topic It's like looking from the outside in and it is not you in Depression

It's like looking from the outside in and it is not you

NellieJ — Wed, 04 Jun 2014 12:02:03 GMT

I've been on and off this site that many times.Scared and nervous about what to say, here goes. There are times when I feel happy, but there is an enormous amount of times that I just don't feel right. I can't concentrate on things, feel restless a lot of the time, burst into tears at the slightest, and not know why. I think not knowing why I have these feelings is the thing that worries me the most. Which just makes me feel even worse. Sometimes when I have been sitting with friends, everyone is laughing and having a good time. I get the feeling of isolation. I then put on a front that I'm enjoying what is going on. It's like looking from the outside in and it is not you. It's like being on a roller coaster. I can exude confidence really well and hide the way I feel, but inside my stomach in churning. My father died back in 1995 and I have just neverI really felt the same. Here I am yet again looking for reasons/excuses for the way I feel. I'm unsure of myself nearly all the time. I go through mood changes where I get this strong "not a problem" "whats the worst that can happen" attitude, a sort of high, then I go downhill fast and the wave of uncertainty comes back full on. I more times than not have a feeling of unsettled nerves. Small things that most people seem to just handle, set me off, making me so stressed that I cant eat, sleep and break out into cold sweats. I'm scared for some reason of going to a GP, fear of what to say. Any advise or help would be greatly appreciated.

It's like looking from the outside in and it is not you

geoff — Wed, 04 Jun 2014 15:38:05 GMT

dear Nellie, thanks for posting your comment I know you were apprehensive but well done for doing so.

There's no doubt that you are in the mist of having depression, oh I do remember crying at the drop of a hat, and even if I run out of antidepressants and miss a couple of days, then I still do the same, it's awful.

Why don't you write a note to your GP and just 'that I cry at anything', he/she will automatically know that you have depression, and when they ask you, then you will break out in tears, you don't have to do any more, because they will give you a script for antidepressants, and either set up a medicare plan or perhaps wait until they see how the AD is working first.

Unfortunately what's going to happen is that you will withdraw from your friends, because that's what all people who have this illness always do, it's not your fault, so please don't blame yourself.

I hope that you can come back to us so that slowly you can explain your situation, it's OK none of us will criticise you, there's only support and help here. L Geoff. x

It's like looking from the outside in and it is not you

MrsCam — Wed, 04 Jun 2014 20:10:04 GMT

nothing at all is "wrong with you"... sounds to me like a classic case of depression in which case a chat with your gp should be your first step.. can I ask why are you scared of talking with him/her?? do you think he/she may judge you?? if so, its time to find a new gp. judgememnt is not what you need right now... a prescription for antidepressant meds might be a good start. it can take a few trials & errors to find which med & dosage is best for you so again a gp you can openly talk to is key... goodluck

It's like looking from the outside in and it is not you

NellieJ — Thu, 05 Jun 2014 09:35:26 GMT

I suppose I have been told a few times by people "you'll be alright, just keep yourself busy and get on with it" which makes you feel like you must be just whinging. I guess that's why I have been struggling to at least post on this forum or seek help from a GP. About 10 years ago I went into a hole and my husband saw a side of me that I had been trying to hide. Not too sure why I try to hide it, I don't want to appear weak. A hole where I just couldn't get myself up out of. I would spend ages in tears cutting up vegetables into small cubes, just to take my mind off everything else. He got so worried that he called my mother, who lives over 3 hours away and asked her to come up and stay with us. Even with all this happening, when my mum arrived, I put on such a show that appeared to her that I wasn't as bad as things appeared. Yet again trying to hide. Throwing myself into cooking meals and doing the normal things. I live in a small country town where everyone knows your business. We have a small business of our own where you have to deal with the general public daily, which I love and can do extremely well, but sometimes find I can't handle. Someone comes through the door and my nerves go into overdrive. I again don't know why. I can do the job extremely well, but churn the whole time. I have driven to the nearest regional town and parked out the front of a Gps office but told myself that I was just being ridiculous and that I would probably be told that it was all in my imagination, and drove home. I have days when I am on top of the world and that's when I say to myself that there's nothing wrong. We struggle to get a GP that stays long enough so that you can get comfortable with. We had 10 days holiday just getting back a week or so ago. I look at the time we were away and I enjoyed it however on the night prior to us departing, I'm sitting on the couch in tears, instead of being excited. I know I have to make a move and go and see someone, but it just makes me feel even more useless that my life has come to this and why. I am babbling on and I am so sorry. But putting it in writing and having someone I don't know out there who cares is comforting.

