topic Re: Done in Depression

Done

sylvwah — Sat, 18 Mar 2023 04:12:47 GMT

I'm done.

I stopped anti-depressants because they made me too fatigued and I still thought constantly of suicide. I no longer believe they can work.

I dropped out of my uni course that I started this year because of anxiety

I cancelled my psychiatrist because at $300 a visit, it's just a pot luck on experimenting with pills and I think they are reckless.

My relationship with my partner feels like a bomb has gone off. I feel like hiding from my partner and newborn baby. I can't look after my older kids l. I'm so tired.

I can no longer be bothered exercising. I left the social groups I'm part of - board games and baby playgroups.

I'm done. I don't want to talk to family or friends or do anything. I'm so ashamed of who I am.

After 4 years of psychology and two attempts at anti-depressants everything is so much worse and everything I've been striving for has been a waste of time. I don't think there is anything next.

Dear sylvwah We’re really glad you could come to the foru...

Sophie_M — Sat, 18 Mar 2023 04:34:28 GMT

Dear sylvwah We’re really glad you could come to the forum to share this with our community. We know it isn’t easy to share something like this, but we think it’s a powerful step and we really appreciate your openness and bravery in sharing.

We’ve reached out to you privately to make sure you’re ok. If you want to reach out to our counsellors to talk this through, we’re on 1300 22 4636, and you can reach us online here. There’s also our friends over at the Suicide Call Back service on 1300 659 467, or Lifeline on 13 11 14.

We also really recommend having a look at the Beyond Blue safety planning app. You can read about how it works and where to download it here. You can even call Lifeline and complete it with one of their counsellors over the phone if you'd like.

PLEASE NOTE: If you ever feel unsafe, please call 000 (triple zero), or attend your nearest hospital emergency department for care.

Kind regards,

Sophie M

Re: Done

yggdrasil — Sat, 18 Mar 2023 09:25:08 GMT

Hi Sylvwah,

I'm so glad you posted on here. I completely relate to where you are at. I was also in that place for many many years. It really feels like torture. Torture people tell you you can just therapy your way out of. It's never that simple.

It sounds improving your immediate practical situation is the priority, before even thinking about the psychology stuff. It sounds like the day-to-day has burned you out. Is there any possibility of receiving support/respite on some of the parenting duties? Perhaps from extended family? If the psychiatry is not helping maybe you could use the money for after school child care etc?

I think you've correctly identified aspects of psychology/psychiatry are basically trial and error (pot luck). The are some solid general principles (exercise, gratitude, sense of awe, mindfulness etc etc) but how each individual pursues these things can be very different. I found exploring spiritual stuff (for sense of awe, gratitude, community etc) helped me alot. This was a crazy step for me - no one in my family is religious. Lots more to say but out of characters! All the best,

yggdrasil

Re: Done

therising — Sat, 18 Mar 2023 10:24:29 GMT

Hi sylvwah

Wish I was there with you encouraging you to cry your eyes out, scream your lungs out while proclaiming to everyone 'Serve me in the ways where I will actually feel a difference!!!'.

It sounds like you've reached a state of pure exhaustion. Having manged the ins and outs of depression since my late teens (I'm now 52) and being mum to 2 babies who are now 17 and 20 years old, I'd have to say managing depression and being a parent who's doing some of the hardest years in parenting (those early years) are 2 of the most exhausting, demanding and mind altering challenges in life, partly because they contain so many factors.

Managing depression can mean managing what doesn't work while managing the soul destroying quest for the right meds while managing the feelings that come with depression, the torturous self doubt, the truly horrible internal dialogue, the exhausting stress and pressure, the kinds of judgements from others that you could happily do without etc. It is seriously hard work.

Parenting, oh my goodness. It can be brutal, putting it mildly. You can end up finding out why sleep deprivation is used as a legitimate form of torture in some parts of the world. Let's ramp up the self doubt, the brutal internal dialogue and the feelings of failure to 100, amongst of other challenging factors. Don't get me started on the inability to breast feed easily. 'You just need to try harder' are 6 of the most triggering and depressing words a mum can hear at times, believe me.

Truth is you are amazing (you amaze me), you're an incredibly hard worker, you're a deep and sensitive feeler of feelings, you're a raiser of life while also trying to raise yourself through and beyond all the challenges you face. If energy is what it takes to feel a connection to life, it can be so hard to feel that connection when the energy's not there.

