topic How do i deal with it? in Depression

How do i deal with it?

Peachy1 — Thu, 30 May 2013 00:58:17 GMT

Hi,
i have been with my boyfriend for 4 years, when we first met things were fantastic. he was such a lovely man and he still is to this day, however, things have been different for quite some time.

with the loss of a loved one a few years before he met me, he still struggles to move on. he doesnt talk about it but he is depressed i think and no matter how much he says he wants help he is procrastinating. I have given so much to our relationship and have loved doing it, but it is getting really draining for me. i want to have the best life i can and i want him to be in it with me but he doesnt do anything really, he sits at home, doesnt work, plays games all day, i come home from work and do everything. i try to talk to him and get him motivated but he is so defensive and feel like im getting nowhere! what can i do?
the other thing that is affected is our sex life, we used to be really intimate all the time and now its like an effort for him or a 'chore' - he says he loves me and i believe he does but its just not the same. he looks at porn all the time i know it he tries to deny it. he doesnt understand that if we had a healthy sex life i wouldnt care if he did that (i might care but not as much) but he cant do that and then not be intimate. im at my witts end.. i love him but i want him to grow up and get through things and be a man he complains all the time.. well he needs to fix himself?

thanks

How do i deal with it?

The_Real_David_Charles — Thu, 30 May 2013 08:34:30 GMT

Dear Peachy1,

Your doing everything your boyfriend needs emotionally by just being there. I'm afraid I"m on his side - he probably needs to sort out meds/treatment at some stage but it doesn't sound like he is at risk for suicide or self harm (unless you count excessive internet as self harm). Sometimes the computer is still a way of communicating or interacting when other means fail.

"i love him but i want him to grow up and get through things and be a man.....he needs to fix himself ?". Are you serious ? You mention he is still grieving and has trouble communicating and you want him to suddently "fix" himself. Have you become his mother or something ? The guy is obviously floundering and under some mental anguish. A bit of empathy would be good. I'm sure you'd want the same support if the roles were reversed.

The porn is a great hole for him to escape in, so to speak. It might deaden his senses a bit but it's probably not you or the former sex life that is making things like this. It would be "a 'chore' " for your boyfriend to do anything - even walking to the shops to get milk & bread. You seem to want to impose a condition on your sex life regarding porn and intimacy with you. But your boyfriend is thinking like that at the moment. He's in limbo. Why threaten him or make him chose ? You write that "he complains all the time" and yet your whole post also sounds pretty negative and derogoratoy about him.

Let me ask you one question: "What if he can't "get through things" ?" Your support is probably the only thing he has to prevent him sliding further into depression, isolation and non communication. You want a short term solution for a long term problem. You're very angry. But is it helping ?

Adios, David.

How do i deal with it?

Vegetarian Marshmallow — Thu, 30 May 2013 09:43:41 GMT

I think the porn and games could just be habitual ways to kill time, rather than actual *indulgences*. That sort of repetitive, easily-accessible activity that happens when in a state of ennui. Depression tends to be a libido killer.

It's hard to accept that you need help, and especially since you want him to "be a man", accepting help can be seen as a sort of failure. I think some kind of counselling would be a good idea, and that if he seems receptive to the idea (i.e. he's going to see it as you doing something *for* him rather than *to* him), it would be a good idea for you to organise it rather than waiting for him to.

How do i deal with it?

Vegetarian Marshmallow — Thu, 30 May 2013 09:50:35 GMT

Oh, and go with him to the counsellor, so that .. he actually goes (If you sort out an appointment and leave him to his own devices, he might just not go), and so that you can form an opinion on the particular counsellor, and discuss with your boyfriend whether or not that person is a waste of time.

How do i deal with it?

Peachy1 — Fri, 31 May 2013 01:04:51 GMT

no offence david but you dont know the situation i am and have been in for years. i may have not explained myself properly and it came across as rude but im hurt and no one will understand how it actually makes me feel. people only feel for the one with the depression, what about the partner? he tells me that i have changed his life for the better and even though i am letting out my frustrations on here it does not mean i say these things to his face, i give him my undivided love and all i have so it feels a bit rude of you to respond the way you did. did you know that his depression is making me different? it has been for about a year, all my family have noticed it and i am starting to notice too. and i have organised therapy in the past many times, he just doesnt stick with it, i have offered to go with him as well and i take him on holidays, listen to him when he needs, let him sing to me because that makes him feel good, all of it. where is my sympathy?

