topic Accepting yourself in Staying well

Accepting yourself

white knight — Sat, 19 Feb 2022 06:57:51 GMT

Acceptance is in the mix, in terms of the process we have to face where it comes to our demons. Like all the other factors in our quirky lives with mental illness challenges, we often have more intense fights to endure.
We have to accept we have a mental illness- no mean feat before we can feel relaxed in our own skin. We have to accept being “different”, not normal and we have to accept others wont/don’t/cant understand. We have to accept the download of all this and the discrimination from nasty people. Then there’s the challenge of accepting ourselves.
To top all this off we have the the computer. This machine has made incredible advances in communication, knowledge sharing and we as a result are far more aware and educated. But there is a downside….misunderstanding. In respect to forums we shed our outer skin, expose our deepest thoughts and in many cases display information about our inner thoughts we would not normal reveal. This can have ramifications. I’d argue that we with emotional needs far greater than normal and sensitivity at peak levels, that we are prone to fall into traps on the internet more often.
Facebook is a good example. I covered this in a thread- https://www.beyondblue.org.au/get-support/online-forums/staying-well/why-social-media-is-no-good-for-you

. Bullying from some quite nasty people had occurred with me over a 5 year period by one low life person that surprisingly was a popular fellow with others…for a time. Until people realised his inner persona wasn’t all that nice as his exterior appeared. By the time harm was done, the personal messages of “take more medication and go back to your doctor buddy” cut deep and there was no way I could just “laugh it off”.
Internet disputes place us in a situation whereby you feel you cannot avoid them. We humans cannot agree about everything. But the worst thing about internet communication is, we don’t see the smile when the other posts, we don’t read the words how they were intended to be received and we certainly don’t have a vision of the good nature of the person…that often is clouded.
We need to always try to move forward because the bigger picture of life itself is important. It isn’t an easy task because we are still chewing at the bit about our side of a story…so we have to be brave if we are going to use computers as our tool to talk, find common ground and swallow our pride. Acceptance a challenge? yes and focus on the bigger picture.

What do you think?

Tony WK

Accepting yourself

Amelia02 — Thu, 03 Mar 2022 13:49:47 GMT

Hi Tony,

You’re right The internet has been a boon in many ways - one of them in being able to allow support for people and connection, yes.
But yes also it provides circumscribed communication. We cannot see people’s body language. They say the majority % interpreted in communication irl is from body language. Irl is irreplaceable probably.

I’m sorry you experienced bullying online. Someone saying something about you need to take more meds see the doctor sounds like an unambivalent insult. If they had genuinely thought you were not being rational due to ill health and were concerned about you they could have said something like eg Sometimes it’s difficult to keep perspective and keep track of things, I find it helpful too check in with my psychologist or doctor when this happens etc. The latter could still be hostile - passive aggressive - that’s when seeing them and hearing tone etc that is absent online helps to figure it out. The former is insulting no need to check other cues probably.

In this age of high connectivity it is heightened because you can’t switch it off so much. I’ve heard of people unplugging as a recharge regularly eg 24 hrs/wk not online at all. I set a time to check my online stuff - including email - to once a day and find it way better. Sometimes you have to check email more if you’re waiting for something or your work requires it.

I too recently experienced bullying online. The horrible thing was it was on another mental health support site which made it even worse. It was supposed to be a supportive environment, a place where you could be vulnerable. It was in the main. But then I posted something about sending prayers, energy, love in all forms of faith inclusive and it offended the moderators interpretation that the prayers be Christian only. I was reprimanded, my posts deleted. I felt it was extremely unreasonable and creepy. It seemed like some sort of arbitrary (narrow/ fundamentalist Christian?)power trip. I have felt uncomfortable visiting the site since then.

I guess even in communities with people who’ve experienced challenges and who may be (at least expected to have) more understanding, knowledge and sensitivity from learning about mental health and relationships - even if they haven’t internalised all the knowledge - they are still human.

