topic New to this - not sure how it can help in Welcome and orientation

New to this - not sure how it can help

Dav — Wed, 25 May 2016 04:23:29 GMT

I'm 64 years old, have a loving wife (hasn't always been easy, but still together after 42 years), 2 loving children and 4 loving grandchildren. What more could an old guy wish for!

I also have a fairly large extended family, some of whom are very supportive, others I have issues with over things from years ago where I have felt deeply hurt. I have never made my feelings known about those things, but can't let it go in my own mind. Have talked to my wife about it, but not the people concerned.

I have suffered from what I consider mild depression on and off over the years. I have always been awkward and nervous in social situations. I can't walk into a room with people and have the confidence to approach anybody to try to start a conversation. I'm usually ok in work situations because I guess it is clearer what is expected of you.

As a consequence I avoid social situations where I might have to talk to people. Even walking down the street in our small community is hell for me and I avoid it as much as possible. I'm sure people think I am rude, arrogant or aloof (all of that?), whereas I'm just extremely shy. We therefore don't really have any friends. We always seem to lose contact with friends we had in the past from a couple of different towns. On the odd occasion we have initiated contact, it hasn't been reciprocated and we assume they didn't really like our company. Guess we are lucky we have family! My wife does have some friends she meets in the social things she is involved in.

My general self esteem is pretty low. As well as all the above, I feel I haven't achieved what some of my peers and siblings have academically. I just feel that I am a very mediocre, boring person. From time to time, this really gets me down and I cease to function properly. I have had counselling in the past, but it never seems to do much. Perhaps I don't take on advice offered to me, but I don't see how I can change from the person I am.

As I have said, I am very lucky to have a loving family. Without them I wouldn't want to be here.

New to this - not sure how it can help

trustlife — Wed, 25 May 2016 05:46:19 GMT

Hey Dav, thanks for your post. I'm only a few years behind you and I too treasure my family and grandchildren. Did you get a chance to discuss your past issues with your counsellor? I suspect a lot of your concerns may stem from bottling all that up. You can discuss them here in complete safe environment.

Nothing wrong in being shy. We're not all meant to walk into a room and take overt it. Where it start to affect your day to day mental health we need to put a few things in place. The closeness and joy you feel in the presence of your grandchildren is probably a key for you. Imagine what your life would be like if you felt the same way around strangers as you do around them. I know you'll agree the only item preventing this is your mindset. So let's change it.

I'd start with enhancing the experience you get when your with your grandchildren. Now, by that I mean to be fully aware of everything you are doing together. Hear the sounds of their laughter, see the bright colours of clothing they are wearing. If you're eating a meal together, really taste the flavours. Why? Because the mind loves deep rich experiences and will often throw them right back at you at the most unexpected times and give you a real inner confidence. When I smell freshly cut grass, I instantly remember a time in Butlins Holiday Camp in 1965 when I was 9. I just remember laughing my head off with my brother. Nothing deep or heavy here, just a simple warm memory. Build these up without any effort (there must be no effort) and watch them gently re-surface when you need them. It's memory training and it's very powerful. Don't take on a big challenge, just watch it grow nice and slowly. Does this make sense? Let me know if it does.

New to this - not sure how it can help

blondguy — Wed, 25 May 2016 09:22:54 GMT

Hello Dav

Welcome to the Beyond Blue community and thankyou for having the courage to post.

Congratulations to both you and your wife on your 42 years firstly!

My father was never really social and we just spent most of our time at home. As a kid I never really thought about it until I was in my 20's and realised that I was somewhat 'uncomfortable' going out and socialising...Now in my 50's I am more than happy to have my own company even though being criticized for doing so.

I think 'trustlife' has made a few good points but as an individual I am just more comfortable staying at home. I have one daughter who is 23 and loves her independence which is fine.

You could never be boring Dav...You have great courage by posting and talking to us. I feel the same as you...as well as the low self esteem. I feel like we dont 'choose' to be this way and I am somewhat 'tired' of people telling me what I should be doing..I just find it a bit much...for me.

I see my therapist regularly and my GP every 2 months for a tune up to help me along even though my background is different to yours...its the same 'self aware' attitude that you have.