How do i deal with it?

The_Real_David_Charles — Fri, 31 May 2013 08:40:59 GMT

Dear Peachy1,

I can empathise with your position. But holding your partner accountable for all the wonderful things you do for him and his depression is just gonna eat you up inside and cause more hurt. I would go through hell and high water to support my partner and just weather the side effects on my own health. At a very dangerous level it is true that a "carer" is at great risk of suicide too so keep up the therapy and other things for your own sake. Check the stats - it's pretty frightening.

Sympathy isn't going to help you 100% but be more of a band aid. Your efforts to be there for your partner is a more wholesome way of using your energy, spiritual, emotional and physical realms. In it together kind of thing. Drawing from each other's MUTUAL love and support.

Adios, David.

PS Without your tone, inflexion, phrasing,etc, it's hard to take a whole post in like yours and really understand where you're at. But, I think you're doing really well just to hang in there and have some confidence in sharing your story. If I want to quote I just use the block text. Just means remembering the quote.

How do i deal with it?

Mark_098 — Sat, 01 Jun 2013 04:13:22 GMT

Peachy1,

My Girlfriend and I have been through (and still go through at times) the dreaded no-sexual intimacy thing. I definitely agree that depression is the biggest libido killer. I think it can also be the biggest mood, even personality killer whilst it runs rampant.

When I was using the internet for that, I found that it gave me a kind of escape from my depression that other activities just couldn't give me. Being without work, sitting at home and having no one to share the day (and unfortunately the burden) with can make things pretty hard on a person with depression.

I have found other things to do to alleviate my depression now, but whilst I was using it as a means to feel good in myself (if only for a moment) it did cause my girlfriend immense heartache. She said the same thing, if our sex life was healthy, she wouldn't care nearly as much, but because it had become infrequent (due to my low moods) It took her a long time (around a year) to understand it wasn't because I didn't find her attractive anymore, or that I was bored with her.

You need to know that if he is at all like me (which he sounds like he may be a bit) He is a genuine person who loves you very much. no one who likes to sing to their partner, could ever be the type of person to not truly care about them. I sing to my girlfriend regularly before we go to sleep (and sometimes during the day) thank god I'm not too terrible haha. as it is a way to share emotions/intimacy and it is a great way for me to unburden myself, of the things I may have had, running through my head all day. I also do it because I love singing to her, it's a very personal thing and I feel it's a great way to communicate the love I have for her, and in doing so it relaxes me before bed. It has been a great way to share real intimacy together and keep to connection strong between us, especially given that sex isn't as regular as we both would like. In my relationship, it is a constant battle. Depression vs libido

Employment is a great way for a person to feel good about themselves (and in doing so, battle depression). It is a catch-22 situation because depression can make it feel really hard to feel good enough about one-self to go and face the dreaded interview's, no's etc etc.

You sound like a very supportive girlfriend. Maybe just try not to take his lack of sexual interest as a sign it is in any way because of you or that he doesn't want to. The key to unlocking that door is to try to encourage him to find ways to connect with you and in doing so, then his symptoms of depression will hopefully lift a little and maybe then things will start to happen again. Having said that, even though I rarely look at porn anymore because I'm happier in myself, my libido still gets effected by my depression and yes it sucks that my girlfriend had to miss out a lot of the time due to this, she now knows that it was the depression that did the damage, not the porn.

If you can communicate with him in a way that brings him up onto the same wave-length, instead of him feeling low (even if it's only for a while) hopefully then you will both get what you want, to share the intimacy together. I think It is only a momentary escape from his depression, not you. It was for me.

Forcing your displeasure of not having that kind of intimacy with him will only make him feel misunderstood, that you don't know what he is going through, and in doing so may make him feel worse about it all and make him even less motivated in it because he won't feel the mutual connection two people need to feel to have sex once they are in a long term relationship.

