gestures she had, how she behaved in a physical sense, the atmosphere around her. At least i have done that. even if it wasn't the 'Ah ha' recognition moment.

Psychologist Misunderstanding Adoption Concepts

White_Rose — Sat, 21 May 2016 23:39:18 GMT

Hello Marcsa

How are you going? Have you made a decision about your psychologist? I am very interested in what is happening and how you are managing.

Greyhound has made some valid comments about contact with your birth mother. At least you have had contact with her. You say you cannot understand why she was not "strong enough" to keep you. Was she not married at the time of your birth? Back then there was a huge stigma attached to unmarried mothers and their children. Any mom needed to be very strong to stand up to or endure the comments made to her. It could be very nasty.

I knew one young woman who decided to keep her child. She had the full support of her mother. This mom had a hairdressing business and her daughter also worked there. The baby went to the shop every day with mom and played in an closed off area when he was old enough. All the customers used to say what a lovely child he was, but outside the shop they pulled that girl apart. Hypocritical people, but that was an outcome of the times. Your mom would have been well aware of this.

Hindsight is always 20/20. As someone who grew up during that time I can tell it was a great time to be young, but not a great time to be an unmarried mom. No wonder many girls gave up their babies and regretted it later. Those who managed usually had the support of their families or were very tough indeed.

You will remember when AIDS first appeared and how anyone who had this disease was considered unfit to associate with others, no matter how they contracted the illness. Being an unmarried mother was very similar in terms of public opinion.

Have you decided to change psychologists? Please let us know how you are traveling.

Mary

Psychologist Misunderstanding Adoption Concepts

pipsy — Sun, 22 May 2016 02:47:09 GMT

Hi Marcsa. Hope you're starting to feel a bit more positive about the adoption situation. I understand how angry you are feeling, part of it could be because you had no say in what happened when you were born, given up etc. When things happen to us that we have no control or say over, it leaves us feeling helpless, angry, hurt etc. It's like a grieving process, made harder because no-one seems to understand your feelings of 'why was I born, if I wasn't wanted'. Earlier I mentioned that I believed your mum wanted you, that thought hasn't changed. Her circumstances at the time forced her to make a decision she didn't want to make. There is nothing that can change that. All the anger you harbour towards her, the authorities, her family, is not really helping you either. You probably realise that. Have you thought about approaching this from another angle? Ask your Dr if there is an agency that counsels children of adoptive parents. It's a fairly special field, ordinary run-of -the-mill counsellors can't do it, because they simply don't understand where you're coming from in relation to your feelings of abandonment. If you could attend a type of group therapy for children of adoptive parents, it may help you to get your anger/frustration out by talking to other kids who understand how and why you feel as you do. Also ring lifeline, headspace, they may be able to put you in touch with this type of counselling. You need to deal with your anger/hurt in order to grow more secure with who you are. I realize you know your parents, but you only know who they are/were, you never really understood what happened to them when it was known you were expected. You can't possibly know the wherefores' and whyfors because you weren't there to witness any of the possible anger/disappointment from g'parents on both sides. I was 16 and living at home when I discovered I was pregnant. Mum totally/completely disapproved of the father of my child. I was turfed out, luckily my then bf's parents took me in, I kept my baby, but lost my parents. It was a dreadful situation, I've never regretted keeping my daughter, but losing my parents was something I never expected. Bf's parents were extremely disappointed, but they did support me emotionally. Your parents obviously might not have had that support either. They made an extremely painful decision, believing it to be the only, right one to make.

Lynda.

Psychologist Misunderstanding Adoption Concepts

Marcsa — Mon, 23 May 2016 05:27:25 GMT

Hi Greyhound123,

I re-read your post and think this has made this thread go on a tangent I hadn't expected.

I don't think anywhere previously I wrote that I 'dislike my birthmother'. I'm sorry you received that impression. I am frustrated with her - certainly. Disappointed. I don't think I would go so far as to say I dislike her.

My goal with this thread was to ascertain thoughts on whether I should change/ move to a new psychologist. The reason being that my current psychologist doesn't give my Adoption the meaning that it has in the overall situation that is my life.

Psychologist Misunderstanding Adoption Concepts

Marcsa — Mon, 23 May 2016 05:46:34 GMT

Hi Mary,

I've been thinking for the last 24hrs about a response. I just wanted feedback as to changing psychologists. Adoption is part of who I am and I guess if this psychologist sees no value in giving Adoption the importance it has for me (although it is not ALL that I am) then one must change. By that I mean me changing psychologists.

As regards Adoption, briefly, because I could go on and on, and there are only 2000 words allowed for this post, I am well aware of attitudes of the 1950s,60s and 70s. But what I cannot fathom is the continuation of the lies and secrecy. I understand that women, such as my Biological mother accidentally fell pregnant and were faced with a choice. My Biological ,other was not some teenager. She was 27yrs old. Ok, she lived in a domineering type of household who didn't like anyone who was 'outside their circle'. Fine. But,..... times have changed. Now.

And my Adoptive parents, why did they feel it was ok to ( let's face it) LIE ? For over 40yrs ? It's not fair. And I, as an Adopted Person, should feel grateful ? I was indeed lucky. Many, many Adoptees I have met have had dreadful experiences. You can see that I can get fired up about this. The fact that generally only the Media santised view of Adoption is known and talked about.

I am sorry to be so angry. The more understanding and education people can get from discussing Adoption - from ALL sides - the better it will be.