It's like looking from the outside in and it is not you

MrsCam — Thu, 05 Jun 2014 11:37:28 GMT

Dont apologize for "babbling". Thats what online forums are all about, posting whatever is on your mind where no one is judging, just supporting....

I know just what you mean about people commenting "youll be alright, just keep busy and get on with it" its right up there with "what have you got to be depressed about?? Your life isnt so bad" in the list of top things a person suffering depression least needs to hear... sounds like your hubby has acknowledged that you do need help of some kind so thatis a plus... I know just what you mean bout getting and keeping good gps in a small town but hopefully you can find one worth talking to.... good luck

It's like looking from the outside in and it is not you

geoff — Thu, 05 Jun 2014 14:59:35 GMT

dear Nellie, mothers seem to have 4 eyes and will be able to pick up everything on the way you behave at home, they're been around the world so many times they don't miss a trick .lol

Did I hear you say 'weak', never and anybody who is suffering from depression is never ever that, so please refrain from saying that term, naughty, naughty. lol

Dealing with people in your business does make you put the mask on, and yes inside of your stomach it is churning away, and I can relate to this extremely well, by having my own business, where I used to sit in my van and pretend to do something before I took deep breathes before I knocked on their door.

By the way I love the photo of your kitten, sorry just a side-track, however we know and you really know that you have to see a GP and I wonder how far you are away from a largish town, because the longer you leave it the worse you will get. L Geoff. x

It's like looking from the outside in and it is not you

NellieJ — Thu, 05 Jun 2014 23:09:35 GMT

I know I have to see a GP but how do you approach it. You sit down, they say what brings you here today and you then burst into tears or just don't know how to say it. What then?? Embarrassment.

It's like looking from the outside in and it is not you

geoff — Fri, 06 Jun 2014 01:01:34 GMT

dear Nellie, if for some reason you do burst into tears and 99% sure that you will, that's alright don't be afraid in doing so, haven't we all and you want to see a gentle giant, that's me cry, and please remember you're depressed, and that's first priority, your health.

Doctors instantly know how you are feeling, they can tell by your eyes, and don't let me scare you away from saying this, but he/she will basically ask you how long you have felt like this, and the session will continue, it will go on quietly, they will look after you.

This is the time when you need some nuturing with them and with us. L Geoff. x

It's like looking from the outside in and it is not you

NellieJ — Wed, 03 Sep 2014 04:24:38 GMT

Have finally seeked help. Went to the doctor suffering from a very bad case of the Flu and after telling me that there was nothing he could do about that, I burst into tears as predicted and after a long talk he has now put me on a Mental Health Plan. Have seen the psychologist twice now, The first question she asked me was "Did I know why I was feeling the way I was. I just burst into tears and said "I dont know.".. So how is she ever going to help, if I don't know. She has started cognitive therapy. Only problem at the moment is that the list of "I cans" after writing a list of "I cant's" is quite extensive and the possibility of achieving them is about zero at the moment. Last week she touched on a few things that might be the problem so hopefully in a while we can figure out what is causing all these feelings. Mind you some days I feel as if nothing is a wrong or a worry. (That high before the plummeting low, which I know will return). I still feel all at sea with regards to everything about this. I am struggling still trying to accept that there is something wrong with me, even though I know there is. I guess I cant see an end to any of this in the near future, which scares me. Post traumatic stress has been mentioned, but I cant figure out where or how that could possibly be coming from. The psychologist has just said that this is something we'll address down the track. I suppose I am just worrying or possibly just impatient looking for a quick fix. I feel as if my life is very up in the air and I'm finding it hard to concentrate on just the basic things. Got the cant be bothered's big time. I'm still not sleeping properly and all I want to do most of the time is run away from everything and everyone.

It's like looking from the outside in and it is not you

laura86 — Wed, 03 Sep 2014 04:50:50 GMT

Dear Nellie,

I can relate to so much of what you've said. I too don't like to go to doctors about my depression and anxiety because really I don't know them and I don't generally talk openly to strangers about my problems! Also not all doctors are as helpful as others so I get where you are coming from. I also find my automatic reaction when talking to strangers or people I don't know well is to act like I'm fine. I don't want to fall apart in front of someone I hardly know! I embarrass really easily.

I too burst into tears over what seems like nothing. I often have to run into a nearby bathroom to hide. I always tell people I'm just too sensitive but I don't really know what the reason is. I think some of the most seemingly confident people in the world suffer from horrible depression, anxiety, OCD, BP and other mental health issues. So many actors and comedians who you would think are completely happy and confident are dying inside. It's more common than we realise.