Good luck with everything,

Mark

How do i deal with it?

Peachy1 — Sun, 02 Jun 2013 22:24:24 GMT

Hi Mark,

thanks for your long and in depth reply!

I had to read this post a few times to get my head around some things, but i think i understand a bit more now why my boyfriend has been doing what he has.

Did you look at the porn because you mentally couldnt handle the intimacy with your girlfriend and it was just an easy route? (no pun intended) because i understand if this is why he does it, but the problem is that i dont think he actually understands my feelings about it, he doesnt think he is doing anything wrong he tells me.. but then why does it hide it? and if i say that i know he has looked (im not silly i know these things) then he still hides it?

anyway, not a bit issue.

i try really really hard to be understanding and as you say letting him sing etc is a good way to release emotions and feel intimate with me, and it is nice for me when he is happy and then we can go a week without any arguements and he says that he is motivated etc to get work and then a day later it is like he has completely lost all motivation and is like we never had the conversation.. and then i feel bad if i ask him because he assumes i am nagging him, i cant win - is this normal for someone with depression to be like?

i think he finds it hard with work because he feels as though he cant relate to people and i know what he means, he acts differently even around my family, it is like he gets nervous and has to make awkward conversations.. i feel sorry for him because he tries so hard to please everyone.. i feel like telling him to just relax! and i love him thats all that matters.

Do you think that i just need to be 100% supportive even if it eats me up inside? maybe if i do that he will feel not so pressured. i am not saying im not supportive but little thigns like asking about work etc just dont do it? But then i feel like if i dont say anything he will just procrastinate and think its ok that i am working to feed us both!! its so hard!

Thanks once again for your post, im sorry if i have rambled on and not made much sense my head is spinning constantly! GOOD LUCK TOO and by the way you seem like you have a lovely partnership with your lady!

How do i deal with it?

Peachy1 — Sun, 02 Jun 2013 22:32:46 GMT

Hi David,

As much as i can appreciate your opinion with what is happening in my life, and i can see that you write to many people on here, your name always pops up, you must really enjoy expressing your opinions, i would like to ask you to not reply to any more of my posts.

I dont think you can quite grasp my situation - it seems to me that you are writing from more of a personal experience and you seemed to be quite offended with what i initally wrote and it came through in your response. I actually thought beyond blue was a place where people can express how they feel, without feeling like their being judged. for you to write in your first post 'are you serious' was not a supportive thing to do at all. I then wrote back to you because it found it very rude and then your reply was to say you empathise with my position. i dont think so.

How do i deal with it?

Mark_098 — Mon, 03 Jun 2013 05:28:39 GMT

Hey Peachy1,

I'll try to make this one a little smaller haha. I think everybody is different so I won't assume I know why he does it. I will say that it can become a difficult cycle to get out of, because a persons depression is generally the biggest cause of libido issues.

I'm sure it must be confusing etc to think "well he has libido for the internet, why not me?" Depression takes away for many, the ability to feel understood by others. Why, I don't know, everyone is different. For me it makes me often feel isolated and misunderstood. When I used to us the internet all the time for that, it was I guess a way getting some quick self-gratifying pleasure to make myself feel better. I know you may think, why does he not seek that result with me? It is possibly that maybe he is just stuck in a bad cycle. My girlfriend and I used to look at it together occasionally, and it wasn't a problem then. I guess after a few bad arguments during intimacy, (they had nothing to do with porn) we just stopped looking at it together and looking back, it was at that time that our intimacy pattern started to change and take a dive. At that stage I would look at it for a pick me up and still have the desire and be able to be intimate with her. After time my depression made my libido suffer more and more and our activities lessened more and more.

It was a real hard time. Even after I stopped looking at it because I could see that it had become an unseen addiction, our love life still suffered. During those times we had to really focus on communicating honestly with each other. It's possible he was upset about something that occurred during the intimacy activities, and he has chosen to bottle it up, along side with all his other problems as that is often what depressed people can do.