Discussing with your GP how to seriously treat pure exhaustion while also getting some blood tests done could be a new avenue. None of that 'Oh, it's just a part of life' garbage, when it comes to such a seriously depressing lack of energy. Through personal experience, I've learned depression can have a mountain of triggers all happening at once.

Re: Done

HelloGail — Sat, 18 Mar 2023 22:23:10 GMT

Hello sylvwah

You sound like an intelligent person it's great you have reached out here. Please login here to BeyondBlue as it is a great backup and so is Lifeline. My advice is to avoid sugary and fatty foods; eat plenty of nuts, sunflower seeds work really well for me and spinach of course fruit and veg. For me, to keep up my mental strength comes down to what I am eating so ensure not to neglect your health. Hope to see you check back in here.💚

Re: Done

HelloGail — Sat, 18 Mar 2023 22:46:01 GMT

Hello sylvwah

If it's okay to mention here, if you are able to listen to any Podcasts, I recommend Jessica Rowe, The Jess Rowe Talk Show it is titled. Thank you.

Re: Done

Beth_123 — Sun, 19 Mar 2023 20:49:23 GMT

Dear Sylvwah,

I'm so sorry to hear about the struggles you're facing right now. It sounds like you're feeling completely overwhelmed and exhausted with everything in your life. Please know that you're not alone and there is hope for feeling better.

It's understandable that you stopped taking antidepressants if they were making you feel fatigued and suicidal. However, it's important to understand that there are many different types of medications and doses that can be tailored to your specific needs. I would encourage you to talk to your doctor about these concerns and explore other options that might work better for you.

It's also understandable that you dropped out of your uni course and left your social groups due to anxiety. However, it's important to find healthy ways to cope and manage your anxiety. This might include therapy, mindfulness techniques, or seeking support from a mental health professional.

Regarding your relationship with your partner and newborn, it's important to communicate with them about how you're feeling and seek support from them. It might also be helpful to involve a couples therapist or a family therapist to work through any challenges and improve communication.

Lastly, please don't feel ashamed of who you are. Depression is a real illness and it's not your fault. It takes time, effort, and patience to heal, but it is possible. You're not a failure and your experiences are valid. Please reach out for help and know that you're not alone in this journey.

Re: Done

sylvwah — Mon, 20 Mar 2023 11:26:09 GMT

Hi yggdrasil,

Thanks for your response

It sounds like the day-to-day has burned you out. Is there any possibility of receiving support/respite on some of the parenting duties? Perhaps from extended family? If the psychiatry is not helping maybe you could use the money for after school child care etc?

Unfortunately we have no family support nearby. I like the idea of getting a baby sitter. It's a little tricky with a newborn and I have a 1 yr old that is very attached. I know it's probably an easy thing to book but things feel harder than maybe they are. I want to say I'll try, but I know I probably won't, despite knowing it would help. I appreciate the suggestion none the less.

I think you've correctly identified aspects of psychology/psychiatry are basically trial and error (pot luck). The are some solid general principles (exercise, gratitude, sense of awe, mindfulness etc etc) but how each individual pursues these things can be very different. I found exploring spiritual stuff (for sense of awe, gratitude, community etc) helped me alot. This was a crazy step for me - no one in my family is religious. Lots more to say but out of characters! All the best,

I think I've explored everything BUT spirituality. I've exercised most of my life for mental health, kept gratitude journals, practiced mindfulness etc Ive been in psychotherapy for years. Some things helped me, but progress has always felt so fleeting. I don't know what I am missing. Why did spirituality help you?

Re: Done

sylvwah — Mon, 20 Mar 2023 11:44:29 GMT

Hi therising,

Thanks for your reply - A friend to scream with sounds therapeutic.

It sounds like you've reached a state of pure exhaustion. Having manged the ins and outs of depression since my late teens (I'm now 52) and being mum to 2 babies who are now 17 and 20 years old, I'd have to say managing depression and being a parent who's doing some of the hardest years in parenting...

I think I reached that state of exhaustion a year or two ago 😞 I was working full time and was massively stressed at work and with a new baby at home too. I actually dropped to part time work with some encouragement from my psychologist and it helped a bit last year. Enough at least to think I'd finally get out of my industry and try something different with some study but that collapsed really quick with another bub under 2 (I have two older as well).

Managing depression can mean managing what doesn't work while managing the soul destroying quest for the right meds while managing the feelings that come with depression, the torturous self doubt, the truly horrible internal dialogue, the exhausting stress and pressure, the kinds of judgements from others that you could happily do without etc. It is seriously hard work.
Parenting, oh my goodness. It can be brutal, putting it mildly. You can end up finding out why sleep deprivation is used as a legitimate form of torture in some parts of the world
....