There is often no "good" reason for feeling depressed- it just comes over us like a black cloud. People will tell us it'll all be fine and to keep busy (we've all heard that before!) because they don't know how it feels to be crippled the way that we are. And because of this we cover up how we feel, we pretend that we are fine because it's easier for other people. Well you don't need to pretend on here- we all know how it feels and can help you through it.

Keep posting and we'll work it out together : )

Laura

It's like looking from the outside in and it is not you

White_Rose — Wed, 03 Sep 2014 11:24:05 GMT

Dear Nellie

Hello and glad to have you on board. I have just read this thread. Your description of yourself and your symptoms are so classically depression. I imagine everyone has been nodding their heads as they read your posts. Been there, done that, got the T shirt. Don't mean to be flippant, I'm actually trying to reassure you. You are normal, just going through a bad time. Yes, some folk appear to manage better than you when they have problems. It could also be that they are hiding behind a mask, just like you, and inside they are deeply unhappy and wondering how you cope so well.

The reality is that we all react in different ways. Sounds trite to say this I know, but it's true. So stop beating yourself up over something you did not inflict on yourself, scares the living daylights out of you and which other people do not understand.

We all know and understand how and why you feel as you do. We are the experts so believe in us. We are in the same boat and we will help you to learn to row. My word, what a lot of cliches I have used. Not usually my style but never mind. I hope you get the picture.

When your psych asked if you knew why you were feeling that way I'm sure she did not expect a literal answer. As you say, that's her job. I would think she was asking if you could think of anything of significance that had happened in your life recently. Sometimes we can pinpoint some happening that has made us upset. It's usually not the whole story but it's a start. If you cannot think of anything it is still OK.

You need to feel comfortable with the psych and talking in a more general manner can start the process. I would be more concerned if she started doing CBT the minute you walked into the room.

Please try to remind yourself that there is nothing wrong with you in a bad sense. You are unwell and have an illness, just like having the 'flu. Unfortunately it takes longer to get well when you are depressed. And it does take time. That has been my big problem. A huge lack of patience. Baby steps, my daughter tells me, and although I want to run, baby steps it has to be. You run the risk of missing some vital steps in the wellness process by rushing ahead. So just like a baby learning to walk, try hard but expect to fall over. Then pick yourself up and go again.

Imagine us all on the sidelines cheering you on and saying "There's a clever girl". And then we give you a huge virtual hug.

Keep posting as I would love to know how you go on.

LING

It's like looking from the outside in and it is not you

NellieJ — Wed, 17 Sep 2014 12:26:29 GMT

Therapist started cognitive behaviour therapy. I don't understand this very well and it makes me feel as if when she asks me a question and I don't understand, that I'm an idiot. I write down the "I can't and what if" list and then proceed to write out my corresponding "I can" list. My problem is I can logically write all the "I can" beliefs on paper, but as for actually believing them and putting those beliefs into practice, well that's a whole other story. I actually consciously believe that I can do and confront specific things, but I just cannot carry these beliefs off. It scares me to the core. She has asked me what is it that scares me so much about confronting certain things or people, and it always comes back to the same thing which has been my whole life, always worrying about hurting other peoples feelings or backing down because of confrontations. She says that I am letting people do this to me. Which I know is true, but I just can't seem to physically stop this. She says that I must start telling myself and believing that I have the right to choose who I like and dislike, I have the right to have a different opinion than someone else, I have the right to not be friends with someone. I tried to put some of these practices into action with a person recently who has given me nothing but grief and I found myself worried more about HER feelings more than my own. I was then the one that ended up a real mess for the next couple of days. My heart starts to race, I well up with tears, just like now, as I am writing this. My neck and heart muscles are so tight it hurts. I haven't slept well for what seems like an eternity and always seem to wake up with the feeling of nervous tension which I have no idea why. The therapist asks me what makes me feel this way. If I knew I could at least pin it down to a reason, but I lay there trying to go back and work out what my mind is thinking about. I am so frustrated which just seems to make it worse

It's like looking from the outside in and it is not you

geoff — Wed, 17 Sep 2014 16:20:49 GMT

dear Nellie, this post is good and you know why because it's pretty well what happens to the majority of us, so we can call this chapter 2, because chapter 1 was all the anxiety building up to make an appointment.

I want to thank LING for her excellent reply back to you.

Let's try and sort out how you feel, we all go to our first session to see a strange person, but remember this person is trained and qualified to help us, why, because we are deeply depressed, and do we know why, normally no, however it could be by the loss of someone very close or related to us, so when they ask you 'what's concerning you, well first of all you're stunned and your mind feels as though it's being broken up into a million small pieces, so you become perplexed, but don't worry because the psych will know that this may happen, it's happened so many times over his/her time in counselling, so they just plod away asking you questions

So your trying to think of one reason, but is it only one, because one problem leads to another and then they all jump on board and you ask why, well can I give you an example which is an allegory.