It started as an escape from depression, but mix it in with some arguments, throw in some bad bedroom sessions (maybe ending in an argument or even just a misunderstanding) and a cycle of internet dependance can easily develop I guess?

Have you ever had arguments during your intimacy? It can do a lot of damage to a person's libido. It's hard to communicate effectively when your depressed. Could he be hiding something he is holding onto because it annoyed him, for fear of hurting you? Just a possible cause, but worth investigating none the less.

Good luck.

P.s he has to believe in himself and then things will change for him. He will only get there with a good support network of family and yourself. If he isn't close with his parents then definitely with you it is most important. He will get tools to deal with his symptoms, with psychologist-specialised treatment. Psychologists have a range of ways of dealing with patients and Cognitive Behavioural Therapy is a great example of their skills. sounds painful but it is a great tool for helping people with depression haha. I am just about to start seeing my psychologist (I've only ever seen him once) so hopefully my depression will lift so I can take all the "no sorry the position has been filled", the "I'm sorry but your skills (or lack of lol) don't meet the position we are trying to fill" etc etc.

I do look for work everyday when I'm not studying. The hard part is not letting it drag you down, the constant disappointment of not actually achieving some work, from the effort put in.

It can be hard to feel a part of "the team" but tell him he's looking at it the wrong way if he wants to get work to make friends. People get work to make money, and it is definitely becoming a dog eat dog world where people will sabotage your experience in a company, just to make you look bad and have you fired for the littlest of things, to further secure themselves there. Or because they are bully/nasty person and there are plenty of those type out there too that band together. I have the same problems sometimes and I'm trying to adopt this new attitude of not trying to make friends. Work is for making money.

Hope this helps Peachy1,

Mark

How do i deal with it?

The_Real_David_Charles — Mon, 03 Jun 2013 09:31:56 GMT

Dear Peachy1,

It is possible to empathise with someone's position whilst maybe not agreeing with them. As for responding a lot - it's been 2 years of response for me and the vast majority say they have been helped. Even the moderators have written several times to mention that, despite my own personal mental health problems, I am a "valued contributor". I've been long term bipolar so it's just my way of giving some insight or offering advice after 26 yrs, 30 admissions and 3 suicide attempts. The only opinions that I ever offer always get disallowed as being too personal.

The moderators control what is posted and what is not. I can respect your request to not post on your thread but unfortunately you cannot control my responses any more than than I can control yours. If you have been hurt by any of my comments then please note that I only have text to go on. No facial experession, intonation, phrase of speaking, etc. But the comment "Are you serious ?" seems to be something I wrote regarding your comment "i love him but i want him to grow up and get through things and be a man.....he needs to fix himself".

It would seem that anyone that disagrees with you is considered unworthy. Yet your own controlling quick fix strategy seems OK. This statement seems totally at odds with what you wrote to Mark: "Do you think I just need to be 100% supportive even if it eats me up inside ?" It's a far cry from several posts earlier when you made the cry that "I just want some sympathy". So maybe my responses, without knowing, have softened your mindset a little which can only be a good thing for your depressed husband.

I'm free to come back and edit all my responses on your thread if that makes you feel any better. But that's really up to me not you. Writing "as much as I appreciate your opinion" and then "i would ask you to not reply" is called "minimalisation". Making something go away by manipulating emotions or merely being high handed. Just playing something down in a psuedo controlling way. If my comments (i.e. Are you serious ?) have hit a nerve and exposed a slightly controlliing manner towards your partners depression then maybe you could work on supporting him more without prejudice. Without accountability.

Otherwise you're guilty of ignoring advice from the very Board that is full of heavily experienced depression sufferers. Advice that has been fully moderated as we all have your best interests at heart. We all empathise. I did not suggest you to make a post on BB. You must have been shocked that a responder didn't totally agree with you, but that's life.

Adios, David.

PS I have another response about porn for a later date. That's if the moderators deem this response suitable. I normally trust their judgement 100%.

How do i deal with it?

Peachy1 — Tue, 04 Jun 2013 06:17:38 GMT

You seemed to of taken my last response to heart there David?

Your right, you do have a choice to respond to someone on here, and yes, it is up to the board, but if someone requests that you stop commenting I would have thought you could respect that.

