topic . . . Against Proverbial Walls in Depression

. . . Against Proverbial Walls

Guest_485 — Thu, 29 Jan 2015 10:42:52 GMT

I hate hearing the term, “you have all the strategies, the rest is up to you”. It genuinely feels like a sinking anchor in my gut. Very rarely do I actually reach out for help, and when I do it is such an incredibly difficult thing to do. I want to be like everyone else must be. I want to light a candle and feel relaxed. I want to meditate and feel at peace. I want to get so lost in the movie that I put on, that I forget why I needed to watch it in the first place. In times like these, I wonder why I can’t be like those people. I know everyone is different, but I can run through my entire list and still come up empty. This whole idea of just sitting with how I feel, that never feels okay with me. If something isn’t right, I want to fix it, you know?? Often times, after attempting to gain support or advice from other professionals, I’m left with empty hands. It just reinforces my worst fear – that I’m too different. I’m too difficult, I’m too messed up.

Do you ever experience this?? How do you pull yourself out of slumps when it feels like everything you have tried has failed, and everyone else is stumped too??

. . . Against Proverbial Walls

CrashCoyote — Thu, 29 Jan 2015 11:07:36 GMT

Hi Kaitosaurus,

I have read how you are feeling. Tell me about yourself.

Kind regards, John.

. . . Against Proverbial Walls

Neil_1 — Thu, 29 Jan 2015 22:03:20 GMT

Hi there Kait

You might remember me from earlier posts (damnit, I tried to do the Kent Brockman thing from The Simpson’s, but feel I failed miserably).

Now, I know that we all suffer from our own demons; our own mental illnesses … and no matter if we suffer from just one thing or a whole multitude of things, we are all suffering. But I firmly believe that none of us is too different, no-one is too difficult or too messed up that there can’t be some way, some means of helping and supporting that person.

I know that trying to help, encourage, support and nurture another poster via an internet site does make it difficult at times – because as well as our heartfelt messages, we are limited to the amount of support we can give; but with advice and knowledge gained through our own experiences, we ARE able to provide this. Then it’s up to the person at the other end to be open to taking in these suggestions. It’s a bit like you’ve said; if something isn’t right, you want to fix it – and pretty much everybody on this site I would think has that same opinion. If we come across someone who is broken, then damn right, we get in there and try our best to provide solutions/suggestions to fix that person. I feel like I’m rambling a bit here, but hopefully in a good way.

Just before I send this off, I wanted to comment about you saying: “I want to be like everyone else must be”. Not meaning to be harsh here at all Kait, but we really don’t know what everyone is like – half of them could be doing it tough as well, and the other half might well be “ok”; but then again, just what IS “ok”? Is that living somewhere with a partner, 2.4 children, a dog, a white picket fence and two cars in the garage, yada yada yada. But I have had that before and my answer is: I really don’t want to be like everyone else. Because if I was, I wouldn’t be me. If you were you wouldn’t be you Kait. This is our lives and how we are is how and who we are; and if by some stroke of luck, we can win our battle with our illness, then we’ll still be who we are; but just better! 🙂

Sorry, big ramble there, but do hope I’ve made a smidge of sense.

Neil

. . . Against Proverbial Walls

CrashCoyote — Fri, 30 Jan 2015 12:44:26 GMT

Hi Neil,

I am quite The Simpsons fan. You meant Troy McClure.

Cheers.

. . . Against Proverbial Walls

White_Rose — Sun, 01 Feb 2015 06:33:52 GMT

Hello Kait

I do get your frustration. A psych once told me I wanted a miraculous cure and there wasn't one. Of course I was offended as I considered I had been working hard to get well, just not getting anywhere. As it turns out we were both right. I was working hard but did expect to be 'cured' in some way. I think our expectations can be way off the mark at times.

But on the other hand I also discovered that this psych was not able to help me. We just did not get on and I felt continually frustrated because I had difficulty working out what he meant and he was a shocking communicator.

So I went elsewhere. And this is where everything changed. Someone who could see where I was and how I thought. Yes I still had my old attitudes and expectations, but now I had someone who could adjust his language and explanations and use my life experiences to help me.

Theory and textbook exercises are all very well and I am sure they work in many cases, but not me. I'm not hugely different to others but I have my own quirks. And as Neil says, I wouldn't be me without them.

I refused to reach out because I felt awkward and intrusive. A bit like the horse in Animal Farm "I must work harder". No, I must learn to work smarter and this included trusting others to help, not being afraid to ask.

I've heard that term about the strategies. It's only partly true. Knowing what to do is only part of the story. We need help to put the strategies into practice. It's like saying if you eat less you will lose weight. Granted. So how do you control the need or urge to eat? If we could do it all by willpower it would be terrific and there would be no problem.

Well, I have plenty of can't power. I need to learn the art of willpower and to be given lots of encouragement, and comfort and reassurance when I fall down so that I can get up again.