If someone can't work out how to tie their shoes laces, they fall over and with that they their then tear their pants and then cut their head, but have a fear of stitches, so the same process happens with our depression.

I know that it's difficult not to think about what is making us depressed, but when you get stuck on one problem means that you can't expand your mind as to what else is troubling you.L Geoff. x

It's like looking from the outside in and it is not you

White_Rose — Thu, 18 Sep 2014 06:25:31 GMT

Dear Nellie

I used to feel exactly the same way about CBT. I was going to a psychiatrist then and he had sheets of paper with all sorts of headings and I had not a clue what I was supposed to do or say. He was hopeless at explanations.

Times passes and many years later I find myself back in the depression and receiving the services of a psychologist. He suggested CBT and I freaked. Not again! All that anguish because I could not understand the process, didn't believe it would work, whatever 'it' was. So I would not do it. Fortunately for me the psych persevered and I agreed to try.

Well, what a difference. The simplest of explanations and no worksheets with incomprehensible headings and an analogy that made sense. Suddenly I understood what it was about and how to do it.

So let me give you his explanation. I have given this to others who have found it useful. Imagine a huge plain filled with grasses. Herds of animals graze patches of grass and each herd sticks to its own area. Every night your herd wanders along the path it has trodden down to get to the water. And every night the lions lie in wait for the herd because they know the path the herd will take.

Now imagine your brain as the grassland and your thoughts as the herd. You wander down the same old path, thinking the same negative thoughts and every night the thought lions are waiting to pounce, to rip and tear at you.

To fool them you must take a different path. This is what CBT is about, learning to change your usual or 'normal' thoughts. e.g. if I do this then the end result will be xyz. If I change the way I think the end result could be different. If I work out what I want the end result to be I need to change my usual pattern of thinking and go down a different path, even if it means trampling a new path through the untrodden grass. What other ways of thinking about a particular event can I imagine? Your psych should be able to help you here.

The lions no longer have their prey, you start to manage without the scars and find a more realistic way to live your life.

I do hope this makes sense to you. It will take time and effort, but as they say in the ads, it will happen.

Let us know how you go.

LING

It's like looking from the outside in and it is not you

BeeGee — Thu, 18 Sep 2014 07:56:40 GMT

LING has brought up a really good point there, and that is that she went to one psychologist she didn't click with, then went to someone different who made all the difference in treatment even though they were using the same approach.

By all means persevere with your psych for a while, but if you feel like you just aren't making progress it may be that you need someone different. It's not that there's anything fundamentally wrong with either you or her that is not making it work - she is after all just a person, and sometimes we simply don't connect well with some people. Sounds like you're in a fairly small place so I don't know if there are many alternatives - maybe going to the next big town might be needed? I don't know, but please don't assume that if things don't progress that it's your fault. There are always alternatives, just like with antidepressants. Often we have to try a few different ones before finding one that works for us.

It's like looking from the outside in and it is not you

NellieJ — Sat, 25 Oct 2014 03:36:08 GMT

Well it's 7 sessions down the track and over the last 3 weeks I have had some huge stressful things happen in my life, which I believed that I had handled extremely well considering my capacity to actually handle anything lately has been non existent. I went for a session on Thursday, I hadn't been to see the therapist for nearly a month as she had been away and times just didn't line up. I'd been doing the exercises in relaxation, I'd been doing the exercises in finding the strength to confront certain thoughts and generally feeling pretty proud of myself for not ending up in a screaming heap like I had been. I had been sleeping better as well. Well that all changed during the session. She asked me how I had been going. I was talking to her about what I had, or thought I had achieved. We got onto a couple of other subjects and I found myself back in tears. She asked me if I had been putting into practice the cognitive questions that I had to ask myself. You know "is it the truth, is it helpful, where is my evidence that it's not true or helpful and then on the positive side what is the "I can". I said to her that over the last week I had had quite a few stressful thoughts, but had maybe not sat down and written them on the left side of a piece of paper and then written down the "I can" on the right hand side. But I had at the time taken a deep breath, taken a step back, asked myself the questions and achieved what I thought was a pretty good outcome. Well obviously this wasn't the way and I was told that I needed to apply myself more. I felt like I was being told off. Well it hit such a nerve that I was a mess for the rest of the day and into Friday. I felt like everything that I had felt good about achieving had been dismissed. When I first started going to this lady I was all at sea, didn't know if I could find the confidence to talk to her, but after a few visits that all disappeared and I was opening up and getting a number of my problems out. She touched on a big problem in one of the sessions and we had a really good talk. I walked out that day thinking, wow, finally I have someone that is going to help me get through this, but now I just feel I'm right back at the start again. A blubbering idiot.I had actually started to believe and put into practice some of the "I cans" that I thought I'd never be able to do.