'It would seem that anyone that disagrees with you is considered unworthy' - not at all, just yours. I am very open to people opinions, I just don’t like the fact that you took what I said to a personal level, not a professional level – you say you have helped many people & give the impression that you are a professional, I believe you but did not agree with your comment, not because I couldn’t take some negative feedback, but because you were arguing/attacking etc.

If it makes you feel better you can edit your responses on my thread, I’m not a child so don't do it for my sake.

Your responses have not softened my mindset actually, Mark is a new member and his advice has helped me realise and now I understand more, and he has had the same experiences as I.

I know nothing about you and you don’t know me either, but I know personally I would never respond the way you did, even if I didn’t agree with things you have said. No offence but I have seen other posts that you have written to members, and no doubt you give some great advice, but there are some that I have seen and to be honest I don’t think you were very tactful with them either.

This isn’t something I want to be doing, arguing with you. I came on here to get some advice and to express what I was going through, and all I have felt is that you were trying to justify yourself to me.

If you want to keep posting that’s fine, but I will not be responding anymore.

How do i deal with it?

Peachy1 — Tue, 04 Jun 2013 06:20:41 GMT

Hi again Mark,

thank you for writing back, i have read what you have said and thank you again for all of your help.

I have a bitter taste in my mouth at the moment with comments made on here, so i am not able to write to you at the minute, but once again great advice, i understand what you are saying and will think about what you have said.

i will write back a longer post in the coming days.

take care

Peachy1

How do i deal with it?

The_Real_David_Charles — Wed, 05 Jun 2013 01:20:40 GMT

Dear Peachy,

Thank you for giving me permission respond. You seem to be mixing up arguement with debate. (Personal responses get filtered by the moderators).

If you look at the research into depression (rather than point out out degrees of tact for any other responses I've helped with) there is a level of neuroscience (i.e. the brain) that has turned up some interesting feedback regarding this area. I am not a professional counselor just a voluntary responder but my wife is studying her 2nd Ph D in Music & the Brain so occasionally I access this research.

So, the recent studies have shown (on a professional not personal level) that the neuron transmitters of a depressed person are responding about half as much as a normal person thus creating what they term "a brain fog". This is the reality that depressives live with. It's not an attack on depressive partners, just reality. This research has cost millions and used a technology able to count brain response. It has even shown that a single thought fires off a million neurons. Imagine that.

We can disagree as to the where's and why's of depression and all that jazz but the bottom line is that someone's responses are blocked. Your depressed husband is not intentionally frustrating his development. He just doesn't have his neurons firing through all the synoptic branches to cope with life at the moment. Put this fact into your earlier comment "I try to talk to him and get him motivated but he is so defense and feel that I am getting nowhere" and there's your reason.

I hope that helps your situation. My situation of having bipolar for 26 years, multiple admissions and 3 attempted suicides was detailed before your last post but for some reason (? control or other) you state "I know nothing about you". It's a curious attempt to minimalise my experiences - a quaint way of saying back to me "Are you serious ?". But if you put this tit for tat aside you'll see that I have tried to respond with whatever useful experience I have. And now the Stanford University, San Francisco, California, USA, research. Check it out.

Adios, David.

PS I respect your right to post so maybe I have a right to respond too. Again, you can only control yourself. Accepting depression is the main thing. I guess I didn't read much acceptance into your husbands' depression in your initial post. Just saying.

How do i deal with it?

The_Real_David_Charles — Wed, 05 Jun 2013 03:46:44 GMT

Dear Mark,

As an alternative to suicide watching porn is a good thing. An avoidance. A buffer. A small step into limbo. You can't kill anyone or yourself whilst watching porn.

Any misdirection will alleviate the struggle with depression. If that misdirection carries outside judgement then, ex the porn viewer, might just bury himself/herself deeper to block further reality.

Adios, David.

How do i deal with it?

The_Real_David_Charles — Wed, 05 Jun 2013 06:08:13 GMT

Dear Peachy,

Forgot to add that there is a difference between constructive feedback and bitter abuse. I believe your post was designed to let "my frustrations out" (5th post in the thread). I'd say you've achieved that.