I have lived in southern vic since 1969 and I have few friends..(you could count them on one hand)

I have read your post a few times now and you seem like a likeable decent guy who doesnt have any difficulty when it comes to expressing himself

I also feel like I havent achieved what I should have when I look at my peers and what they have....We seem to have a lot in common..

I think by posting on the forums you have excelled as over 70% of the hits we get on here only read the forums...You have had the strength to reach out and post...

I hope I some of this has been of help to you Dav. You have actually helped me out a lot as I feel there is someone out there like myself...and for that I thank you.

You are more than welcome to post back as many times as you wish

My Kind Thoughts

Paul

New to this - not sure how it can help

Dav — Thu, 26 May 2016 02:26:44 GMT

Thank you to trustlife and blondguy for taking the time to reply. I assume this will be seen by both of you.

Firstly, a little bit more background. (This is not easy as this all seems so public, but I guess anonymous). I didn't have a very happy childhood. Nobody's fault, just circumstances around my mother dieing from cancer when I was seven, and the events before and after that. No doubt an extremely difficult time for all concerned. I wasn't abused in any way, so I am lucky compared with people who have had to deal with that. I have also had the opportunity to talk to my siblings about our childhood in recent years, which has been helpful.

At trustlife's urging I should open up further I guess. It may even sound trivial, but I am sitting here choked up thinking about it. My brother (3 years older) was getting married, and I was expecting to be asked to be best man. We had been through a lot together, sharing a bedroom for years etc. Instead, he asked our older brother (9 years my senior). I was very hurt at the time, and have a memory of standing outside the church as a shy 19 year old feeling very alone and isolated. I have never mentioned it to either of my brothers. I suppose they may have had some special bond because of circumstances earlier in our lives. I just felt at the time, and in the 45 years since, that I could have been acknowledged and given some role to play in the celebration.

This is becoming an emotionally draining experience for me. Hopefully that is helpful???

Paul, thanks for your kind words. Yes it does make me feel better too, knowing there are other people who feel like I do. I have often thought that if my wife died or ran off with someone else, that I would be happy to live as a hermit with my just own company. However, that is probably not an option. We have stuck together over the years and supported each other. (She needs support because of a medical condition). She gets frustrated and angry with me for refusing to attend social functions. I would love to be able to do that, but I seem more unable as I get older. I would love to change that for my wife's sake.

trustlife, I assume you mean the happy memories as a general way to help get me out my melancholy? I can see that as a positive, and will work on it. Do you mean that I could use it as a positive with social skills? I'm not sure how I could apply it to that.

By the way, my appearance is uncannily similar to that of trustlife. One major difference...the smile!

New to this - not sure how it can help

White_Rose — Thu, 26 May 2016 03:08:10 GMT

Dear Dav

Hello, nice to meet you and welcome to the forum. We want to read your story in order to offer you the best help, but do not exhaust yourself in the process. We are happy with small bites of information, and eventually you will tell what you want us know. There is nothing that says you must give us chapter and verse about anything.

Like Paul I congratulate you on writing in here. This site is anonymous and safe.

I am sad for you losing your mom when you were so young. I can understand the comfort you received in talking with your siblings about your and their childhoods. I spent much of my time on my last visit to the UK talking to my sister about our childhood. It was interesting because I had not known about some things. My sister was six years older than me, a lot when you are young. It was especially good because I knew I would not see her again as she was losing her fight with cancer.

Trustlife has given you some great ideas and as a grandmother myself I know what he means. We are not all meant to be the life and soul of the party, just imagine the chaos. There are functions I would rather miss and sometimes I do. At other times, when I feel I am going to be overwhelmed, I slip into the room and find myself a seat or corner and play the game of watching the action. How do you feel when your wife is with you at these functions? More confident? If so, ask her to stay nearby until you can relax a little.

Remembering something happy usually makes you smile to yourself and that will attract someone to you. Smiles do that.