It's like looking from the outside in and it is not you

NellieJ — Wed, 29 Apr 2015 08:22:11 GMT

I have been seeing a therapist up until 2 months ago. The last time I went, I through I had been doing really good, and I had really started to feel good for he first time in a long time. I had been practicing the cognitive therapy that we had been working through and was starting to become very positive about a number of areas in my life. The only problem is that on the last visit, I basically got told off for NOT following the "program". Well this hurt so bad, I drove around for the rest of the day in such a state, I didn't go home for hours. I spent the whole of that day wondering what I did wrong. I have since been trying to deal with everything, just like before. I have not returned to this therapist. Most of the time I work through each problem that I come across well, I think. But right at this moment I am struggling yet again. I am about to go away on a small 2 week break, and I am sitting here in tears. It seems to be always the same. I look forward so much to a holiday, then a couple of days out, I go down into the depths. I've tried to adapt the cognitive therapy to this but just can't find a way out as I don't even know the questions to ask... I am more positive about the majority of things in my life at the moment, but still have major difficulties coping with some feelings which I just don't seem to be able to out my finger on. I still end up in tears on a lot of occasions, asking myself what is it that is making me feel so sad, and I still do not know.

It's like looking from the outside in and it is not you

bluesea — Wed, 29 Apr 2015 23:06:35 GMT

I too suffer depression and was first diagnosed in 86, but this is the worst and longest I`ve ever had and it`s really got me worried as normally I would have come back up by now and it`s not happening. I am seeing a psychiatrist and psychologist and am on 4 different antipressants and sleepers. try to keep busy, surrounded by a few friends, read, do puzzles but nothing seems to help. I feel lost and not myself which as you can imagine is not a nice place to be.last time I saw the psychiatrist I said I`d rather have a short course of unilateral etc and just go one lot of antidepressants namely the ones I used to be on that didn`t have the nasty side effects. has anyone here had etc and found it helpful

It's like looking from the outside in and it is not you

White_Rose — Fri, 01 May 2015 22:57:01 GMT

Dear Nellie

Welcome back to the forum. I am sorry your psychologist did not work out. It was most unkind of her to suggest you had not been working hard enough. No matter how much or how little you had accomplished you were trying hard and had in fact accomplished something. That is a monumental effort when you consider where you were coming from. It probably good you stopped seeing her.

Have found another psychologist yet? All psychs are not alike and as someone mentioned above, often it is just a personality clash or lack of communication. Please consider going to someone else and trying again. CBT may or may not be the thing that helps you. But there are other ways of helping you along and a good psych will try all sorts of approaches. One size does not fit all.

Being in tears at the start of a holiday is not a good start. I do hope your mood lifts before you go. Do you often feel this way before going on holiday? I am never good at leaving my home for more than one or two days. I get panicky being somewhere new so it takes great effort to go and make myself stay. I do adjust, especially if I am with someone I know. But it's not usually a good look.

So don't try to analyse this. Take a few deep breaths and think of something pleasant.

I hope to hear from you when you return.

Regards

Mary

It's like looking from the outside in and it is not you

NellieJ — Sat, 22 Aug 2015 06:37:03 GMT

Hi Mary, it's taken me a while to even get back to this site. Im 52 starting menopause, feel like it's all just too much and I've had enough. I have a loving husband, however I don't think he copes with me being the way I am, so I put on a great front. I don't want to upset him and make him think that he is a problem because he isn't. I just don't seem to be able to explain to anyone the reason why I feel so sad all the time. As I said in previous posts. I went to a therapist for a while but she asked me why I thought I was feeling the way I am and I couldn't answer, because I really have no idea which scares me even more. I know that there has to be a start somewhere, but If I knew what sets me off on the downward spirals I believe I could possibly deal with it a lot better and let the therapist know. While I went to the therapist I did resolve some issues and feel a lot better about that now, however I'm still down in the pits most of the time. I found it extremely difficult to have to go back to the doctor after a few sessions with a therapist just to get another referral. He would want to know how I am going and get me to fill out these tick the box forms which just made me feel even more inadequate as it seemed that I was on a schedule and it would show that I hadn't progressed at all and was like a failure. I just don't know where to go from here.