topic Can't be bothered in Depression

Can't be bothered

sparkvark — Sun, 24 Sep 2017 08:42:48 GMT

I lack drive and motivation. I don't know how to TRY anymore. Heating up leftovers feels like too much effort. Washing the dishes even once a week when I run out of clean ones feels like too much effort. Dragging myself through the work week ahead feels like far too much effort. I want a break from everything.

Does it actually get better or do we just distract ourselves from the constant drag?

I don't want to deal with starting the expensive (no one actually charges the medicare rate... more like $80+ on top of it) GP->test->psych appointment train again only to wind up with "keep on keeping on" and 'strategies' that anyone with an internet connection could find.

Can't be bothered

Peppermintbach — Sun, 24 Sep 2017 18:16:29 GMT

Hi Sparkvark,

You sound absolutely exhausted and frustrated. Your experience with the usual treatment route sounds like it has been disappointing so far...

Does it actually get better or do we just distract ourselves from the constant drag?

Ah, the million dollar question.

That is a tough one to answer or maybe you meant it as a rhetorical question...I don't know...I'll offer my opinion anyway.

Naturally, you will get a whole range of responses as I suppose it just depends on who you talk to...

But on a personal note, my subjective 2c is maybe a bit of "A" and a bit of "B" although I suppose the 2 are intertwined e.g. if I get better at distracting myself from the constant drag then I might start feeling a little better, etc.

In a way, I feel distractions can be a bandaid solution in the sense that the core issues don't get resolved. Then again, sometimes distractions can be the very thing that keeps us going too...the irony, right?

Sorry, I realise there's really nothing that I can say that is truly useful or helpful. I just wanted to offer my support and empathy above all else.

Kind thoughts,

Pepper

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Peppermintbach — Sun, 24 Sep 2017 20:59:21 GMT

Hi again,

Random brainwave, and I could be way off the mark, but I figured that it wouldn't hurt to share...

I wonder if maybe part of your struggle is that you're searching for/wanting more meaning- personal life meaning, philosophical meaning, something "more", etc- in which case most distractions and even most traditional treatments probably wouldn't be very helpful (if this is the case).

I mean, I'm not saying that this necessarily applies to you but it's just a thought...

All the best,

Pepper

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Anton_ — Mon, 25 Sep 2017 04:25:01 GMT

Hi Sparkvark,

Thank you for the message, you've got a tough question there.

What I understand from your short post is that you are having a spiritual crisis. You feel disconnected and you are searching for meaning and purpose.The answer you are seeking for is within you. Actually it is YOU. You can change all that by just exploring more of who you are. I know, it sounds very theoritical.

I had this response ten years ago when I was in similar situation, with same question and no answer. Then suddenly everything changed. I changed it. Now when I look back I'm really grateful for my experience and everything I went through because it led me here, in a new country, working in the mental heath field, sharing my story, knowledge and tools to support others.

So if the approach you mention above does not work for you, the alternative is to look inside of you and answer what has been unanswered for years. Looking for meaning and purpose can actually get you into a different realm. Look for opportunities in what you experience, even the dragging part can be useful for you to explore further and look at it differently. It won't happen overnight you know. Change is a process. It is already happening, it shows its marks on you. How are you going to evolve through this change and take advantage of it? It is saying something to you, it makes you think more, it makes you overwhelmed and it is there to remind you everyday that you need to move on. Try to look past the symptoms and concentrate on what is really happening. You are changing, starting from the inside, you are evolving into someone new. Stop resisting and go with it.

Food for though...

Cheers

Anton

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sparkvark — Mon, 25 Sep 2017 11:43:46 GMT

After posting, it occurred to me that I had made a near-identical thread a year ago. Apparently time flies whether you're having fun or doing nothing.

Pepper and Anton - thanks for your messages. I'm not conscious of wanting a meaning/purpose, although it's true that I also don't have one. Do I need one? Can't one just do cool things and feel achievement/contentment without there needing to be a driving meaning behind it? I don't really want to get all philosophical, spiritual, analytical about it... I just want to be, do, experience. But not be-this, do-this, experience-this.

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Anton_ — Tue, 26 Sep 2017 01:40:42 GMT

Hi Sparkvark,

Thanks for replying back with more food for thought for everyone.

So this is my understanding by reading again both your posts, : In the first post you state that you lack drive and motivation and later you question it "Do I need one?"

Then you ask the philosophical type of question "Does it actually get better or do we just distract ourselves from the constant drag?" but later you state you don't want to get philosophical at all.

I feel there is a contradiction in what you are saying here and this makes me wonder where is this stemming from?

I also noticed that you said that you possibly don't need meaning and purpose however, you have made two identical posts in one year. What is the "purpose" there? What are you looking to find other than "strategies that anyone with an internet connection can find"?