I can understand your teenage hurt at not being asked to be your brother's best man. I was upset when my brother's wife-to-be did not ask me to be her bridesmaid. It doesn't upset me now and was probably not a big deal then but I know how events like this can rankle and feel as fresh as the first time it happened. Do you see your brother often? Perhaps you could start reminiscing about the past and bring the conversation round to his wedding. That would give you an opportunity to mention your disappointment. I imagine your bro would be surprised but able to give you the reason. It could be as simple as he felt your were young then and would enjoy the wedding better without being concerned with the duties of the best man.

Mary

New to this - not sure how it can help

trustlife — Thu, 26 May 2016 04:45:52 GMT

Hi Dav, similar appearance! Well there you go.

What if the whole issue with the wedding came down to the priest suggesting the older brother was 'more appropriate' to be the best man and the groom just went along with what he said. They did do that a lot. If it turned out to be the case you would be amazed how hard you have been on yourself over all these years and all for nothing. You would instantly get over it, wouldn't you. The relief would be almost overwhelming. Whatever the reason was all those years ago, you can still get that overwhelming relief. Talk to him about it. I would give you any odds that you'll be delighted you did.

The treasured memories can work in any environment once you build them up. Remember I'm not suggesting running into a crowded room straight away, but in a short space of time, you and your wife can start expanding your network. Tell her about it and watch her eyes light up at the suggestion that you her and 1 friend have a cup of coffee together in your house. You'll probably be getting roast dinners for a week. Don't rush it though. Enjoy each baby step and let it grow.

New to this - not sure how it can help

White_Rose — Sat, 28 May 2016 12:44:28 GMT

Hello Dav

I'm checking to see how you are going. So, how are you going?

Well if you smile for the camera and then post your photo on BB we can compare the two. I bet your smile is at least as good as Trustlife.

I wonder how you would feel about seeing your GP. Just have a chat about how you are feeling these days. As you are a bit shy I suggest printing out this conversation, or your posts, and giving them to the doctor to read. So much easier than talking I find. The GP may also give you a bit of a check up to see if you have any physical complaints that are adding to your feeling of awkwardness. Trustlife's suggestion of one visitor at a time sounds great. One baby step at a time.

Cheers

Mary

New to this - not sure how it can help

Dav — Tue, 31 May 2016 02:32:49 GMT

Hello Mary

Thanks for being so kind to check on me.

It's a bit of one step forward and two back at the moment. Choir practice tonight and I can't bring myself to go. I'm in a male choir and absolutely love the singing and comradery of it when I'm feeling good, but can't bring myself to sing, or to face them all when I'm feeling down.

Just responding to some previous things:

My wife wants me to go to our GP to arrange some counselling, but I'm not being very receptive to that. I don't think I have any physical problems as I have annual check-ups and I'm quite fit. I walk a lot and also ride a pushbike. I am trying this forum at the moment as I don't really feel like opening up to some young counselor.

As for the issue of my brother's wedding, I have thought a lot about it, and I don't think I can bring myself to talk to him about it. We are not especially close these days, and I don't consider him to be very understanding or empathetic. When we are together, the conversation turns to politics, and he thinks I'm a fool because I don't agree with his opinions! Maybe I will try to bring it up with another relative. I have a sister who I am quite close to.

On the positive side, I am trying to have happy thoughts, especially lying awake in the wee small hours. I have been experimenting with weaning myself off an anti-depressant I have been on for a few years. (A very small dosage). It did help with sleeping, and I suppose my general demeanor?? I do want to give that a bit longer to see if I can exist without it.

And trust me, you don't want to see my sad face at the moment.

Kind regards

Dave

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trustlife — Tue, 31 May 2016 03:24:19 GMT

Back home in my own country we have a saying. When someone says it's one step forward and 2 backwards then we suggest they go the other way! Not trying to be glib but I can understand your dilemma. Love the idea of choir practicing, that is a perfect way to lift you out. Have the grandchildren ever heard you singing? For that matter has your brother? Talking to another relative I also like.

Although you suggest you don't have a happy face, I suspect you are making a little more progress than you think. Let me know how you go with the other relative.

New to this - not sure how it can help

White_Rose — Tue, 31 May 2016 07:49:41 GMT

Hello Dave

Thanks for your reply. I had a bit of a smile to myself when I read you were weaning yourself off the antidepressant. I did exactly the same and thought for a while that all was well. Although it only takes a few days for the medication to be cleared out of your system it does take longer for the effect to wear off. So I expect you will feel fine for several weeks.