I think the best thing is to just be sincere, try to empathise as much as you can and come from a place of love.

I hope you’re feeling better from that now anyway.

Amelia

Accepting yourself

white knight — Fri, 04 Mar 2022 02:13:01 GMT

Thankyou Amelia,

Yes, even forums like this you have to tread the fine line for the benefit of not offending members or readers.

I've been here 9 years and a community champion for 8 of those and am comfortable in the format, the moderation and the safety of it. Some find it restrictive but I don't.

As you eluded body language, facial movements are not seen so many comments are misinterpreted. I'm personally working on that, perhaps a smiley face or similar can help :).

The new forum coming promises so many improvements

TonyWK

Accepting yourself

sbella02 — Fri, 04 Mar 2022 04:52:46 GMT

White Knight,

Your words are powerful.

At its best, the Internet can be a beautiful place - it can promote change and activism, allow communication between friends who are cities apart, and provide support for people trying to improve themselves and their lives.

At its worst, it can be a breeding ground for intense animosity, hatred, and scrutiny from mass groups of faceless, nameless individuals. It can cause us to re-evaluate our self-perceptions and change the way we treat both ourselves and others.

I'm sorry to hear about your experience of bullying with this person who appears to still be respected by others despite being seemingly ignorant and just not nice. Even as a psychology student, I still struggle to understand the meaning behind people supporting somebody who is known for intentionally hurting others or being spiteful. Perhaps it's a means of protecting oneself/being compliant, or perhaps having an association with somebody in a position of power is appealing.

I believe that for all its flaws, the Internet can be good, and there are some websites, organisations (like Beyond Blue), or public personalities that are inherently positive and do genuinely support people to be the best versions of themselves and encourage them to practice self-acceptance. I think that self-acceptance can be a challenge, and it's definitely a lifelong challenge that many people struggle with daily. I do hope that in future, people on the Internet can all collectively work towards putting an end to cyberbullying, because it can have lasting and detrimental effects on somebody's mental health/ability to accept themselves fully.

An interesting discussion you have prompted. I'm curious to hear others' perspectives, particularly as this website itself is an online forums that aims to promote self-acceptance and other positive qualities to do with mental wellbeing.

Accepting yourself

white knight — Sat, 05 Mar 2022 03:09:43 GMT

Hi SB,

Yes I do hope others join in.

Unfortunately I've fallen into the trap that I now pigeon hole people. Sad isnt it?. Those placed inside those holes are- that toxic to me

So protection from these people wasnt learned as a teenager. That made me vulnerable. So I had to develop a foundation of protection-

LEGS OF SPOKE
How can I let them know?
When the dark exceeds the glow
When the sun hides behind the clouds
Silence they hear...but I scream so loud.
Some stand beside a 6 foot hole
Shake their heads and see its toll
They ask how he could have dropped
Out of the circle -a forget me knot
Yet they seem to see clear and there is hope
When they sight a person with legs of spoke
A crippled girl pushing her chair
A man be manic- there's no one there.
"Storm in a tea cup" hurts so bad
Like the cyber crow who remains so glad
Keeps flying and in full flight
Achieves his art...in the middle of the night
For some in power see it their way
Even at the side of a 6 foot grave
Shake their head and call out "why"
"Why on earth- he didnt have to die".
So kind some be they reach out so true
Smile away "we want to meet you"
Bring along your vintage car and your smile"
But leave - what's behind your dial.
So we laugh and dine and all's ok
Leave at home come what may
If I be saddled with legs of spoke
They'd lift me around- bloody good bloke.
But as my mind hurts so bad
Cannot hide my feelings- mad?
Can no longer be bloody good bloke
Sometimes I wish.....
I had legs of spoke......