So have you thought of changing your counselor? (Now there's a miraculous thought) Find someone who is more supportive, not someone who simply 'tells' you.

Hope my comments are useful.

Mary

. . . Against Proverbial Walls

Guest_485 — Wed, 11 Feb 2015 12:37:20 GMT

Sorry for the hiatus.

Things really went downhill over the last few weeks. I don't feel like I have anywhere to turn, due to the aforementioned situation. In no way, shape or form do I think any two people's demons are the same. Just the fervency with which these techniques are REPEATEDLY suggested, I assume they must work for people - otherwise why would they be continuously suggested. So, in times like this, I just don't even bother asking for help. Yes, I have gone for a run. Yes, I have listened to music. No, I don't like lighting candles. Yes, I have watched movies.No, I don't drink. I see no point in doing that dance, so I am on my own.

When I say I want to be like everybody else, I mean the multitude of people those techniques must work for.

My black dog is my shadow. He is always there. Candles and art don't even come close to chasing him away. So for now, I guess we just sit, until I find the strength to get up and keep walking.

. . . Against Proverbial Walls

Yana8216 — Wed, 11 Feb 2015 13:05:18 GMT

Hi Kaitosaurus!

So true, everyone is so different. I've had multiple techniques suggested to me too - who has time for all that stuff? Who can be bothered? I like to think I'm part of an elitist group that are of a higher intelligence and so complex they don't respond to traditional therapies. Hang in there darlin'!

Lana

. . . Against Proverbial Walls

White_Rose — Wed, 11 Feb 2015 18:00:02 GMT

Dear Kait

I am so sorry to hear you have been having a bad time. It is painful and difficult and often tempts us to just give up.

Kait, I have been there for years. I have said, and still say, "You are useless, why don't you get your act together, everyone else gets on with their lives, other people learn to manage why can't you". And so the drivel goes on. I am realising that the problem is not that I can't get well, I just refuse to do the work. And believe me, it's very hard work.

Exercise and enjoyable activities are all very well and can lift our mood. But they are no substitute for active involvement in healing our own problems and changing ourselves.

Lana has asked who has time for all that stuff. Can you afford not to make time however special you are. So to give a very trite example, I broke my kneecap and after spending time in hospital I was sent home to do various exercises to strengthen the muscles and increase mobility. It was hard work, believe me. I live on my own so had no one to help or encourage me and I was severely clinically depressed.

Now I am not trying to blow my own trumpet or moralise. The reality was if I did not do the exercises the bone would still heal but I would have problems walking. So yes I did what I was told. I cried every day and was forced to ask for help to hang out my washing, get groceries, make my bed. things we do without thought and which are in everyone's lives.

To be normal and independent I needed to work on the problem. Depression is no different. We can wear our masks and pretend but the pain and sadness do not just go away. Depression is not fair and why should I be the one to live with this. Well life is not fair and we either give up or manage it.

I hate reaching out to anyone and I constantly beat myself up as I think I am intruding and similar thoughts. And it's probably true at times. Sometimes I feel like child screaming for a toy that belongs to another person. A very ugly picture.

So how do you get out of it? Admit you need help and find a good psychologist who is capable of providing this. If you miss out the first time then try again. Talk candidly to your GP about this. He/she should have a good knowledge of who is considered good in your area and who would be the best match for you. Yes it will be hard so gather up all your courage, take a deep breath and jump in. You have reached out here so you can do this.

More later when (if) you reply. I really want to know how you are going..

Mary

. . . Against Proverbial Walls

Guest_485 — Sat, 14 Feb 2015 08:44:57 GMT

I totally get that analogy. I have had a complete knee recon, but see, the thing with that is that the exact same rehabilitation exercises are given to every person. And they work. I can also see progress, and when it slows, adjust accordingly.

My psychologist and doctor are both perfect for me. But there is only so much they can do. I am as open and honest as I can be, and they do all they can with what I give them.

This is 20 years and counting. But only 6 months with my current support structure. Psych has been away for 3 weeks. Just trying to keep my head above water for now.

. . . Against Proverbial Walls

Neil_1 — Sun, 15 Feb 2015 23:24:00 GMT

Dear Kait

As has been mentioned, it is tiring and tough to be trying all these different things – and frustrating when, for the most part, they don’t appear to work. And that is where another problem happens – what do we do then? A very good question. I’m sorry, I don’t have an answer for this – and you don’t need me to ramble on about all the other stuff that ‘can be done’ to help us.

For me a lot of the time, I simply don’t or can’t do those anyway – because they don’t work, or if they do, they don’t work for that long.

As I wrote in another thread on this site, I haven’t felt fixable for such a long time now and as such, I just put up with how I am. It’s not a good way to be, but if you can accept that this is how it is, then that makes it a bit easier. At the same time, there will be times when things do brighten up from time to time (unexpected things) and it’s a great thing when that happens as it’s something to really savour.