Psychologist Misunderstanding Adoption Concepts

pipsy — Mon, 23 May 2016 06:05:00 GMT

Hi Marcsa. I think the lies you were told were not the right way to tell you. Adoption can be pretty devastating for all concerned, parents/child/ren/g'parents etc. The problem is, sometimes it's easier to tell a lie to start, after a while the lie seems to become a type of reality when you live it daily. The child in the middle of all of it develops an identity problem because when they're eventually told, they have no idea how to process what they've been told. I think when the adoptee is told they should be 'grateful' it's because they're lucky to have had a great upbringing as opposed to a bad upbringing. This has nothing to do with the anger the child develops for the circumstances surrounding the original decision. I know Marcsa you do feel some gratitude for your adoptive parents, who I understand, were good to you. The problem you're facing is why were you lied to. There is no one answer for that question. There are 100's, possibly none would satisfy you, because you feel the abandonment of the adoption. I suggested earlier, you may like to see about counselling available for adopted children. This is totally different than what you've been having. It would be looking at the whole thing from the point of view of the child (you). You would be able to really talk to other people in the same boat as you, who would totally understand your anger. Perhaps if you were to ask your Dr about these counselling sessions. I understand it's totally run by adopted children, for adopted children. I realize you're not a child, I wasn't trying to undermine you as a young adult. You are a surviving adult adoptee who needs to find peace and acknowledgment for abandonment issues. These feelings are real and need to be addressed.

Lynda.

Psychologist Misunderstanding Adoption Concepts

Marcsa — Mon, 23 May 2016 06:09:51 GMT

Hi Lynda,

As I said in reply to Greyhound 123, this thread seems to have gone off on a tangent that I wasn't expecting.

Boy, am I fired up. I've tried to give my thoughts 24hrs to settle. I'm sorry but it hasn't achieved the desired effect.Perhaps I should start a new thread, but I do feel as if I should give a bit of a response.

I am glad, but also sorry to hear of your potential Adoption experience. But you did the best you could at that time and very sorry to hear that your parents felt the way they did. ( Was there ever a reconciliation?) None of my business really.

I just want to reiterate - that I'm sorry if you think that I dislike my Biological mother. She frustrates me, disappoints me, is somewhat secretive and maybe has no idea about how to develop a relationship with me. I don't hate her, but I also couldn't say that I love her or have any feelings towards her other than what I have expressed. I have been seeing a psychologist for some time - 5+yrs. It is only really recently, in coping with my own child ( now an adult) that I've have begun to see that perhaps Adoption has some place in how my familial relationships have been affected.

Since I discovered my Adoption, I have been made aware of Counselling Services. I have been in contact with PARC (Post Adoption Resource Centre) pretty much since my discovery. You are right when you say run-of-the-mill consellors don't get it. Hence why there is a specific organisation. I believe there are other similar groups in other States. I really should star another post if I want to keep ranting on about Adoption. However, one of the biggest issues that is a crucial factor is the LIES and SECRECY, with which the lives of Adoptees are permeated. If I could've changed one thing in my past - that would be it.

Psychologist Misunderstanding Adoption Concepts

Marcsa — Mon, 23 May 2016 06:16:18 GMT

Hi Lynda,

Sorry, even more fired up now.

I know it is unlikely I will get any answers. Certainly not from my Adoptive parents - both deceased.

I really think I need to start a different thread. BTW, many GPs are also clueless.

Psychologist Misunderstanding Adoption Concepts

JessF — Mon, 23 May 2016 06:24:47 GMT

Hello Marcsa, I will have a go at trying to get back to what you were originally wanting to talk about: things working or not working with your therapist.

I think it can be important, when there are a lot of issues going on in your head, to work out what your goals are in therapy. What do you want to get out of it?

From your original post, it sounds like your main concern is around your relationship with your son and how you can mend it. It sounds like you and psychologist may be at odds as to the root cause of what is or has made your relationship difficult; you believe that issues relating to your adoption are part of the mix, and you feel she doesn't understand that. How am I doing so far?

If I've got all this right, then here is a suggestion to avoid you losing all the work you have done so far. Perhaps put the adoption issues aside for a bit, and focus with your psychologist on improving the relationship with your son. Put aside the past and focus on some solutions for moving forward in that area. And in the meantime you can continue your search for a psychologist with which you can work through the issues around your adoption more fully.

Am I on the right track?

Psychologist Misunderstanding Adoption Concepts

Marcsa — Mon, 23 May 2016 06:41:51 GMT

Hi JessF,

Yes, indeed.

Psychologist Misunderstanding Adoption Concepts

pipsy — Mon, 23 May 2016 07:03:41 GMT

Hi, I'm so sorry if I hurt you in any way. That was never the intention. I never for one minute believed you hated your biological mother. You feel angry/hurt/betrayed by her giving you up, totally understandable. Hate is such a negative emotion. You also feel anger for being lied to, the lie which started probably before you were born, became so ingrained with your upbringing, people around you, no doubt actually started believing. Just for the record, my parents and I never reconciled. Like you, I felt anger that they denied my daughter and (later, son) the right to know them as g'parents, they're deceased now, so my anger has gone with them. The fact that the lie continued into your growing up possibly means there was no easy way to back track and tell you the truth without telling you why the lie was told to start with. I realize that probably doesn't help you, but can you understand where I'm coming from. Like you, I had to 'stumble' with my raising my daughter, as everyone has different notions about bringing up their children. Being angry/hurting, the sense of being lied to all your life has given you a sense of not knowing or understanding any part of who you are. If you can learn to grieve for your sense of loss which is important, it may help you find some semblance of peace. Anger/hurt is part of grieving which everyone goes through during their life. We lose spouse/child/parent, we grieve for that loss. You've lost your identity because of your world crumbling when you found your life was basically built round a lie.

Again -please accept my sincere apologies if I hurt you earlier. It was never my intention to hurt you. I hope and pray you find some peace in accepting what you can't change.

Lynda.