SOCIETY OF SAND

I’m sitting in a desert
Upon sand of friend and foe
Can’t find a piece of turf
Where I cannot stand on toes

I collect a handful of grain
Then watch as it escapes
Just like some friendships
A barren temporary landscape

I create my own oasis
By weeping on a weed
But the sand around me laughs
Cause it doesn’t have a need

Till lately it be the friends
That helped me walk the land
They holding me up under my feet
-supportive grains of sand

I begin to sink so slowly
As they gather my precious hide
The quick sand laughing so loud
A kind man says goodbye

And as I become one of ‘them’
My heart now granuled and dry
I try to weep to water the weed
But sand has no means to cry

Damn it! I struggle so
Be damned if I be like them
I crawl out of the society of sand
To remain the man I am…

and this thread

https://www.beyondblue.org.au/get-support/online-forums/relationship-and-family-issues/fortress-of-survival

TonyWK

Accepting yourself

therising — Sat, 05 Mar 2022 21:25:26 GMT

Hi TonyWK

As always, you provide a thought provoking thread. I love your ability to raise the consciousness of those around you. It is a truly beautiful soulful ability that I not only love but deeply respect.

I think trusting our ability to get a feel for things can, at times, offer so much clarity. Being led to doubt our feelings definitely tends to cloud things. The ability to feel the impact of people's words, especially on social forums, can prompt the need for pure analysis. Of course, 100% pure analysis requires emotional detachment. Definitely not easy to achieve at times. I think a good example of pure analysis could be observed in the following scenario. You could feel the impact of a person's cruelty and insane judgement online. Of course, the emotional impact may hit hard at first. Could feel like heart break or heartache before working up to fury. You might then openly express your feelings and, in the process, be shot down by all the followers of that person, creating further heartbreak and fury. Then, the need for pure analysis may dictate you find the most sensitive people you can find and ask all those people 'How do you feel the words from that person/those people who've been shooting me down?'. You can always trust sensitive people to hit you with the truth. They're very tuned in. All those sensitive people will most likely say 'Yes, definitely, I can feel those words. They feel degrading, depressing, self righteous, abusive and ignorant'. So, thanks to the sensitive people, you know your feelings are spot on, you were feeling the nature of that person and the nature of their words. You felt it all before everyone else stopped following them.

It's kind of funny in a way, once you begin to rely on your feelings as opposed to doubting them: While doubting them in the past may have led to self chastisement for being 'too sensitive', as others like to put it, tuning into how we're feeling a person's words or nature or a situation can have us do a 180. When someone's trying to stop you from getting a feel for things it can become a little like 'Shh, I'm trying to become sensitive enough to get a feel for this situation. You're distracting me'.

I smile when I think of how sensitive my kids are. The 3 of us could be in a situation with a degrading person and all give each other a knowing smile because we can all feel the degradation at exactly the same time. This points to our common sense. Clairsentient people have great gut instinct 🙂

Accepting yourself

white knight — Sun, 06 Mar 2022 00:54:41 GMT

Hi theorising

Thankyou.

So much content in your posts. I usually read them twice.

"So, thanks to the sensitive people, you know your feelings are spot on, you were feeling the nature of that person and the nature of their words"

Puts a different spin on those that say "harden up". I reject those that ever suggest I'm too sensitive, that claim suggests they themselves don't accept sensitivity as an asset nor a "normal or natural " characteristic. Rather its some sort of flaw. These things make me quite angry actually especially in the male domain.

As a young prison officer at 21yo in the notorious Pentridge jail the diversity of nature of officer was my biggest obstacle. The hard older officer determined to ridicule officer and prisoner alike that ever she'd a tear or show compassion resulted in suppressed emotions. Many a time my emotions met my steering wheel upon leaving work. I questioned my career when I should have questioned theirs. As I aged and in different career paths I realised the value of priceless of emotions.

All this steered me towards 'accepting myself', one of the best paths I've walked. because it led to confidence and defiance/defence of my right to be who I am. Eventually the need arose to lift others up onto the same solid platform to feel the contentment of acceptance.

Sounds like your children are in tune with their "feelings" no doubt from a parent that allows for same in your parenting. What a gift, the freedom of growing up cradling your own natural self.