Kind regards

Neil

. . . Against Proverbial Walls

White_Rose — Tue, 17 Feb 2015 23:18:50 GMT

Dear Kait

Sorry to take so long to reply. Computer problems and several days running round like a mad thing.

I hope I did not come across as a nagging person or someone with unreal expectations. If you feel unable to carry out the suggested strategies then your psych should change the strategies. One size does not fit all.The psych I mentioned above wanted me to do CBT so I agreed to try it. As I said he was a shocking communicator and made the whole process of CBT sound bigger than Ben Hur. It was horrendous. I had to fill in forms about what was happening, how I felt, how upset I was and a whole lot more. It lasted a couple of weeks.

He had no alternatives so I struggled on with very little help. Even the topics I wanted to talk about were controlled by him. Not very helpful. The person I have been going to for 18 months had a different approach. He talked neuroplasticity, although not in those words, how to change my thinking and gave me word pictures of the process.

I respond to images, music, and poetry so this approach connected. I suddenly got it. Once you understand what is happening it's easier to take steps to change. Still hard work but with a goal in sight. It truly was wonderful. And best of all I had no need to fill in charts and work out what sort of thought I was having. It didn't matter. The salient point was that this thought process was adding to my depression and keeping me in the darkness. The focus was firmly on the way to change.

And I found I could change. The psych allowed me to email him with my "insights". I often wonder if he laughed at my first attempts. But he would email back and explain when I did not quite get the process going. I had emails telling me how much I had improved from say a month previously and he would point out the differences in my emails. This constant recognition and encouragement meant a huge amount to me and in turn encouraged me to keep going.

I suspect that if the first approach had not worked he would have found another. In fact we talked about this once and he said he used different approaches for each client depending on their needs. So this is why I say one size does not fit all. Can you talk to your psych about strategies and explain that those which have been suggested are difficult to carry out. Even if it means slower progress it is better than none.

I wanted to tell you about ADs but ran well over limit will talk again.

Mary

. . . Against Proverbial Walls

White_Rose — Sat, 21 Feb 2015 03:05:57 GMT

Hello Kait

Just checking to see how you are feeling and that you are still keeping your head up. Has your psych returned yet? It really is difficult when thay take time off. Hope to hear from you soon.

Mary

. . . Against Proverbial Walls

Guest_485 — Tue, 24 Feb 2015 15:15:01 GMT

Things aren't that crash hot at the moment.

She's just arrived back, haven't seen her yet. If a cancellation pops up, I'll consider it. I have to see my doctor tomorrow. I don't want to go at all. I just want to stay in my room.

. . . Against Proverbial Walls

Neil_1 — Tue, 24 Feb 2015 22:31:25 GMT

Hi there Kait

Thanx so much for your latest response.

Getting to see your doctor will hopefully be a very beneficial thing, so I really hope that you can dig deep to be able to get along for that appointment. A thought: is there someone who may be able to take you along? To drive you there and perhaps even wait with you in the waiting room – just so you’ve got some support for you there.

Kind regards

Neil

. . . Against Proverbial Walls

Guest_485 — Wed, 25 Feb 2015 00:17:05 GMT

Nope. I mean there are, but I really don't want to see anyone at the moment. I'm sitting in my car trying to walk inside, but I honestly just want to stay here.

I know it'll be better once I'm in there. She's wonderful. I just wish I'd never agreed to the appointment in the first place. I'm really not in a conversational mood today.

. . . Against Proverbial Walls

Neil_1 — Wed, 25 Feb 2015 01:03:35 GMT

Hi Kait

By the time you receive this, you'll hopefully have gone in for your appointment. It was great to read where you said that you know you'll be better once you get inside. And that your doc is a nice person as well; that's another very good positive to have.

I hope it all went well for you. And if you did this, then be damn proud of yourself; shout yourself a little treat for getting this done. 🙂

Neil

. . . Against Proverbial Walls

Guest_485 — Wed, 25 Feb 2015 03:52:52 GMT

I went. I was late, but she saw me sitting in the car and just waited for me. That was a rough one. I don't understand why she just books me in just to talk. Really didn't have much to say. I'm still working though, so she's not going to ask me to come in until one of my days off next week. I get too tired after appointments like that.

In the meantime, just have to try to eat and sleep. That's all she's asking of me.

. . . Against Proverbial Walls

White_Rose — Wed, 25 Feb 2015 08:39:39 GMT

Dear Kait

I am so proud of you. And particularly pleased you have such a great doctor. "Just" talking is a great thing to do. And your doctor sounds very understanding about your feelings.

Please make an appointment with your psych anyway and if a cancellation turns up take that as well. Even just talking helps. I won't bang on any more. Please know we are here to help, support and encourage you.

Mary