Being physically well does not mean you have no other problems. Your wife may be right with her suggestion of seeing your doctor, if for no other reason than weaning off your AD under supervision. It's really is not as simple as it sounds. Believe me, I've been there.

I always wanted to sing. I can a bit and do so in the shower where the acoustics are good and make me sound great. There is something invigorating about singing. It makes me feel happy so I put on CDs and sing along with the singer. Surprise your grandchildren one day. I have missed out on functions, as I said before, but I do make the effort most of the time. I have a friend who is going through a horrible time. She sings in a choir which celebrated its 90th anniversary a few weeks ago. Despite her problems, my friend goes to choir practice. It makes her feel happy.

I also love male voice choirs. When I lived in the UK I listened to the Welsh male voice choirs. They were magnificent.

If I am miserable I can rarely change by thinking happy thoughts. I can never remember them. If you are trying to get back to sleep try this suggestion from my GP. Think of a book you know fairly well or a TV story. Lie in a comfortable position and retell the story, chapter by chapter. Have you ever tried meditation? It's really good for calming the mind.

Please keep us up to date with your happenings.

Mary

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Dav — Tue, 31 May 2016 11:45:59 GMT

Just a quick update.

Made myself go to choir practice and had a good old sing. Has given me a bit of a lift. Made sure I got there a little late so I wouldn't have to talk to anyone before singing started, and didn't go to the pub after. Small steps.

Mary, you would love our choir! 70 plus members and very much in the Welsh tradition of male singing. We have been to Wales and sung with a couple of choirs there. Our choir is only 10 years old, so not quite as good as the ones over there...yet! Practiced "Comrades in Arms" tonight. Check out a Welsh choir doing that on Youtube.

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trustlife — Wed, 01 Jun 2016 02:36:09 GMT

Brilliant. Top result Dav.

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blondguy — Wed, 01 Jun 2016 10:32:59 GMT

Hello Dav

Just popping in to see how you are going. Mary made a smart point about coming off the AD's...it can be complex and best done with the support of a GP. I couldnt do that on my own...

I also take a low dosage too...since 1997. My depression is probably mildish...I just look at depression/anxiety as a physical illness..."Diabetes of the Brain" (just my take on it) Similar to you though...my social skills have somewhat vaporised.

Like Mary mentioned...happy thoughts dont really do anything for me either. I have always used 'Gentle Occupation' to change my mindset if I get too low.

Sleep can be difficult to get Dav...Used to be the same here for many years. Its sounds silly because different techniques work for different people but I think of a white square with the word 'blank' in it.....I keep going back to this white square and the word blank....it so so boring I am lucky that something so simple worked..

Nice work on the choir too...I remember doing HMS Pinafore many years ago on stage. Kind Wishes..Paul

New to this - not sure how it can help

White_Rose — Wed, 01 Jun 2016 11:42:53 GMT

Hello Dave

Lots of brownie points for going to choir practice. Singing is such a great occupation for the body, brain and soul. All of them need to be in harmony to make the music work in all three parts. I will look at YouTube and see if I can find a suitable choir.

I see your wife wants you to try counselling. Well I can understand not wanting to open up to a young counsellor, but there are older counsellors also. I am talking to an older counsellor at the moment. I think he is a grandad, if not in reality he is in age. You can always check on the vital statistics of a counsellor before you go to your first session

What does your doctor think about your mental health? It's a shame you have spent so much of your life being nervous around others. As I said, you don't need to be Mr Conviviality, just confident enough to chat casually with others. You still have a lot of living to do.

Comparing family stats, I have four children and eight grandchildren. My eldest granddaughter will be 21 in a few weeks. How's that for making you feel your age? At least there are no great grandchildren in the offing. I used to be quite shy and never knew what to say until I became the secretary of the primary school P&C. Now that was jumping in at the deep end.

Tell us about your next adventure. Swimming/playing bowls/bush walking/darts/ Isn't it great that we have all these opportunities? OK no more this evening. Talk to us soon.

Mary