A pleasure

TonyWK

Accepting yourself

quirkywords — Sun, 06 Mar 2022 09:56:25 GMT

Tony I don’t accept myself but I live with myself.
thanks for your post

Accepting yourself

therising — Sun, 06 Mar 2022 19:23:04 GMT

Hi quirkywords

I'm wondering if you can accept parts of your self. Do you accept that truly beautiful part of you that comes here making such a positive difference to others, in the way of support and encouragement? Personally, I love that part of you. What is not to love?

I find there are parts of me I basically accept, parts I fully accept wholeheartedly and parts I absolute love for getting me through the most challenging times. I even find there are old parts I can't accept (back into my life). While I understand the alcoholic in me and have come to terms with why she existed throughout all those years in depression, I can never re-turn to her for 'support'. The alcoholic in me nearly destroyed me, mentally, physically and on a soulful level. So highly destructive.

What if we are comprised of so many parts and we're not meant to accept certain ones. What if we're not meant to settle for those parts of us.

I recall reading a brilliant book called 'Insanely Gifted - Turn your demons into creative rocket fuel', by Jamie Catto. He speaks of certain parts of us being triggered to life for the first time, based on different circumstances. For example, the victim in us comes to life through abuse or victimisation, the intolerant sense of self is triggered to life through no longer being able to tolerate what we face, the imaginative part comes to life when triggered to imagine etc. The imaginative side of us is able to imagine just about anything. This part of us can create the most vivid imagery in our mind. While it holds the potential to lead us to see heaven on earth, it also holds the ability to lead us to see hell on earth, such as no way out of depression.

One of the most interesting aspects Catto writes about comes down to - once all these parts come to life, we can learn to rely on them. The victim will step forward to alert us to whenever we're being victimised. The intolerant self will pop in when we're trying to tolerate something or someone that shouldn't be tolerated. And if we are led to imagine only the worst, the imaginative part of us will alert us to when no one is leading us to imagine anything other than the worst. It can be impossible for our imaginative self to relate to some vague plan or no plan at all. How can we be expected to see with such a lack of clear vision? No plan at all can sound a little like 'You just need to get on with life'. These words instantly trigger my intolerant sense of self to come to life 🙂

Accepting yourself

therising — Sun, 06 Mar 2022 21:16:29 GMT

Hi TonyWK

I can't fully imagine how terrifying it would have been to work at Pentridge, especially at such a young age. I wonder whether in some of the prisoners you saw the possibility of reform. Of course, in others, it would have been perfectly clear how they could never be reformed in any way. Such people revel in their nature as being cruel and brutal, only experiencing joy and/or power through the sufferance of others.

To have a kindness in some of Pentridge's guards would have, I imagine, been a relief for some of the prisoners, perhaps a kindness they had never met with throughout the whole of their lives. To be a strong and kind authoritarian figure, knowing which parts to channel at any given time would perhaps have offered the best/most constructive kind of training for a guard. I imagine those guards who were completely emotionally detached would have been better suited to the more brutal wings, with the seriously hardened criminals.

I can't help but wonder whether there was ever any talk about prisoners from the past while you were there. When I think of how Pentridge is known for its 'ghost tours' in this day and age, I can't help but wonder. Of course I know all that paranormal type stuff is not everyone's cup of tea yet Pentridge remains notorious for such experiences. Those who are most sensitive are known to sense the ghosts of the past, so to speak.

I can remember visiting Pentridge many years ago after it had closed. It had such a horrible feel to it. It felt so fearful and terrifying and that was during the day. To imagine being a less hardened criminal there, to have you on shift would have been such a relief. I imagine you made a welcomed difference to some of the guys in there. What a horrible system that doesn't support the kinds of people who can offer relief and the chance of reform. Being such a thoughtful guy, I bet you could easily pick the many ways in which the prison system is broken.