Yes! You describe it all so well. I was surprised at my own feelings that reading this seemed to help. Maybe there is something in shared experiences and talking about them... I've never discussed depression outside of a therapy relationship and with my partner.

Discussing with your GP how to seriously treat pure exhaustion while also getting some blood tests done could be a new avenue. None of that 'Oh, it's just a part of life' garbage, when it comes to such a seriously depressing lack of energy. Through personal experience, I've learned depression can have a mountain of triggers all happening at once.

I have blood tests regularly for something else and they are ok. Depression does seem to trigger from so many directions though - I feel like I'm playing whack-a-mole sometimes

Re: Done

sylvwah — Mon, 20 Mar 2023 11:49:43 GMT

Thanks HelloGail for the reply and the suggestion on the podcast - I'll check it out!

Re: Done

sylvwah — Mon, 20 Mar 2023 12:16:19 GMT

Hi Dr_Beth,

Thanks for the reply. I did speak to my psychiatrist before coming off the anti-depressant and we discussed tapering off. I did, but the side effect from coming off the drug was shockingly strong - It made me feel such intense anger (and very much out of character) followed by sadness, even worse then before going on the drug. Their response to that was its just a return to depressive symptoms but I found that a bit dismissive. We also talked about trying other drugs and I got a prescription for that, but she mentioned that it can be much harder with this one if you miss a dose or try and come off it (which scares me a LOT). Each time I try these things it does impact my relationships, when I can't cope because of the drug. (going on or coming off)

I have seen mental health professionals and found psychology helpful when I can get regular sessions and support (I have had wonderful psychologists). Justifying the cost as 'I need to do this' is fine for awhile and I've done it for many years but the advice is starting to be repetitive and the main benefit I get now is just to help destabilise if I am particularly low.

Re: Done

therising — Mon, 20 Mar 2023 20:03:58 GMT

Hi sylvwah

Oh my goodness, 4 kids. I salute you. And 2 years within a state of exhaustion. Such a seriously long time to be running on fumes.

If it's of any help...I recall November last year when I reached the conclusion something had to change. I just couldn't keep managing the panic attacks that felt like mini breakdowns. There were a few scattered throughout the 2nd half of the year, which typically led to me phoning work in tears while profusely apologising for not being able to come in for my shift. Eventually, I made the tough call to take this year off work. While I'd been able to make my way out of periods of depression in the past, while I was working and managing a number of challenges on top of that I was unable to find my way out of the depression I'd found myself in. Again, something had to change. In hindsight I learned 'Every breakdown has a lead up'. What I mean is while we can't necessarily see the dozens upon dozens of things that are testing us in the lead up to finding the peak of our tolerance, it can take just one more challenge to tip the scales before we feel the stressful, depressing and exhausting imbalance.

The lack of inner joy went on to reveal itself full force within a meditation in the 4th of a handful of private yoga sessions I'd decided to try out. Never done yoga before this btw. It was the strangest thing. When the instructor said the words 'I want you to slowly bring the corners of your mouth up into a smile and pull that smile into yourself, deep into yourself' I suddenly burst into tears. I sobbed as she consoled me. There was a deep grief that had come from serving everyone but myself over the years. Laying on my back on a mat with my eyes closed while imagining giving myself happiness (that smile) was overwhelming. What was most revealing...I had forgotten how to bring myself happiness, while working hard to make everyone else happy.

While you work to make your kids happy, your husband happy, your employer happy, friends, family and even the strangers that serve you in shops happy, on top of the bank you pay your mortgage off to etc, how do you bring yourself happiness? Do you remember how to do it?

Re: Done

geoff — Mon, 20 Mar 2023 21:22:13 GMT

Hello sylvwah, thank you so much for posting your comment and please remember you aren't alone with how you are feeling.

Antidepressants aren't a quick fix as it does take some time for them to work, and perhaps the one you were taking may not be suitable to help you, although I'm not a doctor to say.

$300 is a lot of money and understand why you don't see them anymore, but can I suggest that you may have PND, because my wife developed this with our 2nd son and thought exactly as you do, fortunately her mum was living with us and was able to look after our two sons.

Can I ask if you believe that you have PND.

Geoff.

Life Member.

Re: Done

therising — Mon, 27 Mar 2023 07:48:04 GMT

Hi sylvwah

I hope you don't mind me responding to yggdrasil's mention of spirituality. Having managed the ins and outs of depression for a number of decades, I've found certain elements of spirituality to be something I can't live without.