I hope these questions will make you think more on the purpose and meaning of your initial inquiry and possibly help you get a clearer vision of what you want to achieve.

Best wishes

Anton

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Peppermintbach — Tue, 26 Sep 2017 05:21:43 GMT

Hi Sparkvark,

It's great to hear from you again.

I kind of think Anton raised some good questions in his latest post. Perhaps things for you to contemplate (only if you wish to do so of course).

The only thing that I would gently add is if it was "enough" for you to just "experience" things- as you suggested- then I wonder why you are asking those questions and struggling with motivation, etc.

Now, I'm not asking for you to explain to me or anything like that but perhaps this is something for you to think about in your own time (and only if you wish to do so).

I wish you the very best and I hope you find what you need 🙂 If you want to talk some more, you know where to find us..

Kind thoughts,

Pepper

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sparkvark — Tue, 26 Sep 2017 20:10:01 GMT

Hi Anton and Pepper. Thanks again for your posts.
I don’t think I’m being contradictory. I don’t see why a person needs to have an overall purpose/meaning/driving thing that they’re consciously working towards, as a prerequisite to feeling motivation for shorter term activities and accomplishments that they want to do along the way.
If I want to learn a cool song, why should I need an overarching meaning like “I want to connect to people through music”? I just want to learn a cool song without being engulfed by the too-hard-why-bother feeling before I even start. If I want to eat an awesome kebab, I shouldn’t need “I want to fuel my body with the best sustenance so I can be fit, healthy and ready for action” to overcome the too-much-effort-I’ll-just-make-a-mediocre-kebab-with-half-the-ingredients-and-a-quarter-of-the-effort-five-days-after-the-idea issue. There doesn’t need to be an agenda. I just want a damn kebab. If I need to do the dishes so that I’ll have a clean bowl and spoon for my breakfast, I shouldn’t need a mantra of “my home is a reflection of my mind, I shall keep both clean and healthy”. That’s-how-you-get-ants should be reason enough.
But it currently IS a battle for me to do those things. I know the “break it down into smaller steps” and “start first, motivation second” strategies. That’s how I got through the year using (mostly) clean cutlery. I am looking for a way to feel better that is more effective than the ways that I have been able to put into place off my own back. For a way that doesn’t rely on luck or having a ‘good moment’ to do something I want to do . For a way so that trying to do a necessary task during a ‘bad moment’ doesn’t consist of alternatively doing a small part of the task and then lying on the floor until ready to face the next part. That’s what I mean by “the drag”. That’s why I wonder if it gets better. Because this feels barely sustainable at the lowest point of effort, despite knowing that it is sustainable if required.
I admit that there are ways that I have heard of but not attempted off my own back, either due to the perceived sustained effort required, due to not wanting to do them, due to not believing that they would help, or a combination of those factors. Some I would be willing to try but suspect them to not be sustainable. Some of those I would be willing to try only with another person who is invested in the outcome to hold me accountable. Some I still have no interest in.

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blob — Wed, 27 Sep 2017 10:09:34 GMT

Hi sparkvark (fun name!)

I'm new here so I'm still just getting around and distracting myself from my own shit feelings inside by doing some writing to some of you on this site.

I mostly just wanted to compliment you that you're capable of working while you're feeling as you are. I find it gets harder to hold down a job if my inside just doesn't care about anything. I know all about low motivation right now.

Anyway good luck in your journey.

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blondguy — Wed, 27 Sep 2017 10:25:15 GMT

Hey Spark

Good to see you again. I may be wrong (which is often) but I think we have spoken before...anyhoo...

I read you first post above and yes it does get better. My depression/anxiety became that severe I had difficulty leaving the house back in the 1980's when I was in my 20's. It was bad news...I just sat there doing nothing as nothing motivated me in the slightest.

You mentioned expense with counselors....Thats fine as I was flat broke when I needed help and couldnt afford one either. Dont underestimate your doc (GP)....they have much better training nowadays where depression is concerned. I still see mine very 4 weeks for a 'fine tune' so I dont get back to the lows I used to have.

I am fortunate though as my GP bulk bills me after I was made redundant early last year

Sometimes a crackerjack GP can be of greater value than a psychologist Sparky

Good on you for posting gain.....Great to have you back on the air!

My kind thoughts

Paul

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Peppermintbach — Wed, 27 Sep 2017 10:36:21 GMT

Hi Sparkvark,

Thanks for clarifying. I think that I may not have interpreted your earlier posts as you intended.

In a way, I feel as though you have somewhat answered your own question.