Accepting yourself

white knight — Mon, 07 Mar 2022 03:02:08 GMT

Hi the rising

The prison system is like democracy, the alternative is worse. So there is no real answer to reform but from the inner spark some that are incarcerated get and never return...about 30%.

The problem with a kind guard is that such approach is seen as weakness. Inmates are masters at spotting it so you 'save' it for those special moments you can give it without projecting you are an easy target for some sort of plan.

The "ghostly" aspect can play on your mind but after some experience you know not to allow your mind to play such games, attention is needed all the time even during the patrols at night when windy conditions along with those bluestone walls and unmarked graves can put a chill up your spine. A noisy cat in a bush can do likewise.

I found after 3 years (after my brother passed away by his own hand) that it wasnt for me. I didnt realise the long term effects and those memories remained for 14 years when I was a security guard at a lonely Army base outstation with only roos to keep me company. One night I penned a poem and that poem completed released an enormous amount of emotion that it wiped the guilt I had of some decisions way back then. I also discovered that sensitive kind people that are subjected to environments not suited to their personality are much more prone to mental damage from them. My daughter, once a teacher now pensioned off from the stress and nature of her job had such a path also yet other more robust characters had zero effect.

My theory on jails is such that I endorse the concept of educating young teenage criminals early. There was a program in USA and I think Goulburn them days that led these fellows into an adult jail. The program called "scared straight" introduced them to hardened long term inmates that scared them so much they reformed before going down that road. Money is the problem. Jails and escapes/riots lose votes but good programs and education rehabilitation dont gain votes.

I met one ex inmate on a railway platform post jail work and he thanked me for my extra time I spent with him prior to his parole. Such tokenism I embraced as the one enormous reward for the best approach you can have not as any hero status but a personal goal of simply being a good person.

What that work did also was allow me to not only embrace my kind side but expose my authoritarian side if needed eg if an act of bullying appeared. I can be a toothless tiger lol. Tyrants are my specialty. A handy mask for a male.

TonyWK

Accepting yourself

therising — Mon, 07 Mar 2022 18:33:59 GMT

Hi TonyWK

It sounds as though you have met with so many different parts of yourself over time - the authoritarian, the sensitive guy, the grieving brother, the compassionate dad, the seeker of self understanding etc. While it's one thing to meet with all the different aspects of us that relate to the more joyful side of life, meeting with the much deeper emotionally challenging and confronting aspects is, of course, a whole other story. From my experience, I've come to see each new mind altering life changing challenge as bringing a new part of me to life. Sometimes it can feel like a long tedious and painful labor. Perhaps this is one of the many challenges of a sensitive person, to identify what new parts are coming to life or coming to light at any given time. I believe, as long as we're on this earth, there will always be new aspects of us coming to light. If someone had have said to me throughout my years in depression 'Over time you will come to meet with the absolute best in yourself' I would never have believed them. Here we are, meeting those parts of ourselves Tony. Perhaps the most powerful part is the part that has kept us alive during the darkest of times.

I feel one aspect I struggle with the most is my fearless self. Typically she only comes out when my kids are involved. Perhaps that is simply 'the lioness' in me. She is completely fearless and would lay her life on the line in a heartbeat without a single thought interfering with the need to do so. Outside of this, my thoughts and attempts at fearless decision making can, at times, be too 'wishy washy' I suppose you could say. It was my brother who identified how we were never raised to be fearless. Our parents were kind and deeply thoughtful compassionate people to varying degrees (more so my mum) but they were never and still aren't fearless people. If anything, they were rather fearful people, inside the square players who played it safe a lot of the time. So, you can imagine how the inner dialogue goes. While the fearless risk taker in me may be saying 'You just have to do that. C'mon take a chance', my well exercised fearful side can sound a little like 'But I can't. What if this happens...'. Inner dialogue is brutal when it comes to the different facets of our self going into battle with each other. Yet another challenge for a sensitive person, to figure out which aspects of our self are battling it out at any given time.

We humans are fascinating creatures, so simple yet so complex