I see mind, body and spirit like being 3 different rabbit holes. You can go down any one of those 3 rabbit holes and find a massive variety of channels or offshoots. At some points the 3 appear completely separate, whereas at other points they'll intersect in some ways.

Take the intersecting points that can help explain emotion. Mentally, emotion can tell us who we are. It's a part of our identity. I experience love, which tells me I'm a lover. When I'm experiencing grief, I'm a griever/someone who's capable of experiencing grief. With emotional sensitivity I'm sensitive, with heartbreak I'm a heartbroken person, with joy I'm joyful, with the ability to give I am a giver and so on. The mind is a processor of all we perceive.

Physically, I'm comprised of emotional energy or energy in motion (emotion). Energy systems include immune system, cardiovascular system, nervous systems, skeletal system etc. Every cell has systems which run on chemical energy/all the chemistry and reactions that make them tick the way they do. The entire human body is packed with energy in motion and fluctuations you can actually feel at times (aka symptoms or side effects).

From a natural, spiritual or soulful perspective, you can sense whether love's present or it's not, whether it's heartfelt or not. You can feel when you've reached boiling point, where you just can't tolerate what you shouldn't be tolerating. You can feel the driving force behind depression, when standing still has to stop, when feeling so completely lost has to change. You can feel when joy tells you you're exactly where you need to be. You can feel inspiration and yourself evolving, just as you can feel the opposite.

When you can say 'I have a mind and I have a body' what part of you is saying 'I have'? It's the part that can go on to say 'With this mind and body, what can I do with them? or 'How can I change this mind of mine and how can I make this body do what it was designed to do?'.

Re: Done

yggdrasil — Thu, 30 Mar 2023 08:41:55 GMT

Yes I was exactly the same - I'd tried everything else and was completely desperate so figured what the heck I'll try this too. I'd read a study that said mental health interventions aimed at helping Aboriginal kids worked better when they also helped connect kids with aspects of their traditional culture. I wondered whether something similar would work for me, so I re-read all the norse and greek myths I read as a kid, and from there it was a small step to one of the mainstream religions.

I'm a scientist in my day job, and was very hostile to religions. I still have many of the same concerns, but I just approach it all ultra pragmatically and ignore the parts I don't like.

I think formal spirituality helped by combining lots of the well evidenced habits (sense of awe, gratitude, mindfulness, community, love etc etc) and delivering them in an efficient way each week. It also helped me strategically switch off the obsessive, over analytical, anxious part of my brain when necessary. It also provided another source of formal counselling. Also I think that there are some low level ideas that sound really stupid written down, but that when combined with organ music and incense etc start to seep into your thought patterns and perspective. Hope that helps 🙂

Re: Done

yggdrasil — Thu, 30 Mar 2023 08:57:51 GMT

Another avenue you might pursue are in person peer-support groups. I attended a depression/anxiety group for many years, then facilitated one myself for many years after that.

I think these can be a great complement (but not substitute) to formal psychology/psychiatry/medicine. Talking is optional in these groups. Lots of people would attend for months just listening before deciding to tell their story.

I think the groups worked because they gave you a room full of people who understood and related to what you were going through on a deep emotional/soul kind of level. All the crazy little quirks - things that were driving you crazy that no one else seemed to get, sometimes including your therapist - these other people would immediately understand. Some could even give you the words/ideas to express them you didn't have before (like with therisings beautiful posts). I think having them be in person, and seeing everyone from CEOs to labourers (like i was at the time) going through the same stuff, helped me feel less like an alien. I learned heaps of creative ways people cope from these groups.

Re: Done

sylvwah — Sun, 16 Apr 2023 10:18:34 GMT

Thanks for the responses and sorry I'm so slow to respond. I tried to reply a few occassions to 'do I remember how to be happy'...and i just couldn't 😞 ... I guess I don't remember

Maybe I have pnd, or maybe not. Certainly I've had depression much over the last decade, but then again I've also had lots of kids. I'm not sure if it makes any difference if it's pnd or not

Re: Done

Just Ken — Mon, 17 Apr 2023 07:07:15 GMT

One problem that I think both some psychiatrists and some GP can have is that they have overly rigid views on dosing. What you need to find is one who will work with you to try and get the dosing right. They should also make sure that you aren't bipolar, because that can make anti-depressants work in not very good ways. You may be able to see a psychiatrist through the hospital system, which will be free. Even if you see a registrar they can be very up to date on modern treatments.