I admit that there are ways that I have heard of but not attempted off my own back, either due to the perceived sustained effort required, due to not wanting to do them, due to not believing that they would help, or a combination of those factors. Some I would be willing to try but suspect them to not be sustainable.

I hear the skepticism, concerns about sustained effort, etc but I feel there is little to lose in giving some of those things that you mentioned a go. I mean, the worst case scenario is you'll be proven "right" that your skepticism and hesitation was justified, in which case, you probably won't feel any better (or worse) than now.

But best case scenario, well, you just might find something that could work for you in terms of motivation, etc...

Perhaps something to consider...

I agree with blob that you seem insightful.

All the best,

Pepper

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blob — Sat, 30 Sep 2017 23:46:11 GMT

How are you going now Sparkvark?

Oh to be motivated! It's sunny Sunday and I have Mr Merlin (cat) on my lap as I write. Thank goodness for a bit of life who wants to be close to me! A bit of furry love helps. No need to talk. I like the quiet. Have loads of jobs I could do around the house but I have Zero interest. Plants are dying in places. Pity really but there we are. I have no go or fight left. I feel like I'm in arid desert in my heart. It's weird as there's been times I'm all go. Now it seems that I fill in time. Why can't we have pills for this kind of thing?

Well have a good day folks

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Anton_ — Mon, 02 Oct 2017 00:16:25 GMT

Hi Sparkvark,

You definitely don't need an agenda to do stuff in your life, however it is very natural for an "agenda" to exist. It is how our brain works. You are hungry, you get the signals from your brain and you eat. You see the damn kebab and your trigger the pleasure points through the sense and there you go, you have kebab in your plate. You wash the dishes because if you don't you will get ants etc. So there seems to be a purpose in everything that is happening even though you do not realise it or choose it consciously.

It sounds that you are seeking for an answer that will solve all your problems, get you out of your comfort zone, probably "fix" you.

This resonates with me as I've been through the same battle for a long time. Everything seemed a drag, and no "solution" was good for me. It was too much of an extra burden, a responsibility I didn't want to take. I was just looking for that magic to save me. I refused alternative therapies and activities that my psychiatrist had suggested and I preferred the quick fix which was medication. I admit it worked for some years although I was nit my real self but just functioning. It was later that I had this epiphany moment when I decided to start doing stuff. I realised that I was the only one who could save myself by challenging my beliefs and eventually changing them; and I did. 10 years later I'm thankful for this experience because it made me reach the lowest point in my life and I grew through it, I discovered someone I didn't know; myself.

Back then all these would not make any sense and I couldn't imagine that 10 years later I would use my experience in a different country to support people. So responding to your fist question, yes it does get better....but it needs your personal effort, internal effort. When you are ready you will know it. It really needs readiness for someone to start changing. Good luck, stay strong!

Cheers

Anton

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sparkvark — Fri, 20 Oct 2017 11:06:48 GMT

Hello blob, nice to meet you.
Thanks. Sometimes it’s hard to get to work but I know it’s better that I do, and I’d also feel too anxious to take a sick day, so it is what it is. I hope you’ve managed to find what you’re looking for on here.

Hi Blondguy/Paul.

Yes we have spoken before. Good to hear from you again.
I wouldn’t qualify for financial hardship or anything like that. I’m just a bit of a cheapskate who avoids unnecessary expenses. It’s great to hear that things have managed to get better for you since the 80’s. The ‘fine tune’ system seems like a good idea to keep on top of things.
I spoke to my GP either 2 or 3 years ago about depression/anxiety. He was alright to talk to about it, but I didn’t feel good at all after the conversation. My own prejudice and stigma about it, I guess. It’s just too personal for me to go into those topics. I’m supposed to be strong, and I feel anything but. It feels like something that would be used against me somehow. I don’t know how to talk about it, and if I start then I don’t know what there even is to say.

Hi Pepper,
I guess I’m just looking for some sort if hint that all that effort into a potentially unsustainable thing will be worth something in the end.

Hi Anton,
Honestly, now it seems as though that’s a contradictory set of posts. If every action always has an intrinsic basic meaning or purpose, then why would anyone need to search for meaning? There’s an obvious disconnect between a “big picture” meaning vs. “small picture” meaning. If someone’s struggling to complete “small picture” activities, would you suggest that they need to identify a “big picture”? Or just get better at the “small picture”?
I know it’s not your intention, but I find the suggestion that I’m looking for a magic solution to be rather insulting. The purpose of my post was to ask whether, if I try to do things that might help, there is any hope of improvement. Over the last couple of months, I have felt the closest to readiness for change than I have felt in a long time. It’s not constant, it’s not enduring, it’s not predictable, but it’s within reach under the surface when I manage to briefly escape the net. It’s extremely discouraging that that apparently didn’t come across in my posts.