Although I can't help thinking that when you use phrases like "I would have thought", "If it makes you feel better" or "You were trying to justify yourself to me" these same frustrations could be let out more constructively under the guidance of an anger management course. At least then it would be all about you and then when you help and support your partner things might seem less confrontational and more loving and accepting.

I don't think Beyonblue offer anger management but Relationships Australia do. These would be great skills for any future parenting too. Most parents will tell you that raising kids is pretty frustrating. Yet rewarding. And you can't really tell a kid "to fix himself" [1st post]. Also, mental health can sometimes pre-determine our offspring. Beyondblue once mentioned to me there was a 1 in 7 chance.

Adios, David.

PS Sorry for the split post - had to enjoy some 50th birthday cake with my visiting son. Yum. Sorry, where was I ? I think I had too much sugar. Pass the coke !

How do i deal with it?

Peachy1 — Wed, 05 Jun 2013 06:19:52 GMT

You have too much time on your hands...just saying

How do i deal with it?

The_Real_David_Charles — Wed, 05 Jun 2013 22:12:43 GMT

Dear Mark,

I was going through (on piano) an old song (1956) with my wife (on vox) yesterday - WHEN SUNNY GETS BLUE. ("When sunny gets blue her eyes get gray and cloudy, Then the rain begins to fall, etc") and there's a great jazz chord in it called a C 7 #9. Basically, it's about the only chord that can have both a major 3rd (happy) and a minor 3rd (sad). When you voice them correctly it gives a really lush and earthy sound without actually sounding harsh or clashy even though the major and minor 3rds are but a semitone away / incredibly harsh when close together.

Made me think about the intimacy / porn discussion you put forward (and it's resolution lyric was "Hurry new love, hurry here, to kiss away each lonely tear, and hold her near, when Sunny gets blue"). You're resolution was "It can be hard to be part of the team".

Thought it might interest you.

Adios, David.

How do i deal with it?

The_Real_David_Charles — Wed, 05 Jun 2013 22:26:56 GMT

Dear Peachy,

My final 10 cents:

(1) Stanford University are bequested $4 Billion Dollars a year for their innovative, progressive research. Probably worth taking seriously.

(2) Medication for mental health can cause all sorts of problems when taken long term. This includes damage to the kidney, liver, increasing weight, dry mouth, etc. So, in most cases, someone suffering from mental health issues would have LESS time on their hands. And the body absorbs these drugs better and better as you get older so the dosage has to be increased, sometimes to an almost toxic level. These are very real problems when sometimes going to a GP isn't actually going to improve things.

An understanding (part of the "team") attitude to relationships is generally thought to be the key to assisting someone through dark times. Better than meds.

I am currently doing therapy so that my bipolar is less "autistic" in nature, i.e. that I can accept stuff. But I can totally see why being rejected for porn would leave you a bit raw and wanting to lash out at something/someone. There seems to be a law of opposites - the more you want intimacy, the more someone backs away. The more you desire a partner to be healthy, the more their illness holds them back. It's a perspective thing, which takes time. Based on the liver/kidney dysfunction that I am suffering, in this case, you do have more time than me. Just saying.

Adios, David.

How do i deal with it?

Peachy1 — Thu, 06 Jun 2013 00:23:57 GMT

Hi Mark, Sorry for the late response. I made an appointment with my partner to see a psychologist and i asked if he wants to go together and he said yes, so thats good right? I am unsure as to whether i should be talking at all in the appointment or just let him talk? unless of course he wants met to? Bit daunting really to go with him, only because of the unknown you know.

In answer to your question, he is close to his mum, his dad passed away a few years ago but yeh him and his mum are very close. Thats once of the reasons we met, we both had lost our dad around the same time so that sort of lit the spark between us, because automatically we had something in common (not a happy thing but at least something)

.. with the work friends etc - its a shame that these days you cant make friends at work, at least not to start with.. you cant trust people. Hopefully once he does get work that he enjoys and then eventually can actually be friends with people there after a period of time (i hope so)

anyways thanks